Netjets Gv Pay

[ghostrider64]

To be very honest and selfish..I hope NJI doesn't unionize. It would not be a favorable action for those of us in 1108. The best possible thing for "US" would be court ordered attachment. Now I don't say this to start a war just to offer my uneducated opinion.

That said what would those at NJI have to lose by Unionizing prior to a court decision? If you already get along with management wouldn't that friendly relationship continue? Or do you think that management might react negatively and dig in to never create real work rules?

Just curious and honest commentary

 

[wolfpackpilot]

To be very honest and selfish..I hope NJI doesn't unionize. It would not be a favorable action for those of us in 1108. The best possible thing for "US" would be court ordered attachment. Now I don't say this to start a war just to offer my uneducated opinion.

I'm almost without words. I cant really slam you because your being honest, but dont you think your attitude is a little tainted? When people read what you said, it clearly makes your comment seem like a "seat grab". While I am not a pro-union pilot, I dont wish anything bad upon NJA pilots, unlike what you've just said.

If your pipe dream is to see the NJI pilots stapled to your list, watch all of us get displaced from the Gulfstream fleet and become FO's to some 25yr old kid who gets hired next year... good luck with that. RTS would be forced to sell NJI. The training costs alone with displacing 300+ pilots and training 300+ replacements would be millions. It'll never happen.

As for NJI pilots unionizing, I dont see it. I understand what RustyFan was getting at, but I doubt we need to unionize at this point. I am very carefully following the political landscape of the NMB, and our government. With a clear precedent being set with the ALPA/TSA loss, I think NetJets Management would win a Single Carrier Petition if it was decided today. And with every passing day, our companies are seperated even more.

I even think (my opinion only) that in the event NJA pilots "fly the contract" as they did last Fall for whatever reason, Warren would take a major loss in the shorts and sell NJA or pull whatever he needs to desolve the company and recreate it with "new" employees. You guys won the battle last year, and got paid what you deserve, period. But I dont think Birkshire Hathaway is willing to play anymore games. It could spell the end for RTS, and possibly NetJets would go through dramatic change, but you guys arent driving the bus that makes the "BIG" decisions.

OK... Flame away :uzi: WOLFPACKPILOT

 

[DO-82 driver]

The training costs alone with displacing 300+ pilots and training 300+ replacements would be millions. It'll never happen.

Wolf...you are absolutely correct, a merger between NJA and NJI resulting in "stapling" NJI guys to the bottom would be a financial disaster for the Company. The training costs would be unreal and it will never happen.

Uncle Warren disbanding NJA with "replacement" pilots is even financially impossoble in that more than 2600 pilots would be needed, in various types of airplanes. How long would that take to accomplish when they can't even handle the training they need to do now.

Everone...NJA, NJI, EJM, NJE and whatever other NJ company there is out there would never survive.

 

[wolfpackpilot]

Uncle Warren disbanding NJA with "replacement" pilots is even financially impossoble in that more than 2600 pilots would be needed, in various types of airplanes. How long would that take to accomplish when they can't even handle the training they need to do now.

Point well made. I dont think it could be pulled off either, not without severe damages to the corporation as it stands now. That being said, my point was to only illustrate there is a limit to how much "game playing" a management is willing to take from its employees, (unionized or not).

I'll let the cat out of the bag a little. I worked for 3 airlines, all under the banner of ALPA. 2 of them no longer exist... period... their gone. The 3rd is in so much trouble I doubt it will survive. I held an elected position at one. We ranted and marched around and wore union pins and lanyards, had catered meals at LEC meetings, blah blah blah. We "thought" we knew what was going on the inside of the Corporation, we were wrong. In the end we gave millions of givebacks for nothing, the companies failed, and too many good people lost jobs and had to start over. Pilots were (and still are) employees who made the wheel turn... thats it. We dont get to say where the wheel goes.

Unions never have and never will:

• Stop Bad Managers from making stupid decisions
• Stop Corporations from trashing their own products
• Make decisions at the Board of Directors level which plot the course of the company

 

[ghostrider64]

Wolf I wasn't saying I wanted a seat grab or a staple. Merely pointing out that if and when a Single Carrier petition was filed, it would be much easier for 1108 to argue that NJI was set up as a non union shop to avoid being asociated with the Teamsters. Now if you were to Unionize wouldn't that agruement be mute?

Personally I wouldn't care where you were integrated into our lists. DOH, superseniority etc...I want you to come over because it is clearly costing more $'s to try and run them seperately. Now one may argue that your work rules are less stringent and as such you need to be seperated. But I would argue that all new aircraft that come to NJA have work rules negotiated for that aircraft. So it's possible Boisture's demand for flexibility could and probably would be maintained. BTW Where is Boisture? Hmmm

FYI I flew the baby Gulfstream yesterday and although it was Israeli built and designed I loved it. Nice to have a big cockpit. But damn there are far too many places for stock and it should have a FA working on it.

 

[old*art]

and the wheel goes round and round ... btw it is "moot" ghostrider .. although mute is not entirely incorrect given its meaning.

 

[YankeeEcho]

The big picture is simple - the laws of economics and supply-and-demand always rule in the end. Why do you think NJI is profitable and NJA is not? Why do you think NJI has so many applicants? Why do you you think NJI folks always have a smile on their faces? It's not that complicated!

 

[wolfpackpilot]

Wolf I wasn't saying I wanted a seat grab or a staple. Merely pointing out that if and when a Single Carrier petition was filed, it would be much easier for 1108 to argue that NJI was set up as a non union shop to avoid being asociated with the Teamsters. Now if you were to Unionize wouldn't that agruement be mute?

Then I apologize for reading it wrong.

As for the 200, I think GA will give it a solid makeover within a few years (make it a 250) and have a product line from the 150-550. I have been on the 200, and it was very roomy indeed.

OldF*rt, we already have a spelling bee teacher on this board... His name is GutShotDraw.

 

[Majik]

NJI was set up as a non union shop to avoid being asociated with the Teamsters.

That's about as simplified an argument for single carrier as one could make.

 

[gutshotdraw]

OldF*rt, we already have a spelling bee teacher on this board... His name is GutShotDraw.

Big Bill,

I gave up on that a long time ago......along with lessons in economics, civics, history. If nothing else, this board is a fabulous example of the state of the American educational system.:bomb:

Saw your post on the big move. Hope it went well. My new house is still cardboard box he11.