Netjets Ain Article

[Flyingdutchman]

Indeed, make no mistake, I won't cross a picket line, but this thread is BS

 

[h25b]

H25B,

You must be crazy. I have tried to read this whole thread. Let me get this right, you think it is okay for you to do NJ sell off trips if we are on strike!

Sir, that will make you a SCAB. It has NOTHING to do with airlines, aviation or anything else. You doing struck work makes you a scab! Hear that loud and clear. You are doing our sell offs. Picking up our scraps. I don't care if you never plan on going to the airlines or working here.
If the local factory was on strike, you would have no problem with crossing to get work!

So go ahead and write your letter to ASAP. It is a waste of your time. I pay them dues, you don't so forget about getting any love.

SCAB, SCAB, SCAB! Get used to that word.
And another thing. Death does not get you removed from a scab list. What do you think you grandchildren will think of you?!?

I rest my case people....

Those dues money well spent??? Your hard earned money is what bought you that air-tight scope that allows the sell-offs in the first place... If anything you should be ticked-off about that. As usual, your type is one battle behind the times.

Could care less about getting any love. Good gravy dude, now were down to debating what the grandkids think??? Another 3 years of your contract negotiations and I can't wait to see where we're at.... Probably my cousin's half-brother twice removed...

I will agree with NetJetsWife on the fact that the cart is way in front of the horse here. As we speak NetJets is hiring in droves, filling your ranks with poor F.O.'s that will be too poor to ever vote for a strike.

Sorry, as some other brainiac stated, these people are just like you. Visionaries, like the guys when FedEx first started. I think G200 sums up my feelings...

cross a Netjet picket line??

WAKE UP---Who the fruck would want to do that?? whats waiting for you?...a Netjet paycheck?!!!

whats that?....Oh, the 36K/yr you guys Captain bizjets for???...

Oh yeah, bring it on boys, lets talk "scabs" .....

.

 

[ultrarunner]

There is also the matter of the strike vote, that has yet to be taken

Yeah, why rush things, the concrack (which is what it is) only became ammendable almost FOUR years ago.

Good grief. Take your freaking strike vote. Sheet or get off the pot as they say.

 

[netjetwife]

The StrongUnion MEC speaks for the NJ pilot group on all matters, IF, WHEN AND HOW TO STRIKE, included. Frankly, I don't think they have the time to read/post on this forum right now--their plates are rather full! Why don't we just wait until we hear what THEY have to say? Until after the mediated sessions have ended? Until after a strike vote has been taken? Until after the RLA decision has been made? Why not have a more productive discussion ? Like----

How high will the percentage of yes votes go

Oops! I didn't get this one posted.....little 4 yr old distraction...you understand.

 

[ultrarunner]

If there is a strike, and that's a big freaking IF. Warren ought to take the opportunity just to see how low he can bring down the bar for corporate pilot compensation...

What the heck, his pay rates are so darn low now....

It would be very intersting to see how many captains accept 22 grand a year..

and how many FO's accept 15 grand a year....

What a heck of an experiment.....

Now THAT would be something to put the names on the list for...

And ya know what...the lines would be long......incredibly long.....

...and how sad is that???

 

[Grizz]

Yeah, why rush things, the concrack (which is what it is) only became ammendable almost FOUR years ago.

Good grief. Take your freaking strike vote. Sheet or get off the pot as they say.

I know we've covered this before, but just for you, ultrarunner, I'll speak slowly and use small words. The ability to call a strike is effectively taken out of the hands of labor under the RLA. The NMB must approve any self-help actions by either the company or the union. Here's a short definition of the RLA off the American Rights at Work page:.

Railway Labor Act of 1926 (RLA):

This law regulates labor relations in the railway and airlines industries, guaranteeing workers in these industries the right to form a union and bargain collectively. The RLA severely controls the timing and right to strike. Also, bargaining units under the RLA are usually nationwide, making it more difficult for workers to form a union.

Trust me, the pilots of NetJets would love nothing more than to be able to call for a strike and make it happen. Unfortunately, we have about a bazillion hoops to jump through first and that's what has taken the past 3 1/2 years.

 

[ultrarunner]

Why don't we just wait until we hear what THEY have to say?

blah blah blah....

blah blah blah....


Because netjetwife, we have absolutely nothing better to do. That's why.

Now, put the rug rat to bed, and give us a post on how your "NEW CAR" shopping is going.

good grief.

 

[Ace-of-the-Base]

Hahahah this is getting real stupid! thanks for the good laugh Fozzy!

400A,

we could send our resume to Wal-Mart! they are hiring greeters right now!! (that is, if we are good looking enough for that job..)

take care my scab brother!

Hey! I'm just a part 91 driver, but maybe now I want to be on that list too. If they put all the hard working 135 guys on it (again, just like American accepting United pax tickets, or any other number of examples of people NOT crossing union lines), it will become a badge of honor. Maybe they're just afraid that you good looking pilots in your brand new G400s with better looking flight attendants will show their 'owners' a better ride

Seriously folks, don't try to scare this group. We aint union, and we're starting to not like your attitude. We're a good, sypathatic group, but if you want a fight...

Ace

 

[Flyingdutchman]

Welcome my part 91 non union brother.. Again, you to are more then welcome to join us 91/135 pilots at Wal-Mart in a few months!

 

[Daveman]

.....

 

[Flyingdutchman]

Dave,

Don't delete your post dude. It was a good one I agree with ya,

 

[Flyingdutchman]

In fact, I bet ya that all 135/91 pilots agree with you

FD

 

[suen1843]

When United, Continental, Eastern, and a few others, had their strikes in the past, I don't think a single pilot for another airline hesitated to walk right past the picket lines on their way to work. And, they were union members. At least they probably made comments like, "hang in there".
How many pt. 91 pilots do you think will honor a frac picket line?

 

[Flyingdutchman]

Forget about this crap man. All I want is too be is the next bachelor on "the bachelor"

 

[CatYaaak]

the following is from asap's web page....

"When NJA pilot salaries are compared to the annual salary survey conducted by the National Business Aviation Association (NBAA), NJA pilots currently earn an average of 50% base salary of other pilots in the United States who fly similar jet aircraft. Under the contract proposal, NJA pilots would have earned only an average of 55% of what other, less productive pilots earn operating the same equipment for other companies. "


Well, the "less productive pilots" part just highlights the broad-based ignorance of corporate aviation that resides within the NetJets pilot ranks. How many corporate pilots get 1/3 to 1/2 a month in "hard" days off? How many live somewhere where they aren't based, and commute on company time at company expense? The list goes on. Far from being "more productive", the frac scheme requires hiring an additional 2 to 3 pilots per airplane to sufficiently crew it. A company operating their own flight department buys a he!! of a lot more from a pilot even just in terms of availablity than what a JetJets pilot produces.

The irony of course is that NBAA average salaries ASAP is comparing itself to are derived from non-union wages at operations, which for the most part (Part 91, anyway), are not engaged in revenue-flying like they are.

This scab talk is hilarious, revealing more ignorance of the world they are comparing themselves to. Like it or not, NetJets sales tactics in the past and the willingness for its oblivious, low-wage crews to poach corporate customers generated a lot of animosity from the Part 91 world. By many, you were considered as close to scabs as you can get in the non-unionized environment of corporate aviation. That's died down quite a bit, but if it's started up again because your union wants to try and throw it's weight around with a "scab list" into operations that aren't their own and pilots who never drank your low-wage Kool-aid, you can only lose. The NBAA list is large, and outside of you, that's where most of the good jobs are. Why turn them into enemies?

People remember this stuff, and if you do plan to move on to another job you might as well have two sets of resume's.....an "airline" resume with your NetJets experience on it, and a "corporate" resume where you omit it completely and pretend you were working at 7-11 instead during that time. As was mentioned by someone else, I can hear the sound of NetJet pilots' resumes hitting a lot of circular files too if you go through with it. More than anything, a corporate flight department hires attitudes.

 

[rice]

With all due respect, gentlemen, they DO have until June 24th to work things out. There is also the matter of the strike vote, that has yet to be taken. A high percentage of yes votes may convince the company that the pilots are standing firm in their JUSTIFIED demands. Seems to me that a "cooling off" period also has to happen first. Aren't you getting just a bit ahead of yourselves?

With all due respect to you NJW, WE (the gentlemen) did not start this. The scab question was asked by Hugh Johnson. Numerous NJA types (Bizjet737, El Chupacabra, etc) responded in the affirmative.
I agree there is much to be worked out and June 24th is a couple months away but a valid question was asked and if you re-read the responses you'll see that it was the NJA types that came off with a bit of hostility. Seems to me that they are in need of a little "cooling off" period when it comes to this discussion, and that they (NJA pilots) have gotten a bit ahead of themselves, throwing out threats of a scab list without the formal and official stance of their MEC.
Again I'll say, we (most 91/135 pilots) support you at ASAP as best we can. If you negotiate a fair and equitable contract it will have an indirectly positive affect across all of business aviation IMO. But to even insinuate that we will be "listed" if we continue to work for OUR EMPLOYER's during a possible NJA work stoppage is ludicrous and will do nothing but create animosity amongst the pilot bretheren.

 

[CL60]

.

Main Entry: scab
Function: noun
1 : a worker who refuses to join a labor union
2 : a union member who refuses to strike or returns to work before a strike has ended
3 : a worker who accepts employment or replaces a union worker during a strike : [size=-1]STRIKE BREAKER[/size]
4 : one who works for less than union wages or on nonunion terms


Main Entry: strike·break·er
Pronunciation: 'strIk-"brA-k&r
Function: noun
: an individual hired to replace a striking worker

 

[h25b]

Main Entry: scab
Function: noun
1 : a worker who refuses to join a labor union
2 : a union member who refuses to strike or returns to work before a strike has ended
3 : a worker who accepts employment or replaces a union worker during a strike : [size=-1]STRIKE BREAKER[/size]
4 : one who works for less than union wages or on nonunion terms


Main Entry: strike·break·er
Pronunciation: 'strIk-"brA-k&r
Function: noun
: an individual hired to replace a striking worker

Thanks for the clarification. This obviously proves my point... But allow me to break it down (ONE MORE TIME)...

1. Never refused to join labor union. (we don't have one, AND DON'T NEED ONE)

2. Not a union member, so this one doesn't apply.

3. I was NOT hired to replace a striking worker either.

4. Are lowest paid guy makes almost 3 times first year NetJets' F.O. Pay.

Sounds like these guy's are full of it to me... Sorry, I'm now out of this fight and it's pay-day..

 

[netjetwife]

Rice, you are assuming that I was making a distinction between the NJ pilots and those from other companies. I was not. My post was addressed to the entire group. In another post on the subject, I pointed out that the SU MEC, speaks for Local 1108 and I respectfully suggested that we hold off on this discussion until we receive their guidance in this matter. Griz, finally... waded in and expounded (on what I had been trying to say) with a calm, balanced look at things. I applauded him on making an excellent post.

I firmly believe there is strength in numbers, and would like too see QOL improvements made for ALL pilots/families in the industry. A unified effort across the (industry) board has the most chance for success. Hopefully, there is a way to achieve these results without undue risk to any pilot/family. I don't have the answers to complicated questions raised here. But I can tell you that SU is made up of caring leaders that don't make rash decisions. Good luck to all, NJW

 

[ultrarunner]

I'm sure Warren is asking himself why he got into this aspect of the aviation business. And it wouldn't surprise me one bit for him to flip that whole entire outift and let it be someone elses problem.

He stayed away from aviation for quite sometime, and it's fair to say he can't be too happy with how that division could turn out.

However, he's got folks tons smarter than me advising him. So maybe they are telling him that his investmemt in NJ is one of his best ever.....

yeah, that's it.