Net Jets Gateway Cities

[RNObased]

Yes, we all get a raise, but the question is whether it will be enough to offset the losses (HBA, reserve schedule H-days, reserve vacation, differences pay, shall I go on?).

Now that is the question!!!

This may see the light of day, but isn't a slam dunk by any streach...

 

[netjetwife]

More good news from IBB--

PBS will be the new pay scale formula. PBW was one of the 2005 CBA issues that I didn't like but it was overshadowed by the more offensive low FO wages and the Domicile Debacle.

NetJets serves a prestigious clientèle and well paid, highly motivated pilots fit the image upper management is cultivating. They want to focus on future growth and stability so it's in their interest to have a happy, productive workforce with known labor costs. If you look at that as a QOL (business) issue that allows RTS to concentrate on other interests then substantial pay raises aren't surprising, especially when the profits are rolling in and a new era of cooperation is being fostered by both sides.

If they're into making grand gestures (and that propaganda video overnighted to the pilots during the contract battle tells me they are) Management will insist on saving the best for last. Intuition tells me that after all the time and effort spent on IBB they'll want a big finale for the unveiling. Think about it; who stands in front of a draped statue and gives you a complete description of it before tugging off the sheet....

 

[Diesel]

Hey just think we don't have till wait till monday.

With the ramblings of NJW we will soon reach spiritual enlightenment.

Sigh

 

[hopalong]

Would you guys give her a break already.

 

[Diesel]

I know totally!

oh wait.

 

[netjetwife]

Thanks Hopalong! I don't think civil discourse is too much to ask for.
I've gotten better at ignoring rudeness but courtesy is still greatly appreciated.
Best Wishes,
NJW

 

[x402]

PBS will be the new pay scale formula. PBW was one of the 2005 CBA issues that I didn't like but it was overshadowed by the more offensive low FO wages and the Domicile Debacle.

NetJets serves a prestigious clientèle and well paid, highly motivated pilots fit the image upper management is cultivating. They want to focus on future growth and stability so it's in their interest to have a happy, productive workforce with known labor costs. If you look at that as a QOL (business) issue that allows RTS to concentrate on other interests then substantial pay raises aren't surprising, especially when the profits are rolling in and a new era of cooperation is being fostered by both sides.

If they're into making grand gestures (and that propaganda video overnighted to the pilots during the contract battle tells me they are) Management will insist on saving the best for last. Intuition tells me that after all the time and effort spent on IBB they'll want a big finale for the unveiling. Think about it; who stands in front of a draped statue and gives you a complete description of it before tugging off the sheet....

I have no idea why this sort of inside info has a place on this board. It is not the time to tell wannbes to send in the resumes, that in itself is self defeating to OUR cause.
You have a unique view into the negotiations because of your spouse. Why does anyone in the FlightInfo world need to know about PBW/PBS? If they are NJA crew they are on our BB and are already informed. Let's wait until after the IBB is published, you're the only one that has speculated a 99% release of the IBB. No official voice has said that. Sorry to be so direct.

 

[netjetwife]

I don't mind at all reinforcing that the 99.9% guess is my personal opinion and I have repeatedly stated that I am an optimistic person by nature. In all due respect, it seems a stretch to suggest my post could have any bearing on the outcome of IBB, considering the timing. Furthermore, if the (optimistically presumed by me) TA is voted into place the new system will become common knowledge and will be discussed here regularly. Perhaps some of the NJ pilots will think that I upstaged them with my post... Ooops, didn't consider that...

As to posting about it here: PBW vs PBS is a philosophical issue and I think it will make an interesting topic of conversation for all frac pilots. Apparently, I'm not as opposed to sharing information with pilots considering a career at NJA as you seem to be? By now the positions at the table have been declared and the TA is being written. Yes, my husband's role gives me the family perspective but that opportunity is open to many because the Union actively recruits volunteers. Be assured, though, that I am very discreet. If I had viewed it as sensitive information I certainly wouldn't have posted it. I will tell my husband that I did (when he can finally call home) and if he wants me to remove it, I will.

 

[netjetwife]

X402, I was told that the proposed change is being discussed by the pilots outside of message boards and that my post wasn't a problem. It was another long day at the table. From my personal perspective my husband sounded confident that IBB was on track for completion. I gathered that from his brief comments between yawns...

Soon it will be up to the NJ pilots and their families to read, debate and vote. I hope the SU spirit of unity will prevail and that all the NJ pilots will finally see professional wages. Just imagine the positive statement that it will make if the Union and Management have successfully put together a deal that benefits both sides-- without fighting --and early no less! Regardless of the outcome, they deserve high marks just for trying. Surely it will encourage further cooperation and bodes well for future endeavors. The hard-working NJ pilots and their patient families deserve no less so here's hoping that IBB picks up where the 2005 CBA left off.

Remaining optimistic,
Netjetwife

 

[Diesel]

Be assured, though, that I am very discreet. If I had viewed it as sensitive information I certainly wouldn't have posted it. I will tell my husband that I did (when he can finally call home) and if he wants me to remove it, I will.

You've done it before, so why not again? Maybe instead of trying to prove to x402 why you're right you should actually read what he has to say. He's spot on.

I haven't decided how to vote though. I'm not wearing the same rose colored glasses as you. How are you going to vote though? Ohhhhh wait.

X402, I was told that the proposed change is being discussed by the pilots outside of message boards and that my post wasn't a problem. It was another long day at the table. From my personal perspective my husband sounded confident that IBB was on track for completion. I gathered that from his brief comments between yawns...

You were told this, heard that..... Take it for what its worth because NONE of US including your husband is in the know. Only 2 people are.

But why dilute delusions of grandeurs with facts?

 

[flyipilot]

This board is open to all and for all to have any opinion they choose. I do not think NJW is doing anything wrong and is actually making some very intelligent comments about the IBB going on at NJ. Telling someone not to apply at NJ or any company is a bit strange. I say apply to NJ, now is a great time! I hear they have plans to hire many in the next few years. The whole point about these boards is to discuss many different topics and I enjoy reading the many posts. Keep up the good work NJW! Too many people get too personal and too wound up on these boards. It's all in fun.

 

[netjetwife]

Thanks for the kind words, Flyipilot! At this point, my optimism is just as valid as any other poster's pessimism. In spite of Diesel's sarcasm about me voting, it is commonplace for a couple to decide their family's future together. Plots frequently mention their families and cite their needs as important considerations when casting a vote.

As for "rose colored glasses" it is easy for me to identify with an underpaid FO family trying to make it on one sub par wage. A few short years ago my husband was one of the ridiculously low paid NJ FOs. I know how tough it is for a family (we have 3 kids) to get by on the NJ FO pay. Even after the 2005 CBA the wages still qualify for the reduced price lunch at public schools in our state. I think many would agree that a substantial pay raise and 95 more basing options are clearly reasons to be hopeful that an IBB proposal will be submitted that appeals to the majority. There is nothing distorted about my viewpoint that FO wages are too low especially for the expensive cities some pilots have been assigned to. The cause that was worth fighting for prior to the ratification of the current contract is still a problem that needs to be fixed for those at the bottom of the seniority list. 1108's leadership recognizes that IBB is an opportunity to provide underpaid NJ pilots with the professional wages and QOL they deserve. We must all be sporting the same glasses...

A RISING TIDE SHOULD LIFT ALL BOATS AND ALL FRACTIONAL PILOTS DESERVE PROFESSIONAL COMPENSATION

 

[Diesel]

Sadly IBB is not just about Pay and Domiciles.

The above is the rose colored glasses way of looking at any contract change but IBB is more complicated than just pay. Those that can see that, and how this might affect their future good or bad are the ones I'd listen too.

What might be good on one hand might negatively affect you for a long time. Make sure you are ready for it.

 

[Diesel]

now for my smartass post....

look its the weekend and i'm on the road....... how did that happen?

 

[netjetwife]

One has to wonder what motivates a person to make admittedly "smartass remarks". I leave it to each reader to speculate on the possibilities but some seem rather obvious to me.

For clarification to those who may be confused. Yes, many (if not all) NJ pilots regularly work on the weekend, my husband included. My comment about my husband working this weekend was in no way a complaint or suggestion that it was out of the norm. It was intended for those interested in the IBB process and was posted as an illustration of the time and effort being put into IBB. Previously the participants had worked week days and spent weekends at home. Most of you probably didn't need the explanation but hopefully it will keep the "smartass" posts to a minimum. Have I mentioned that I'm optimistic by nature...

 

[netjetwife]

Sadly IBB is not just about Pay and Domiciles. ... .

Pay and QOL issues are two major areas that concern most voters. Naturally, those making the least will be the most concerned with the wages offered. Likewise, those with the least options for basing will be more interested in the improvements in that regard. My family will judge the TA by how many lives will be improved if it passes. That viewpoint is not espoused by those who will primarily consider how it affects them personally and are less interested in the finances of other families. Ironically, the NJ pilots wouldn't be enjoying their current contract if not for volunteers that placed service before self.

Some may think that such a viewpoint means the viewer is wearing "rose colored glasses" but I think it shows an understanding that a Union is by design supposed to work for the contract that brings the most overall improvements. I do hope we'll hear from NJ pilots who lives will be impacted if IBB passes. Unfortunately the rudeness sometimes encountered here tends to stifle civil discourse. Hopefully the silent majority can ignore the negative aspects of this forum and join in a discussion of the issues facing fractional pilots and their families. Pay and basing are critical considerations for many in aviation and I hope that raising the bar at NJA will have a positive ripple affect in the industry. NJW

 

[x402]

This board is open to all and for all to have any opinion they choose. I do not think NJW is doing anything wrong and is actually making some very intelligent comments about the IBB going on at NJ. Telling someone not to apply at NJ or any company is a bit strange. I say apply to NJ, now is a great time! I hear they have plans to hire many in the next few years. The whole point about these boards is to discuss many different topics and I enjoy reading the many posts. Keep up the good work NJW! Too many people get too personal and too wound up on these boards. It's all in fun.

I wouldn't want the responsibility of suggesting to interested applicants that the work being done as IBB will see the light of day and if it does that it will pass. THAT is not helping pilots plan their future. Just ask pilots that started here, oh let's say 6.5 years ago, ask them what their expectations were and how that worked out.
Granted, at this point the self imposed deadline is 24 hrs away. I'm sure this board we be aware of the content as soon as it is published (if it is).
However, this does not insure it passage.
So, who has served the pilots on this board? Someone that says it's a done deal, line up?
Or someone that says take a deep breath and be sure about what your stepping into?
x

 

[brokeflyer]

that IBB is gonna sink faster than a rock.....

 

[Diesel]

My family will judge the TA by how many lives will be improved if it passes. That viewpoint is not espoused by those who will primarily consider how it affects them personally and are less interested in the finances of other families.

Sorry I can't control the finances of other families. When I open the pdf document tomorrow I will look at it in a long term view for the pilots. Not a short term fix to a long term problem for the crews. Work rules, qol issues, schedule, pay, maintaining hba's and reducing loopholes for the company. Each pilot has their own issues. Mine are long term views for keeping this the best job in the business.

I won't see the extra money, nor will I see any of the changes. All the more reason to make sure I make sure that these changes are good for long term NJA pilots. Sans emotion.

Thinking that pilots won't look at the ibb for themselves first and then the pilot group is naive. I'm a realist not an optimist. This is a business, i don't believe that optimism or emotion has any place in business. I believe in factual data.

I read a great quote today. By one of the most dynamic business leaders in the USA. An alligator is sitting on the bank of a river. He's watching the most amazing feasts of birds and small animals cross right under his nose. He knows he can snatch any one of them and have a meal. But he knows also that such a small animal isn't worth the effort. He's waiting patiently for that bigger animal happy to let the small ones go by.

PS if you can't see the humor in sarcasm... well i can't help you there.

 

[netjethusband]

i missed you dear. it's so nice to read your heartfelt posts again.