More unprofessional AMR pilot behavior

[nathan jesup]

1)Christianity was practiced it it’s true form by early believers after Christ’s death. Christians so shocked the Romans at that time with their example of love and caring for the needy that it transformed the entire Roman Empire without the raising of a sword (except against Christians). This is what brought Christianity to power. Now, as we all know through the example of history, power corrupts. People began to be drawn to the Roman Catholic Church not to follow Christ but instead to seize positions of power. Most of the abuses cited by people against Christianity spring from this.

This also shows why I don’t believe there should be an established national religion of Christianity in the United States. It would attract and compel people to it for the wrong reasons and would eventually become corrupt. Christianity is a relationship, not an organization.

2)It continually astounds me that in the area of religion, people don’t think you should say someone else is wrong. We do this all day long in other areas of life. If I answer a technical question wrong at an airline interview, they will tell me I’m wrong and I may not get the job. That is because there is a right answer out there somewhere independent of whatever the interviewer or I may personally think. I can’t cry foul to the interviewer and say they are being “intolerant” because they told me I am wrong. You can say non-Christians are being intolerant toward Christians because they say our view of things is wrong. Or you could just give up altogether and say, “There is no objective Truth.” But is that statement you just made objectively true? This what philosophers call arguing in a circle. If there is to be any rational debate at all, it must be agreed upon that there is Truth out there and it is our job to find it, no matter whether we find it convenient to our current lifestyle or not. I’m glad relativistic thinking doesn’t yet reign in the fields of mathematics, chemistry, philosophy, etc., but it is sadly working it’s way there. I propose not forcing Christianity upon people, but simply opening it up to the realm of honest public debate. If it doesn’t hold up in that arena, I will be the first to dispose of it and move on.

If I was trapped on a deserted island with three other people and we all came up with different solutions to get off the island, I wouldn't resort to name-calling, hate, or persecution. Worst of all, I wouldn't stick my head in the sand and go about my life on the island as if a problem didn't exist. That gets us nowhere. Instead, I would consider all options, analyze the facts, and go with the best plan. I would also see it as my duty to convince others to follow this plan if I thought it would save their lives. I wouldn't force them to leave the island, but I would try to convince them that there is a plan that makes the most sense. This is not being intolerant toward the other plans (ie. religions) I rejected, and this is not being arrogant, this is simply what I define as sanity.

There is plenty of convincing, hard data out there that Christianity is true. It is NOT a blind faith. Read the book Mere Christianity and other works by C.S. Lewis. Read some of the intelligent design arguments by Phillip Johnson and Michael Behe. Read the Case for Christ by Lee Strobel. Read the works of William Lane Craig and Ravi Zacharias. There are hundreds of books out there that present the case better than I ever could. But don’t just turn your head and pretend none of it exists. The stakes are too high. Remember that although it doesn't always seem like it, we are on a deserted island right now.

I’m sure many will be happy that this will be my last post on this thread. I've said enough.

 

[doh]

pylut,
Amen to you my brother, there is a special place in hell for them!

 

[climbhappy]

Diszel8,

Those who are God's elect, his remnant ,are spiritual jews. we died with him at the cross, live in and through him now and will live eternally with him.

You may have never heard of the law of "Non contradiction" You see there is only one true, almighty,all powerful, omnipotent God.
He has been referred to as Jehovah, Yahweh, I am, the creator, among others. The Bible has been recorded and handed down through the ages. Its word are God inspired and every word is sacred, even St Pauls' who had written 8 books. or letters.

Due to sin we are all separated from God. That is why he sent his son, Jesus Christ. It was because of the 'law" that sin became known. since we can't keep the law, Jesus, gives us a free pass into heaven. it's really that simple. He says come as you are. we cant' be perfect, we'll never measure up.

Having said that, there's only two choices, (back to the law of noncontradiction) heaven or hell. surely, you would prefer joy and peace over torment.

Finally, our forefathers worshipped God almighty and his son. This is recorded and make no mistake, our founding fathers read, studied and carried their bibles with them. Thomas jefferson was a devout christian man. Some of you guys have been sold a bad bill of goods.

Trying to justify 25 different world religions is weak as an argument and moreover denies the exitstment of one truth. that's it one truth. We have in the bible an OPEN BOOK TEST ON LIVING THIS LIFE ON EARTH. HOW COULD YOU AS PILOTS, WHO HAVE BEEN GIVEN THIS SAME GOUGE ON AIRCRAFT SYSTEMS SCREW THIS ONE UP.

 

[man-down]

Nathan Jesup..

Thanks for your posts. I wish I could express my thoughts half as well as you have done.

As for some of you who disagree, why get so angry? You have your beliefs, and I am sure you think they are correct.

Why can't Christians have their beliefs and also think they are correct without being "persecuted" ?

 

[Dizel8]

Climbhappy,

So are you saying, that the God the Christians and you believe in, is the one true God, that there can be no other?

If that is the case, then I guess the people who hold other faiths are wrong?

As far as the fathers of this country is concerned, yes, I have no doubt they were religous. They were sadly not against slavery, yet in the eyes of God, all man are created equal. They did not allow women to vote, etc. etc. I am not sure God would have agreed with that.

Mandown,

"Why can't Christians have their beliefs and also think they are correct without being "persecuted?"

They certainly can, that is one of the freedom we have in this country. However, I am sure religous people, whatever their faith is, ask that same question.
---

Religion is an interesting subject, it has been discussed for eons and will continue to be discussed for eons to come. Ultimately, it comes down to a leap of faith, that one takes based on the evidence presented.

 

[pipejockey]

Re: Re: Re: Unsolicited religion has no place

Those JackA$$ Arabs have no idea that America and Israel are acting with RESTRAINT. Muslim teachings are but a tool of these meglomaniacs and murderers. either become a practicing Muslim or you are punished. Christians, however obnoxious you think they are, do want people to be free to believe or not believe.
If the restraint being shown the Arab world is ever lifted they will know bloodshed not seen since WWII. This prospect does not make me happy but sad and fearful of what may yet come. But I welcome it over a slow and steady muslim takeover of the world. You decide what you want to stand for.

I agree wholeheartedly!!

And I for one would enjoy flying with Captain Findiesen and would encourage him to discuss the depth of his faith with me. It just might make me a better person.

 

[Snakum]

I don’t believe there should be an established national religion of Christianity in the United States. It would attract and compel people to it for the wrong reasons and would eventually become corrupt.

BECOME corrupt?!?

I almost pooped my pants on this one.

And Nathan ... maybe you should read Barbara Therin, JD Crosson, and many other biblical scholars - some priests - who will argue with your experts that the bible is literally true.

If you want to believe such nonsense ... hey, more power to you, bro. But don't give us that holier-than-thou, 'we're better cause God's on our side crap'. Your silly superstitions will fade away just like those of ancient Greece, Rome, Britain, etc.

Just more garbage to rise above as we evolve into more intelligent, logical, and TOLERANT human beings.



Minh

 

[TWA Dude]

There is plenty of convincing, hard data out there that Christianity is true. It is NOT a blind faith.

Nathan:

Even as a non-Christian I was enjoying your post up untill I got to this part. There's a long-running thread on the General Board where I chimed in briefly on this subject. My main point is that just because it was written in a book considered holy doesn't mean it constitutes proof. I shan't argue that any religion out there is untrue because I'm in no place to judge. It very much does take blind faith because to belong to one religion you must ignore books others consider sacred. Remember that Muslims, Hindus and Buddists greatly outnumber Christians on this planet. If one religion were really "true" one would think word would've gotten around by now. In my belief there is one G-D and He is worshipped in many different ways through many different religions.

And BTW I know I'm not going to Hell because there is no such place. If you disagree than prove me wrong with evidence, not words.

Dude

 

[WhiteCloud]

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but like someone else pointed out, many crimes have been perpetrated in the name of Christianity.
Perhaps the Vikings were right, believing in Valhalla and Odin. Of course not you say, those were heathens. Well, then the Egyptians. No, those were just silly beliefs. Right?

Well...no.....people, with all their human failings misuse religious beliefs. The belief in Christianity was the thread that held together the loosely connected Viking people.

 

[Whitestoneclimb]

I realize that this subject is a very controversial one, but I am very disappointed at the level to which some people have stooped. I am a Christian and I'm not ashamed to say that. Now before everyone starts to bash me, I'd like to say this: I will agree that this Captain was not exercising his best judgement making the announcement the way he did. That being said, I don't feel he was "pushing his religion" or "cramming it down someone's throat". A lot of people on this board have been saying that this guy is a "freak" or a "fanatic". If you look at the news story/transcript, he asked the Christians to identify themselves, NOT the non-Christians. Then he SUGGESTED that the non-Christians to talk with the Christians. Now, the Christians should not have felt threatened because its not only a priviledge, but also a biblical principle to share the Gospel if presented the opportunity. The non-Christians should not have felt threatened because they didn't HAVE to do anything. If they wanted to know more, they could ask. If they weren't interested, they could just go back to their USAToday.

Great posts Jessup and Climbhappy!

He is risen