MaxBlast feeling the LUV!

[-9Capt]

"I just puked on my keyboard."

I think he was joking? I hope...

So was I.

 

[Bake]

-9Capt, the scene is amazing but the legs are too skinny. Can you photoshop that some?

 

[madjack]

-9cpt, he was pretty vocal about wanting the pilots of both groups to have a chance to vote, by saying no, your side may have p-offed the new boss...just saying

 

[-9Capt]

-9Capt, the scene is amazing but the legs are too skinny.

I hate to ruin it for you, but she's about to drop a #2.

 

[madjack]

"which over the long term, will end up degrading his employee centric culture of SW. "

Just how is taking sides with your employees, degrading the culture? I would be more alarmed if did NOT take sides with his employees!! Many folks, right or wrong, on the SWA side feel that by taking all the AAI pilots sans 88 dc9s was throwing your side a pretty big bone...

 

[-9Capt]

-9cpt, he was pretty vocal about wanting the pilots of both groups to have a chance to vote, by saying no, your side may have p-offed the new boss...just saying

So by doing that we told him to F-off? Geez, exaggerate much?

It wasn't his decision whether ALPA members get the chance to vote on his proposal. That was our MECs decision. He had a right to offer a solution, however his threats and ultimatums crossed a line into scumbagdom. What makes him think that it's his place to influence our union proceedings? Like I said before, he can want whatever he wants to want, but the fact is, it wasn't his decision to make. When he didn't get his way, he decided to play in the gutter. Real nice.

 

[-9Capt]

Just how is taking sides with your employees, degrading the culture? I would be more alarmed if did NOT take sides with his employees!! Many folks, right or wrong, on the SWA side feel that by taking all the AAI pilots sans 88 dc9s was throwing your side a pretty big bone...

To answer your question, eventually about 1/3 of SW pilots will feel, to varying degrees, as if they were not treated fairly, their seniority was "stolen", their capt seats were "stolen", etc. That will degrade the SW culture. I know many of us will be less than willing to lift a finger for this place.

As for the last sentence of your post, I would refer those pilots to my signature line.
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VVV

 

[madjack]

Do what you got to do, we got plenty on this side who are NOT drinking the Koolaid... It's a good job and we are all lucky to have jobs at a major...

 

[madjack]

It seems to me he decided to look at options when a negotiated agreement was not looking good...right or wrong that is what he wanted for the company...a negotiated SLI...why, if he could avoid it, should he let your union dictate how the deal got done...I can understand if u feel his actions were Anti-ALPA but I do feel he really felt a negotiated settlement was better for SWA...it would have been easier for him to stay out of the process and let a judge decide...

 

[-9Capt]

And by doing so he disregarded signed agreements and resorted to making threats and ultimatums. I'm sure glad he got what he wanted. I'll never trust a thing this management has to say. I'll show up when it's convenient for me then go home and enjoy my days off.

 

[StopNTSing]

So by doing that we told him to F-off? Geez, exaggerate much?

It wasn't his decision whether ALPA members get the chance to vote on his proposal. That was our MECs decision. He had a right to offer a solution, however his threats and ultimatums crossed a line into scumbagdom. What makes him think that it's his place to influence our union proceedings? Like I said before, he can want whatever he wants to want, but the fact is, it wasn't his decision to make. When he didn't get his way, he decided to play in the gutter. Real nice.

With US-Air/AmWest as the most recent precedent for an arbitrated SLI he could refer to, it does make it a little more understandable why GK may have chosen a different path for his airline.

BTW, if there was as much butchering of the Process Agreement by SWA as you keep alleging, where are all the lawsuits?

 

[madjack]

He wanted a negotiated agreement and he got one, was very vocal about it too..,how was that dishonest??

 

[jball2]

So many mismanaged expectations (both sides),so little time!

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 2

 

[madjack]

what you wanted out of the deal,

 

[madjack]

Oops, disregard

 

[PCL_128]

I see this statement over and over and over again. Please cite actual wording from the document and present your case as to which portion was not followed. I want to see the actual language you feel was not followed.

On this point, I actually agree with the Southwest pilots. Gary never actually violated anything. He implied that he might violate it. And that mere implication caused all hell to break loose on our side of the partition. But he never actually broke the agreement, and to this day, I don't believe he would have. He just bluffed quite well, and we were incredibly gullible. The rest is history.

 

[madjack]

"He just bluffed quite well, and we were incredibly gullible."

If it makes you feel any better, he wasn't bluffing...

 

[waveflyer]

As of right now, nearly every FAT pilot over there went voluntarily. Conduct that survey again once integration is over.

What did I expect him to do? How about stay the hell out of it and let the process work like its supposed to. Like every other airline CEO does. By sticking his nose in and creating the animosity, he is responsible for alienating 30+% of his employees. Maybe he thought that would be better than actually doing what's fair and thereby pissing off the other 70%.

Yeah, I know, RSW guys are pissed too, except nobody thus far has been able to coherently articulate to me exactly why that is.

Be careful when you hope Gary acts like "every other airline CEO"

He may not be herb, but I do thank god he's internal and not like the rest

 

[waveflyer]

"He just bluffed quite well, and we were incredibly gullible."

If it makes you feel any better, he wasn't bluffing...

And that not bluffing wouldn't be breaking the process agreement

 

[-9Capt]

With US-Air/AmWest as the most recent precedent for an arbitrated SLI he could refer to, it does make it a little more understandable why GK may have chosen a different path for his airline.

Statements like that demonstrate a lack of understanding about the differences between the two integrations. It's been discussed before, don't feel like going down that road again. Suffice to say, they had different issues in play that allowed the integration to drag on.

 

[-9Capt]

And that not bluffing wouldn't be breaking the process agreement

It would certianly violate our contract, as well as the petition SW filed with the DOJ that allowed the merger to happen.

 

[Kharma Police]

It would certianly violate our contract, as well as the petition SW filed with the DOJ that allowed the merger to happen.

Re-read them both, swiss cheese comes to mind. Even the all knowing Airtran sheepherder Lear70 had a change of heart when he got on the inside and talked to the lawyers.

 

[canyonblue]

As for the last sentence of your post, I would refer those pilots to my signature line.
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VVV

It wasn't do we grow Southwest, or do we buy AirTran? It was, we need AirTran, so we can grow in the future, Mr. Kelly said.

I don't get it. Do you believe everything Gary Kelly says or not? On one hand you believe he is not to be trusted in anything he says, on the other you take a quote of his for your signature line as the Gospel Truth.

 

[PCL_128]

"He just bluffed quite well, and we were incredibly gullible."

If it makes you feel any better, he wasn't bluffing...

Yeah, he was. But if he wasn't, it would have violated the Process Agreement that he signed, which would make him no different than any other corrupt, lying airline CEO. Which means that your beloved CULTure is just a sham. If you believe that he wasn't bluffing, then you'd better be preparing for one hell of a screwjob on your CBA.

Luckily for you, he was bluffing.

 

[-9Capt]

"I don't get it. Do you believe everything Gary Kelly says or not?"

I believe whatever suits my agenda.

 

[madjack]

Maybe your right about the CBA, but historically that has not been the trend since '01, but the company never had to absorb an AAI- like airline, while divesting most if it's airplanes...

 

[Kenney G]

Maybe your right about the CBA, but historically that has not been the trend since '01, but the company never had to absorb an AAI- like airline, while divesting most if it's airplanes...

SWA bought all of AirTran. Planes and all. Originally did they not plan on keeping the 717 for a bit while retiring the 737 300/500? Plans change but your management chose a different path well after buying AirTran. Plus is your fleet pretty much the same hull size as a combined SWA/AirTran fleet? Does not seem SWA is absorbing 1000 pilots with no airplanes. Looks like they are using Airtrans orders as well as Swa orders were scheduled to replace the 300/500 series. Your CEO even said growth was a long way off for you even before the merger.

 

[madjack]

What do I know, but the drivers of next contract will be cost vs revenue....buying an airline, dismantling it and then divesting of most of its airplanes had to add to the cost equation...hopefully those synergies will kick in...

 

[DonVerita]

"which over the long term, will end up degrading his employee centric culture of SW. "

Just how is taking sides with your employees, degrading the culture? I would be more alarmed if did NOT take sides with his employees!! Many folks, right or wrong, on the SWA side feel that by taking all the AAI pilots sans 88 dc9s was throwing your side a pretty big bone...

Earth to Madjack -- ATN doesn't have DC-9's. Got rid of the last of those over 10 years ago. They have B-717's. Might look similar on the outside. BIG difference on the inside. Think glass cockpit, technology, automated everything...something you won't find on a SWA 737-300.

 

[SWA Bubba]

Earth to Madjack -- ATN doesn't have DC-9's. Got rid of the last of those over 10 years ago. They have B-717's. Might look similar on the outside. BIG difference on the inside. Think glass cockpit, technology, automated everything...something you won't find on a SWA 737-300.

I suspect that he knows the difference--he's just using that term for derision in your little pissing contest. Certainly, YOU know a little something about that. A little like you acting like every one of our planes--or even most of them--are 737-300/500s.

We do have a few of them, however, and in fact are partly "replacing" your 717s with them, by not retiring them as fast as originally planned. I guess that maybe there's something negative about your "glass cockpit, automated everything" B-717s, seeing as how the company would rather have old 737-300s than keep them. Makes you go hmmmm.....

Besides, -9Capt seems pretty proud of that particular airframe.

Bubba