Legacy Bashfest - Bring it on!

[JetBlast2000]

Or maybe I misunderstood the thread… and its really LegacyDRIVER bashfest….?

 

[JetPilot500]

I guess you can fly INTERNATIONAL in a WSCoD.....

http://www.avcrew.com/jobs/pilots/jobs.htm#0103

Legacy Captain (China) 1/03

Macau-based (China) flight department is seeking a EMB-145BJ (Legacy) Captain to operate worldwide. Ideal candidate will have an FAA ATP, First Class medical certificate, EMB-145 type rating, 5000 hours total time, 100 hours in type, extensive corporate and international experience, and a willingness to relocate overseas. We offer an attractive compensation package and the opportunity to work with other high-caliber professionals in one of Asia's top flight departments. If you meet the above qualifications and would like to join our team of professionals, please email your complete resume to [email protected]. Don't forget to mention AvCrew.com when applying.

 

[JetPilot500]

The average Corporate Jet leg (according to at least SOME surveys any way--I am sure GV has a different set of them) is 1200-1500 NM. So, we'll double that for the G-String and add some. The Legacy does the same thing. You know, most US Corporate jets do the bulk of their flying here in the States, Canada, and Mexico. The Legacy will do all of them just fine.

Last time I looked at our Falcon 900EX numbers, I think our average leg is like 2.3 hours. However, we use the aircraft to go to Asia, Europe, South America and South Africa MANY times per year. So you could say that our average leg is 1,000 miles. But we also need an airplane that can do 4000+ miles on a regular basis.

And if one wants to go to Tokyo from LA like my boss does from time to time, he goes FIRST CLASS on a 747. It's cheaper than a G-V can ever be....

Yes, but they why do you have a corporate aircraft? Another thing to consider is this. You may need to make other stops in the region you are in. We don't usually go to Bejing and then back to the US. Many times, we go to Beijing, then to Kuala Lumpur, Hong Kong, Tokyo and Seoul. Just try and fly the airlines. I suppose if you don't mind sitting next to a crate of chickens on China Eastern Airlines, then it's not so bad. Plus, even if you did do it on the airlines, you might not like your schedule options, forcing you to spend several more days in Asia than you need.

In fact, there was one recent trip that we didn't have a 900EX available. The passengers flew UAL to Beijing. We dead-headed a Falcon 50EX up there to meet the passengers in Beijing. Then we flew to approximately 10 other places in Asia, finally dropping off the passengers in Beijing to pick up their UAL flight. The 50EX dead-headed back to the US. All this was done because the passengers didn't want to make 2 fuel stops (in an aircraft with 3100 Miles range), and they ALSO didn't want to ride on any of the Asian airlines for safety and security reasons.

Just another take.

JetPilot500

 

[GVFlyer]

WSCoD

Well, no. (responding to a question asking if the Legacy compared directly to the Gulfstream)

But it does come close… It also costs almost half as much and operates at a substantial savings per hour…

The IAI G200 is the jet in the Gulfstream lineup that would be the logical choice to compare to the Legacy. It cost $21.43 million to acquire, has an Mmo of M 0.85 and flys 3,050 nm at M 0.80 or 3,400 at M 0.75. DOC for the Galaxy is $1,348 hr as opposed to $1,615 hr for the WSCoD.

If you insist on a comparison with a large cabin Gulfstream, you don't have to go to the top of the line to pick a fight. The G350 will humble the Legacy without breaking a sweat.

G350 Specifications v. Legacy - 8 passengers, ISA, NBAA IFR Fuel Reserves

Price: $27.5 million (or $6.35 m more than than the Legacy's $21.15m)

Mmo: M 0.88 (Legacy M 0.80)

Range: LRC - 3,800 nm @ Mach 0.80 or 459 kts.( Legacy - 3,220 nm @ M 0.74 or 425 kts.)

Range, High Speed Cruise - 3,200 nm @ m 0.85 or 488 kts.(Legacy - 2,950 @M 0.78 or 448 kts.)

Thrust: Rolls-Royce Tay Mark 611-8C - 13,850 lbs (Legacy - AE 3007 A1E- 7,953 lbs)

TBO: 12,000 hours (Legacy -Unk.)

Initial Altitude: FL410 (Legacy FL370)

T/O Dist. MGTOW: 5,050 ft. (Legacy - 5,770 ft.)

Ldg Dist. MLW: 3,260 ft @ 66,000lbs (Legacy - 2,683 ft.)

Maximum Altitude: FL450 (Legacy FL390, currently in developmental test for FL410)

Cabin Altitude: 6,000 ft @ FL450 (Legacy - 8,800 ft @ FL410)

Max Ramp WT: 71,300 lbs (Legacy - 49,758 lbs)

Max Payload: 6,300 lbs (Legacy - 5,291 lbs)

Max Payload Full Fuel: 2,600 lbs (Legacy - 1,605)

Fuel 26,000 lbs. (Legacy - 18,170lbs)

Cabin Dimensions:45'1" X 6'2" X 7'4" (Legacy 43 X 5'10" 6'11")

DOC $1,731 / hr (Legacy $1,615)

Although the Legacy is 8% per hour less expensive to operate than the Gulfstream, the G350 is 15% faster than the WSCoD on a 3200 nm trip, thereby making the G350 7% more efficient than the Legacy: G350 trip cost $11358.00 - Legacy trip cost:$12,172.17. An added plus is that you will arrive at your destination at least 58 minutes sooner.

You can also count on the G350 to retain 85-90% of it's original value at resale; how is the Legacy doing on the used market?

GV

 

[mmmdonut]

.....please......let.....this.....thread.....die........

 

[SkyGirl]

.....please......let.....this.....thread.....die........

Obviously, there are some pilots who enjoy reading and participating in this thread or it would not be so long lived. Why not just ignore it if you don't like it?

-SkyGirl-

 

[banned username 2]

The IAI G200 is the jet in the Gulfstream lineup that would be the logical choice to compare to the Legacy. It cost $21.43 million to acquire, has an Mmo of M 0.85 and flys 3,050 nm at M 0.80 or 3,400 at M 0.75. DOC for the Galaxy is $1,348 hr as opposed to $1,615 hr for the WSCoD.

If you insist on a comparison with a large cabin Gulfstream, you don't have to go to the top of the line to pick a fight. The G350 will humble the Legacy without breaking a sweat.

G350 Specifications v. Legacy - 8 passengers, ISA, NBAA IFR Fuel Reserves

Price: $27.5 million (or $6.35 m more than than the Legacy's $21.15m)

Mmo: M 0.88 (Legacy M 0.80)

Range: LRC - 3,800 nm @ Mach 0.80 or 459 kts.( Legacy - 3,220 nm @ M 0.74 or 425 kts.)

Range, High Speed Cruise - 3,200 nm @ m 0.85 or 488 kts.(Legacy - 2,950 @M 0.78 or 448 kts.)

Thrust: Rolls-Royce Tay Mark 611-8C - 13,850 lbs (Legacy - AE 3007 A1E- 7,953 lbs)

TBO: 12,000 hours (Legacy -Unk.)

Initial Altitude: FL410 (Legacy FL370)

T/O Dist. MGTOW: 5,050 ft. (Legacy - 5,770 ft.)

Ldg Dist. MLW: 3,260 ft @ 66,000lbs (Legacy - 2,683 ft.)

Maximum Altitude: FL450 (Legacy FL390, currently in developmental test for FL410)

Cabin Altitude: 6,000 ft @ FL450 (Legacy - 8,800 ft @ FL410)

Max Ramp WT: 71,300 lbs (Legacy - 49,758 lbs)

Max Payload: 6,300 lbs (Legacy - 5,291 lbs)

Max Payload Full Fuel: 2,600 lbs (Legacy - 1,605)

Fuel 26,000 lbs. (Legacy - 18,170lbs)

Cabin Dimensions:45'1" X 6'2" X 7'4" (Legacy 43 X 5'10" X 6'11")

DOC $1,731 / hr (Legacy $1,615)

Although the Legacy is 8% per hour less expensive to operate than the Gulfstream, the G350 is 15% faster than the WSCoD on a 3200 nm trip, thereby making the G350 7% more efficient than the Legacy: G350 trip cost $11358.00 - Legacy trip cost:$12,172.17. An added plus is that you will arrive at your destination at least 58 minutes sooner.

You can also count on the G350 to retain 85-90% of it's original value at resale; how is the Legacy doing on the used market?

GV

Well that pretty much sums it up... The Gulfstream is a real contender in the International Corporate Aircraft market and the Legacy is still a WSofD...

I took the liberty of highlighting in RED (for WSofDDriver a.k.a. Skull-One) some of the finer, more interesting points of GVFlyer's post...

WSofD achieves it's max range at a measly M0.74
WSofD "High Speed Cruise" is a measly M0.78
WSofD can only go up to FL390 (yeah, yeah, new software... we know)
WSofD needs nearly 6,000 ft of runway for max range (over 700 ft more than G-350)
WSofD has an 8,800 ft cabin at FL410, have you ever spent 8 hours at an 8,800 ft cabin? Talk about fatigue! The New Global Express is offering a 4,500ft cabin at FL450... Why??? Because it makes a serious difference...
WSofD has a max payload (with full fuel) of 1,000 lbs (5 passengers) LESS than the G-350... That "Big" cabin but yet you can't take everyone with!
WSofD actually has a SMALLER cabin than the G-350...
WSofD has a higher trip cost than the G-350...

I don't think it takes a rocket scientist to see you are comparing apples to oranges... With your flawed logic, everyone should buy a CitationJet and make as many fuel stops as needed, because they are far cheaper than the WSofD and much cheaper to operate...

 

[mmmdonut]

Obviously, there are some pilots who enjoy reading and participating in this thread or it would not be so long lived. Why not just ignore it if you don't like it?

-SkyGirl-

stfu.... get back into the kitchen and leave the plane talk to men

 

[banned username 2]

stfu.... get back into the kitchen and leave the plane talk to men

Ah Yes... This lovely post gets Mr. Donut Hole into the box for 5 days...

Totally uncalled for...

 

[fokkerjet]

I don't want to see this thread die, but....... responding with FACTS to this guy is pointless, in all of his responses he will never address anything with fact, only his personal opinion or some lame excuse like he left the keys to the jet at home and he can't get to the AFM....Personally, this WSofD is a Junglejet Gulfstream knockoff with a cheap Falcon interior. It does its intended mission pretty well, I assume; confusing people with a little bit of money and a huge ego into thinking that they will impress people by showing up in one of these barbie jets, but in reality, all you're really getting from people is "what the fuk is that thing? Dude I thought you were doing so much better than that!"

 

[JetBlast2000]

G350 Specifications v. Legacy - 8 passengers, ISA, NBAA IFR Fuel Reserves
GV

While I don’t doubt most of your numbers, a previous post I made (#368) has trip numbers that don’t seem to add up. Any comment?
I’ve not been able to find where it says the Legacy cannot climb to FL390 direct.

The fuel load is actually 18328lbs after s/n 625

The A1E engine produces 8810lbs

Also, based on the numbers in your post, the G350 is 8% faster and the 3200nm trip would be completed about 32 min faster…

I took the liberty of highlighting in RED (for WSofDDriver a.k.a. Skull-One) some of the finer, more interesting points of GVFlyer's post...

You guys are relentless… Not that he doesn’t deserve it…


Can we stop, choose sides again and start over?




.

 

[FracCapt]

WSofD achieves it's max range at a measly M0.74
WSofD "High Speed Cruise" is a measly M0.78
WSofD can only go up to FL390 (yeah, yeah, new software... we know)
WSofD needs nearly 6,000 ft of runway for max range (over 700 ft more than G-350)
WSofD has an 8,800 ft cabin at FL410, have you ever spent 8 hours at an 8,800 ft cabin? Talk about fatigue! The New Global Express is offering a 4,500ft cabin at FL450... Why??? Because it makes a serious difference...
WSofD has a max payload (with full fuel) of 1,000 lbs (5 passengers) LESS than the G-350... That "Big" cabin but yet you can't take everyone with!
WSofD actually has a SMALLER cabin than the G-350...
WSofD has a higher trip cost than the G-350...

But....but....but....the NEW Legacy OUTPERFORMS the book numbers in every regard!

 

[suen1843]

The Subaru Legacy is a crossbreed car that's been designed to meet the needs and desires of today's buyers. It was created to appeal to those people who want the ruggedness and AWD abilities of a Sport-Ute but who do not want the poor ride, bad gas mileage, and large step-up of a normal Sport-Ute. The car features AWD (type varies with transmission), aggressive looks, more ground clearance than a normal passenger car, and a large interior space. It also gets over 25 MPG on the highway and rides more like a sport sedan than anything else. It can also outperform a Sport-Ute in many accident-avoidance and bad-weather manouvers, and independent testing by IMSA has shown that it is even better on bad terrain than other compact Sport-Utes.

I think all the Mercedes and Rolls owners will be switching to the Legacy pretty soon.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

I guess you can fly INTERNATIONAL in a WSCoD.....

http://www.avcrew.com/jobs/pilots/jobs.htm#0103

Legacy Captain (China) 1/03

Macau-based (China) flight department is seeking a EMB-145BJ (Legacy) Captain to operate worldwide. Ideal candidate will have an FAA ATP, First Class medical certificate, EMB-145 type rating, 5000 hours total time, 100 hours in type, extensive corporate and international experience, and a willingness to relocate overseas. We offer an attractive compensation package and the opportunity to work with other high-caliber professionals in one of Asia's top flight departments. If you meet the above qualifications and would like to join our team of professionals, please email your complete resume to [email protected]. Don't forget to mention AvCrew.com when applying.

NO WAY JP500...

they folded up that planes wings and shipped the whole POS via FED-EX in a big crate in an MD11.

If it tried to fly from $hithole, Brazil to Macau at .43 mach (long range cruise) it would still be enroute after 3.5 years (at FL 390 - software) and heading for its 23rd fuel stop somewhere near Guam!!!

Legacy baby....there IS no substitute.


...

 

[English]

OMG I can't stop laughing...WSCoD...

gulfstream 200, I think your post belongs on the top ten funniest posts on flightinfo.