Legacy Bashfest - Bring it on!

[Muddauber]

<<<It's clear that our nation's military picked Gulfstreams and Boeings to insure the safety and security of the country's leaders.>>>

Not withstanding the above have "Made in the USA" label on their tag.

I'm not sure what you're trying to say, but the military has made some mistakes in the past:

Air Force: British BAE 800s for flight check, Italian Alenia G222s for tactical operations in South America, Swiss - Raytheon modified PC-9s for UPT and Israeli Astras for the DC National Guard.

Coast Guard: French Falcon 20s for maritime patrol and French Aerospatial Dauphins to improve their pilots' swimming skills.

Army: Irish Shorts C-23 Sherpa (330/360) because Sen. Byrd pork-barreled them into the country because their maintenance facility is in West Virginia.


If you're trying to say, "Buy American!" good on you; otherwise kiss my a$$.

Muddy

 

[Uncle Sparky]

MMMMMUUWWAAAA HHAAAA HHAAAAA!!!!!! HHHAAA!!!


Hansa RULES Dude!! Long live the Hansa!!

 

[Uncle Sparky]

Uncle Spanky !!?!!! (OK Sparky)

goddamit !! It says you're a Lear 30 series driver............. look behind you. There is no way you can critique a Legacy.

.

Okay........you need to step slowly away from the computer. Now......I believe you may have misplaced your sense of humor. Look at me for example. As you've pointed out.......I've spent thousands of hours compressed in the fetal position(Bill Lear must've been 4feet tall!) in the front of pressurized pencil.....now there's a sense of humor. Do you honestly know of anybody who likes the way a Hansa looks, much less the way it performs? I'm thinking the majority feel the same way about the Jungle Junk. Although it's not quite as ugly, it is a slug, no matter what numbers the kid wants to paste on his argument! Now, go back to the computer.......just thought the debate was turning a bit flaccid?!

 

[Silver Wings]

Okay........Do you honestly know of anybody who likes the way a Hansa looks, much less the way it performs? I'm thinking the majority feel the same way about the Jungle Junk. Although it's not quite as ugly, it is a slug, no matter what numbers the kid wants to paste on his argument! Now, go back to the computer.......just thought the debate was turning a bit flaccid?!

¨

1) Hans Wocke. Theres one.

2) Not quite as ugly......! Are you still flying or medically inapt..... you need some serious opthalmic assistance....... may I recommend the bottoms of beer bottles as a standby...should be thick enough.

3) not slug..........caterpillar maybe.....

 

[GVFlyer]

By the way, Lockheed Martin recently went with the ERJ/Legacy airframe up against the Gulfstream airframe for a US Gov't contract (for the Army and the Navy) ......and won. Yeah baby.......!!!!!

The selection was made by non-aviator Army Military Intelligence Officers because they liked the Lockheed Martin sensor suite better than the Northrup Grumman electronics package carried by the Gulfstream. The original ROC (Required Operational Characteristics) was rewritten so as to include the performance capabilities of the EMB-145 so that the acquisition process could function on a competitive bid basis. With the original ROC, the only qualified entrants were the G450/G500/G550.

It's a shame, the military is now going to qualify a whole bunch of Army pilots to be regional first officers instead of corporate captains. And yes, the deal is contingent on Embraer building an assembly plant in Florida.

GV

 

[Uncle Sparky]

¨


Are you still flying or medically inapt..... you need some serious opthalmic assistance....... may I recommend the bottoms of beer bottles as a standby...should be thick enough.

Now THAT'S the spirit!!

 

[Silver Wings]

The selection was made by non-aviator Army Military Intelligence Officers because they liked the Lockheed Martin sensor suite better than the Northrup Grumman electronics package carried by the Gulfstream. The original ROC (Required Operational Characteristics) was rewritten so as to include the performance capabilities of the EMB-145 so that the acquisition process could function on a competitive bid basis. With the original ROC, the only qualified entrants were the G450/G500/G550.

It's a shame, the military is now going to qualify a whole bunch of Army pilots to be regional first officers instead of corporate captains. And yes, the deal is contingent on Embraer building an assembly plant in Florida.GV

My opinion, it made a lot of sense to stick with the G450 ...... but then $$$ spoke on this deal......

Just perhaps the original ROC was written around Gulfstream..... and wasn't really 'required'.... not the first time that's happened. I really can't see a giant like Lockheed bedding down with a 'slug' if a g-string was the only viable solution.........
Let's face it ...this is one of those typical compromise deals where the Legacy makes econimc and performance sense.......once we've extracted surgically the aircrew ego element.
Sure, this isn't always going to be the case for the military or the civil..... but it will keep happening for sure.

 

[Uncle Sparky]

¨

1) Hans Wocke. Theres one.

.......somehow.......I can imagine even he shuddered just a tad when he took a step back from the drawing board. Not the good kind of shudder, mind you. The one you get when you realize that at the end of the night, the girl you've been hitting on at the bar all night might really be a man. The chill you feel when you hear the proctologist snapping on the gloves behind you. That light headed feeling of doom that overcomes you when the woman standing across from you in the white dress says "I do"..........

 

[Silver Wings]

.......somehow.......I can imagine even he shuddered just a tad when he took a step back from the drawing board. Not the good kind of shudder, mind you. The one you get when you realize that at the end of the night, the girl you've been hitting on at the bar all night might really be a man. The chill you feel when you hear the proctologist snapping on the gloves behind you. That light headed feeling of doom that overcomes you when the woman standing across from you in the white dress says "I do"..........

The 'feelin' came about him as he realised he'd drawn the wings the wrong way round !

But with true German efficiency it was too late, as they'd already started the production run..........


Heh Spanky...... are you trying to push me into defending the Hansa ? No can do buddy.

 

[CatYaaak]

Can we get back to the point. The main planes I am using for comparison outside or reliability are the II, III, and IV.

This is why you're so friggin' funny Mr. Demo pilot.....that you honestly think you can compare the two without looking like a sap. You can't even beat the perf numbers of 604 Challengers, Falcon 2000EXs, etc, OR the DOC's for any of those. Just how do you justify going so slow at more $$s per hour?

And, unlike your oompa-loompa friendly Legacy, they're airplanes normal people can actually stand up in. Here's a news flash!......people actually CARE about that, and even EXPECT it for $20+ million. You'd do better to compare the Legacy to other, smaller cross-sectioned airframes because all you have there is a low/slow flying pencil that carries a lot of gas.

In fact, everything you write regarding performance comparisons or reliablilty of either the Legacy or other aircraft are either your "feelings" or as you "imagine" them...you offer absolutely NOTHING in terms of facts.

"Whistling Shltcan of Death".....god, that's funny!

 

[Silver Wings]

"Whistling Shltcan of Death".....god, that's funny!

rest of is a point of view but that above is b...s prime order.

ERJ's/Legacy have just about 6 million hours to date.....and zero injuries/deaths associated with the aircraft......... by the way 6 million hours is a lot.......you won't of seen those sort of numbers with a Falcon/Guléfstream/Challenger fleet.....and let's face it.....they've all had 'incidents' for one reason or another.

Point is....critque the Legacy on a field of rationality......... you've been doin OK so far....... but this below the belt.

 

[banned username 2]

rest of is a point of view but that above is b...s prime order.

ERJ's/Legacy have just about 6 million hours to date.....and zero injuries/deaths associated with the aircraft......... by the way 6 million hours is a lot.......you won't of seen those sort of numbers with a Falcon/Guléfstream/Challenger fleet.....and let's face it.....they've all had 'incidents' for one reason or another.

Point is....critque the Legacy on a field of rationality......... you've been doin OK so far....... but this below the belt.

Let's remember the "Whistling Shítcan of Death" analogy came from someone who flew over 2,000 of those 6 million hours, I'd say he is a pretty dämn reliable source on the "qualities" of this tube...

 

[Silver Wings]

Let's remember the "Whistling Shítcan of Death" analogy came from someone who flew over 2,000 of those 6 million hours, I'd say he is a pretty dämn reliable source on the "qualities" of this tube...

So...let me get this right....... numbers are good for calculating Falcon/Gulfstream things............ but when the numbers go the other way, then we stop using numbers and rely on 'opinion'........

I'm glad we sort of agree.

It all boils down to opinion in the end......... we all have a different take......

Some will take a Gulfstream / Falcon and (and incrasing) some will take a Legacy........
The 'numbers' are just not going to the final part of the issue.

 

[westwind driver]

"Personally, disregarding book numbers, facts and figures, I like the legacy." Yeah, let's disregard all the facts, numbers and figures, they don't really mean anything. This is truly a pathetic argument.

As for your resale example, again, simply retarded.




.

What? I simply can't just like an aircraft just as it is? I like it. I could care less if it only went 1000 miles, to me, its still a nice plane.

 

[semperfido]

once you go G you never go back