Jetblue hiring... how and why?

[kommutrdog]

You are theoretically correct. However, your theory depends heavily on one very important assumption. An assumption that I have observed to be largely false so far at least.

What assumption would that be, I'm curious?

 

[Smarta$$]

What assumption would that be, I'm curious?

I think you have a good idea, it I think dl Aa and dual will favor blue pilots. I also think it will work to some degree. However, I have NEVER flown with any captain here that has his resume out. Some furlough recalls yes, but no new applicants. The fo's I talked to are mixed, some applying and many not. So there is probably only 25% of the JetBlue pilots actively pursuing other companies. Can change though.

 

[kommutrdog]

I think you have a good idea, it I think dl Aa and dual will favor blue pilots. I also think it will work to some degree. However, I have NEVER flown with any captain here that has his resume out. Some furlough recalls yes, but no new applicants. The fo's I talked to are mixed, some applying and many not. So there is probably only 25% of the JetBlue pilots actively pursuing other companies. Can change though.

If we start falling further and further behind (most likely) that might change.

How many LIFT awards does it take to pay a mortgage?

 

[Smarta$$]

More than I have...

 

[pilot772]

I've flown with about 7-10 Airbus captains that have Applications out to Delta, United, and or FedEx all under 45 years old. Now would they actually leave that is the question but they all have taken the time to fill out the applications fully and update them.

 

[CapnVegetto]

I can say that my experience has been different from Smarta$$. Most captains I fly with are staying, unless they are junior and young.

However, I have yet to meet a copilot that hasn't got apps out there. The universal response as to why doesn't even include pay, benefits, etc. It's always the same thing. "In the next 10 years I'm going to move up about 100 numbers." No movement. While at every legacy, you'll move up 100 numbers in a few months.

The math says go if you are in the right seat, it even says go if you are a young enough and junior enough captain. I think most guys realize this, and once the hiring starts bigtime, it's going to get real ugly.

 

[kommutrdog]

I've flown with about 7-10 Airbus captains that have Applications out to Delta, United, and or FedEx all under 45 years old. Now would they actually leave that is the question but they all have taken the time to fill out the applications fully and update them.

But, but, but...will they get LIFT awards at those places? I think that should be a determining factor. How do you "place a value" on a LIFT? You can't. The emotional/psychological benefits are simply immeasurable.

 

[ASA_Aviator]

I can say that my experience has been different from Smarta$$. Most captains I fly with are staying, unless they are junior and young.

However, I have yet to meet a copilot that hasn't got apps out there. The universal response as to why doesn't even include pay, benefits, etc. It's always the same thing. "In the next 10 years I'm going to move up about 100 numbers." No movement. While at every legacy, you'll move up 100 numbers in a few months.

The math says go if you are in the right seat, it even says go if you are a young enough and junior enough captain. I think most guys realize this, and once the hiring starts bigtime, it's going to get real ugly.

Which is exactly why I'm planning to stay. What the seniority calculator doesn't take into account is the attrition to other carriers. I'm hoping lots of people are pissed off and leave. I think everyone senior to me should go to Delta.

 

[Splert]

ASA_Aviator AKA Hoping2BKing$hitofTurdIsland.

 

[Flyby1206]

Which is exactly why I'm planning to stay. What the seniority calculator doesn't take into account is the attrition to other carriers. I'm hoping lots of people are pissed off and leave. I think everyone senior to me should go to Delta.

So if everyone else ran out of a burning house would you stick around since you'd have the whole place to yourself?

 

[fam62c]

Every pilot who leaves gets replaced with a less expensive year 1 pilot. Regionals have dealt with this for decades, when somebody leaves they replace them and life goes on. Unless JB matches the best compensation in the industry there will be attrition. Anybody who thinks the management of the company isn't prepared to accept pilot attrition isn't thinking clearly, it will be a cost/benefit decision. At what point does the cost of attrition make it worthwhile to spend money to slow atrition. For now, if you lose a pilot you hire another pilot...no problem. If you have some unhappy pilots, also no problem because you are always going to have some unhappy pilots. A lot of guys will complain and talk about leaving, far fewer will actually do it. I would expect that JB compensation will improve, but if you are waiting for the day when it matches the top of the industry you will be waiting a long time, unless of course JB gets absorbed by a carrier that is already at the top.

 

[Flyby1206]

Every pilot who leaves gets replaced with a less expensive year 1 pilot. Regionals have dealt with this for decades, when somebody leaves they replace them and life goes on. Unless JB matches the best compensation in the industry there will be attrition. Anybody who thinks the management of the company isn't prepared to accept pilot attrition isn't thinking clearly, it will be a cost/benefit decision. At what point does the cost of attrition make it worthwhile to spend money to slow atrition. For now, if you lose a pilot you hire another pilot...no problem. If you have some unhappy pilots, also no problem because you are always going to have some unhappy pilots. A lot of guys will complain and talk about leaving, far fewer will actually do it. I would expect that JB compensation will improve, but if you are waiting for the day when it matches the top of the industry you will be waiting a long time, unless of course JB gets absorbed by a carrier that is already at the top.

Good post. When things get cranking the attrition picture will be very similar to the regional airlines. Junior Captains, and Mid range and junior FOs will leave. Everyone else will stay, with a few exceptions to the rule.

 

[fam62c]

Good post. When things get cranking the attrition picture will be very similar to the regional airlines. Junior Captains, and Mid range and junior FOs will leave. Everyone else will stay, with a few exceptions to the rule.

It will look like Airtran pre 9-11.

 

[ASA_Aviator]

So if everyone else ran out of a burning house would you stick around since you'd have the whole place to yourself?

JB is not a burning house. You guys would be complaining if you worked anywhere. You guys are allowed to be unhappy, just as I'm allowed to be happy. I want all the unhappy/bitchy SOBs to leave. Especially the ones senior to me.

 

[ASA_Aviator]

ASA_Aviator AKA Hoping2BKing$hitofTurdIsland.

Funny. Look around dude. JB is hardly turd island.

 

[Flyby1206]

JB is not a burning house. You guys would be complaining if you worked anywhere. You guys are allowed to be unhappy, just as I'm allowed to be happy. I want all the unhappy/bitchy SOBs to leave. Especially the ones senior to me.

I agree, just as it was hyperbole for you to say you would stay if everyone else left, it is hyperbolic for people on the other side to think everyone would leave JB. Like I posted above, my opinion is that attrition will be mostly limited to Jr CAs, and FOs on the bottom half of the list.

I am content at jetblue, but if UAL/DAL called then I would go. If I stay at jetblue I will continue to be happy and work to improve on the areas where we need it.

 

[ASA_Aviator]

I agree, just as it was hyperbole for you to say you would stay if everyone else left, it is hyperbolic for people on the other side to think everyone would leave JB. Like I posted above, my opinion is that attrition will be mostly limited to Jr CAs, and FOs on the bottom half of the list.

I am content at jetblue, but if UAL/DAL called then I would go. If I stay at jetblue I will continue to be happy and work to improve on the areas where we need it.

Agreed. I definitely think there's room to improve. There always is in any company. But it isn't the flaming pile of poo that would have you believe.

 

[Splert]

Funny. Look around dude. JB is hardly turd island.

Compared to the worst compensated with nearly all work rules unenforceable and nearly nothing in our PEA that is non discreationary, no profit sharing with a near 9% operating margin, vacation, alter ego protection we have it just better than turd island. Best yet our ELT for the past 3 years been completely adversarial to agreeing to the basic facts.

 

[ASA_Aviator]

Compared to the worst compensated with nearly all work rules unenforceable and nearly nothing in our PEA that is non discreationary, no profit sharing with a near 9% operating margin, vacation, alter ego protection we have it just better than turd island. Best yet our ELT for the past 3 years been completely adversarial to agreeing to the basic facts.

Yeah. Still one of the best jobs out there.

A little perspective would really do you guys some good. Most captains make nearly as much as my wife does as a family physician, and quite a few make more. She works much harder, and has much more school debt. To top it all off, her job is much less stable.

In the grand scheme, we have a great deal. The whining and moaning is getting old. You sound like spoiled little teenagers. "Bobby at Delta gets more pizza than I get!!! Whaaaaaaa!!!!"

STFU

 

[Splert]

Yeah. Still one of the best jobs out there.

A little perspective would really do you guys some good. Most captains make nearly as much as my wife does as a family physician, and quite a few make more. She works much harder, and has much more school debt. To top it all off, her job is much less stable.

In the grand scheme, we have a great deal. The whining and moaning is getting old. You sound like spoiled little teenagers. "Bobby at Delta gets more pizza than I get!!! Whaaaaaaa!!!!"

STFU

Your great deal is a unwritten promise while DAL's is in a contract.

Oh great another pucknutjob comparing major airline pilot compensation to the "grand scheme" not our peers. Grand scheme is just a jacknutjob saying "you are paid more than a Target Employee so whatcha bitching about".

No wonder .... Your wife makes $160 plus while you suck it up for less than $50K. Now go hug your wife for allowing you to eat, sleep, raise kids while at the bottom of the list at BlueJet for the next 10 years. You are perfect for Bluejet since you are the b!tch of your family unit and is exactly WHY the Band of Blue hired you. You are happy with so little because your wife is the real provider. Targeted selection Nancy Boy!