JBLU cuts 5 Yr. Pilots, Fact or Fiction?

[TonyC]

hey tony,

where is the "COLLECTIVE BARGAINING" for your beloved ALPA members when they have to GIVE BACK their COLLECTIVE BARGAINING AGREEMENT??

Ignorance, lack of information, or self-imposed blindness? I don't know which of these maladies you suffer, but your last three posts bely a fundamental lack of understanding on your part, or a refusal to admit what you know.

There is no "Give back" of a Collective Bargaining Agreement. Under the Railway Labor Act, the CBA remains in effect until amended or replaced. Nobody "gives back" a CBA. Many of our ALPA brothers have found themselves in the unfortunate situation of negotiating lower pay rates and inferior work rules, but the keyword remains the same - -negotiate.

Talk to us about the negotation that ocurred with your RJ payrates. Tell us how you're going to negotiate your next workrule change.

so then what do call the actions taken by the american airline pilots, or what the delta pilots are going to do??? a "donation" to the company??

Pay attention here - - it's real simple.

Here's what it's called...


Ready???





N E G O T I A T I O N



(HINT: Something a JBLU pilot can't do.)

a CBA guarantee's you nothing. it does not guarantee you wage protection, it does not guarantee you furlough protection, it does not guarantee you a pension plan.. so please stop with the ALPA KOOD-AID by stating that the jbu pilots are helpless without one.

ask a UNITED, USAIR , DELTA, TWA pilot how they feel about their "collective bargaining power"......

Negatory, good buddy. The Railway Labor Act maintains that the CBA reamins in effect until amended or superceded.

Pay - guaranteed

Furlough protection - depends on how the CBA is worded, but whatever is in the CBA is guaranteed

Pension plan - same as furlough - guaranteed

Before you get your panties in a wad, yes, you're right, if the Company goes bankrupt or out of business, then the CBA can't possibly guarantee ANYTHING - - pay, furlough, pension - - that SHOULD go without saying, but I'm sure you'll say it, so there's your answer already - - and in a run-on sentence at THAT! I ask you, though: how does that differ from an At-Will employee? Will an At-Will employee get any of those guarantees if the company goes under?



Now, before you accuse me of drinking ALPA KOOL-AID (Oh, the irony is thick here) go back and read my posts. Where did I say you were helpless without a CBA?

(HINT: Nowhere)

I did say that you are At-Will employees. The fact of the matter is, you're just a little bit better off than an At-Will employee since you have your Pilot Employment Contract. An At-Will employee could be termintated because he parted his hair on the wrong side, wore the wrong cologne, or for no reason at all - - as long as it doesn't violate those pesky Equal Employment guidelines, you know. At least you have some restrictions on THAT.


Now, as to what those pilots think about their CBA's? Well, I'll bet you a billion dollars that without their CBA's, Delta pilots would be making less than 60% of what they're making today. Without the CBA, hundreds more Delta pilots would be unemployed. Without the CBA's, all of those pilots you mentioned would be FAR worse off. All of those pilot groups have weathered terrible times at their companies, and their CBA's have helped them weather those times. I do not for a milisecond think they would be better off without their CBA's. The CBA's did not hurt the companies. The unions did not hurt the companies. The Economy, poor management strategies, and terrorism have hurt the companies.


Now, if you stop being so defensive and analyze what I've written, you'll realize I haven't bashed you or your contract. In fact, I think it's a bit generous in some respects. I answered some honest questions with straightforward answers - - that seems to be something you and many of your fellow crewmembers are hesitant to do. A Shakespeare quote comes to mind about protesteth(-ing) too much. (I hated that Shakespeare stuff - - seems to me he's WAY overrated, but that's another forum )

 

[B6Busdriver]

B6Busdriver, That info came directly from AL.

AL or Al?

 

[Ace757]

AL or Al?

It was Al

 

[B6Busdriver]

It was Al

Well then not true. The airplane will be initially based in JFK. It isn't possible to guarantee where future bases will exist on a brand new airplane.

 

[B6Busdriver]

The JBLU guys are largely considered the sell outs of the industry.

To operate a non union pilot group using a 5 yr contract is simply a union busting move. After getting enough BuFu s and figuring out that if you ever want a decent life you MUST have a Collective Bargaining Agreement some guy is gonna try to bring a union in here. And you know whats gonna happen? He's not gonna get his contract renewed. Pure and simple. They arent exactly gonna fire him. They just aren't gonna 'renew' his employment. The party ended at JBLU long ago when the stock price headed south and reality set in on the work rules issues. The only question now is how much more damage they can do to this ailing industry while theyre here.

US Airways, United, Jetblue...............somethings gotta give.

4 years from now at least 1 and maybe all three of these companies won't exist. If JBLU is still around it will only be because they finally COMPLETELY destroyed the piloting profession. Even the SWA guys think theyre a joke.

Anyone interested in responding to his post please review his vitriolic and sarcastic snippets from the past.

 

[FLB717]

Nitro,

First I understand your point of reference, but i would be more than blown over if Jetblue was gone in 5 years. I don't see it.

Jblucapt,

My friend you have a great company and i am sure if you can from another 121 airline you had a bad time with ALPA. or if you wandered in from your F15 you need to read and understand the Railway labor Act. It is a VERY dry read but well worth you time. Lay off the Blue-Aid for the time you read the law to get a clear understanding of your rights and lack of from that act. But understand I do feel you and the others of JBLU have a great company, good pay (but the EJ) so while I stand with that thought, Im just asking you too keep the eye on the ball. because with no CBA, fortunes of today have far less strength to see you in the future. I for one though do not see JBLU as a sell out, many other companies and pilot groups share that honor far and above JBLU or AAI.

DonV and Tony, yup!

 

[wndshr]

too funny

funny thing is that all of these guys trashing JB on this board would give a left cohuna to work there!!! ironic! LOL

what is it? 10,000 apps on file WITH quals!

 

[FLB717]

True Dat!

 

[TonyC]

funny thing is that all of these guys trashing JB on this board would give a left cohuna to work there!!! ironic! LOL

Yeah, like me. I'd emasculate myself to take a 70% cut in pay, give up all of my workrules, trash my retirement, and enter the independent contractor market so I could fly French jets with satellite TV! Whoopie!


NOT



Seriously... I believe that was BIT of an egotistical thing to claim.

 

[lowecur]

Yeah, like me. I'd emasculate myself to take a 70% cut in pay, give up all of my workrules, trash my retirement, and enter the independent contractor market so I could fly French jets with satellite TV! Whoopie!


NOT



Seriously... I believe that was BIT of an egotistical thing to claim.

Hey, somebodies got to work the graveyard shift. Just how do you have any kind of a sleep schedule unless you are a full-time night owl?

Before you gloat too much, let me just make one of my predictions. In the market there is a phrase they use when the market goes down. They say eventually the market "gets them all." It's used when some individual companies feel they are immune to the overall cycle. Don't be so smug, you can bet the cargo business will feel this eventually. All you need is one company to get the ball rolling, like DHL.