JB Candidates in phase II

[curtaindriver]

Easy to throw stones from that Airbus left seat. You're not frustrated to hear Southwest and Alaska picking up adding routes from a market (AUS) that we were going to develop while there's crickets on our end? Probably doesn't matter when you're gonna just stick to your 12 days a month of Red-eye turns and then hob-nob at FSC on your days off. Maybe you're one of those "project" guys getting 90 hours a month to hang out in the office?

As a matter of fact I do share my pearls of wisdom of with my chain of command about ideas to improve our service and network. I'm passionate about the airline and my career, and it's a different looking place from the right seat of the commuter jet (I'm doing 20 legs in 6 days this week). Thanks for being a smart-ass.

We are growing by 17 airplanes in 16 months, that's 11% in less than a year and a half. SWA is anticipating 0 growth thru 2012 (reference 2nd quarter earnings call). What more do you want here? You want to grow so quick and put us back in the red?

CD

Oh yeah, I don't fly the Airbus, and work more than 12 days.
Vote ALPA

 

[av8tor4239]

Anyways, 40-90 new hires by Dec.

From the pilot call yesterday.

Good Luck to all

:beer: hope i am one

 

[Hair-on-Fire]

Easy to throw stones from that Airbus left seat. You're not frustrated to hear Southwest and Alaska picking up adding routes from a market (AUS) that we were going to develop while there's crickets on our end? Probably doesn't matter when you're gonna just stick to your 12 days a month of Red-eye turns and then hob-nob at FSC on your days off. Maybe you're one of those "project" guys getting 90 hours a month to hang out in the office?

As a matter of fact I do share my pearls of wisdom of with my chain of command about ideas to improve our service and network. I'm passionate about the airline and my career, and it's a different looking place from the right seat of the commuter jet (I'm doing 20 legs in 6 days this week). Thanks for being a smart-ass.

Relax. Anger will kill you.

 

[Cheeta]

Hot off the press! From the VP of Flt Ops....Training will start in Sept with Pilots out of the current pool who have completed phase 2. Hiring will restart in Dec at a rate of 20 a month for a protracted period of time into 2011.

 

[8vATE]

Easy to throw stones from that Airbus left seat. You're not frustrated to hear Southwest and Alaska picking up adding routes from a market (AUS) that we were going to develop while there's crickets on our end? Probably doesn't matter when you're gonna just stick to your 12 days a month of Red-eye turns and then hob-nob at FSC on your days off. Maybe you're one of those "project" guys getting 90 hours a month to hang out in the office?

As a matter of fact I do share my pearls of wisdom of with my chain of command about ideas to improve our service and network. I'm passionate about the airline and my career, and it's a different looking place from the right seat of the commuter jet (I'm doing 20 legs in 6 days this week). Thanks for being a smart-ass.

This company IS growing.... just not where YOU think it should... since you're so smart.

Go talk to Robin Hayes.... Look at the growth numbers in Boston and the Caribbean.

Or maybe you're too busy shooting your mouth off. And the right seat of your "commuter jet" E190 pays 90% of Airbus rates..... go find that someplace else.

 

[clickclickboom]

This company IS growing.... just not where YOU think it should... since you're so smart.

Go talk to Robin Hayes.... Look at the growth numbers in Boston and the Caribbean.

Or maybe you're too busy shooting your mouth off. And the right seat of your "commuter jet" E190 pays 90% of Airbus rates..... go find that someplace else.

Cut the guy a break.. he is not making over $200 an hr in premium but you are.. your world has a litle more blue in it than his..

 

[Vastly Underemp]

This company IS growing.... just not where YOU think it should... since you're so smart.

Go talk to Robin Hayes.... Look at the growth numbers in Boston and the Caribbean.

Or maybe you're too busy shooting your mouth off. And the right seat of your "commuter jet" E190 pays 90% of Airbus rates..... go find that someplace else.

Sorry guy, but no one has actually stated anything definitive about growth. Yes, we are taking delivery of more airframes, but I'm sure you know that the company has also historically dumped older airframes off the bottom of the list when we get new ones. The "40 to 90" number doesn't even meet the need for this summer, nevermind allow for some seniority list movement for any but the smallest percentage.

And what happened to the 7th bus that was being returned from BlueWings? How can a 9 year old aircraft be so unfit for duty that it has become unusable?

VU

 

[Splert]

Hot off the press! From the VP of Flt Ops....Training will start in Sept with Pilots out of the current pool who have completed phase 2. Hiring will restart in Dec at a rate of 20 a month for a protracted period of time into 2011.

...should be...

..we expect...

...likely...

IMO will we hire soon...yes.

But as of the latest email nothing is firm. Sandy is waiting for the okay from the CFO. Remember, JetBlue told Wall St they will recoup the pilot pay package though work rule efficiency and that it the primary concern.

Your QOL is not a issue and for those that are close to timing out will be forced to bid reserve so that a former reserve who is NOT close to timing out can fly the as a line holder.

There is still lots of 'flexibility' within the the work force in terms of 'efficiency'.

I think we will see a trickle of hiring so that the headline will read "We are hiring" but the numbers will be small and new hires will not appear on the line until the 1st quarter of 2011.

 

[aewanabe]

This company IS growing.... just not where YOU think it should... since you're so smart.

Go talk to Robin Hayes.... Look at the growth numbers in Boston and the Caribbean.

Or maybe you're too busy shooting your mouth off. And the right seat of your "commuter jet" E190 pays 90% of Airbus rates..... go find that someplace else.

You may not know this, but mere line-pilots are STRONGLY discouraged from "talking" to people without following the chain of command. I've done so successfully, BTW with some customer service and engineering-related ideas, so I can speak first-hand to the current process for bucking stuff up the line. Really, go find 90 percent of Airbus rates somewhere else? That's weak, but sure: Delta for example, pays DC9 at 93 percent of Airbus rates; Airtran, same rate for both jets (737 and 717); Hawaiian, the 717 pays 88 percent of wide-body rates for goodness sakes (but you knew all that since you're so smart, right?)! Of course, since Douglas built the -9 and 717 and Embraer builds the 190, those aren't valid comparisons, right?

Anyway, thanks for being a smart-aleck. And yes, I'd love to see some growth outside BOS and the Caribbean, as would those few business travelers whom actually try to use us as their preferred carrier. It's tough with the gaping holes between the coasts.

BTW my right-seat 190 pay is nowhere near 90 percent of the Bus left-seat, which is a seat our growth and retirement numbers indicate I might reach around 2030 or so. Sorry it offends you that us peions are passionate about perceived mis-steps by the company, or improving the position we work from. BTW, exactly how are we going to staff 10 jets with 40-90 pilots? You think maybe the net growth might be less than deliveries (like it has been every year since 2006)? Nah.....

Back on topic, for those in Phase II we hope to see you soon. Even near the bottom of the barrel and with the frustrations I've voiced, it's a pretty decent place to work; there are definite blemishes that will likely be solved only when we organize. In the mean-time, you may note some of our very senior brethren take it personally when we don't drink the blue kool-aide....

 

[CLARKGRSWOLD]

That would be FANTASTIC, I'm wearing holes in the carpet from pacing

Not to be debbie downer, but are you really that excited to sit RSV in JFK on the 190 as an FO for the next 8 -10 years ? JB is the future USAIR 15 year upgrades and zero movement. Good luck to you though !

 

[flydoc]

Your point is accurate. I'm glad there are some new guys joining us, but please be realistic and have managed expectations. Your hope to improve your QOL once you are here will be very much dependent on Work Rule changes and the pay in your IOE seat. There will be very little chance for upgrade for quite some time. You will sit reserve FOR A LONG TIME. If you live in New York, Boston, Orlando, FLL, or So.Cal, bless your heart. You will probably be very happy (initially). Being on reserve every weekend and holiday for about 5 years will start to wear thin.

I've been with the company for about 5 years and can say that I am honestly never planning on upgrading here. At our growth/retirement rate a seat won't even be available for me for at least another 5 years. And then it will be sitting reserve probably until I retire. No thanks. I don't really want to be in my late 50's waiting for a callout while sleeping in a crashpad in NY, just to fly a red-eye turn to DR. But that's me. Your mileage may differ....

 

[amcflyboy]

I submitted my application to JetBlue on June 2nd, and my status as of today still shows "Under Consideration." Is this good? Can I expect some form of a notification for an interview?

 

[BeachBummer]

I submitted my application to JetBlue on June 2nd, and my status as of today still shows "Under Consideration." Is this good? Can I expect some form of a notification for an interview?

I wouldn't hold my breath! aah, but seriously.

Under consideration is good, but you missed the boat for this year imo. They looked at 300 at the open house then interviewed 150. We have a pool and are supposed to bring on 40-90 by dec. C-130 time is good so keep updating, "they" say it matters.

Good luck man!

 

[amcflyboy]

Thanks for the heads up, I'll keep my eyes open. How do I keep updating my time by the way?

 

[Jet41]

FYI - Back ground checks (Phase II) only started recently. The reality is we would have like to begun classes this month but after the initial wave of interviews Phase II was put on hold. I guess JB didn't want to pay for back ground checks until they knew the exact numbers. Regardless classes slated to start in Sept. 20 per month through this year and anticipated into 2011.

 

[BeachBummer]

Thanks for the heads up, I'll keep my eyes open. How do I keep updating my time by the way?

umm? The internet! It's in there some where.

FYI - Back ground checks (Phase II) only started recently. The reality is we would have like to begun classes this month but after the initial wave of interviews Phase II was put on hold. I guess JB didn't want to pay for back ground checks until they knew the exact numbers. Regardless classes slated to start in Sept. 20 per month through this year and anticipated into 2011.

This is good news!

 

[8vATE]

You may not know this, but mere line-pilots are STRONGLY discouraged from "talking" to people without following the chain of command. I've done so successfully, BTW with some customer service and engineering-related ideas, so I can speak first-hand to the current process for bucking stuff up the line. Really, go find 90 percent of Airbus rates somewhere else? That's weak, but sure: Delta for example, pays DC9 at 93 percent of Airbus rates; Airtran, same rate for both jets (737 and 717); Hawaiian, the 717 pays 88 percent of wide-body rates for goodness sakes (but you knew all that since you're so smart, right?)! Of course, since Douglas built the -9 and 717 and Embraer builds the 190, those aren't valid comparisons, right?

Anyway, thanks for being a smart-aleck. And yes, I'd love to see some growth outside BOS and the Caribbean, as would those few business travelers whom actually try to use us as their preferred carrier. It's tough with the gaping holes between the coasts.

BTW my right-seat 190 pay is nowhere near 90 percent of the Bus left-seat, which is a seat our growth and retirement numbers indicate I might reach around 2030 or so. Sorry it offends you that us peions are passionate about perceived mis-steps by the company, or improving the position we work from. BTW, exactly how are we going to staff 10 jets with 40-90 pilots? You think maybe the net growth might be less than deliveries (like it has been every year since 2006)?

There are more opportunities to have face to face time with the Executive Leadership of this airline than ANYWHERE I've ever heard of. Not that that is a solution to our issues, but it is part of the culture here.

I wasn't talking about DC-9 pay or 717 pay. You can go that route if you want. I specifically stated a fact that E190 pay is based on 90 % of A320 pay. The highest E190 pay in the industry. Really, your F/O pay isn't 90% of an A320 CAPT pay? Wow? That's amazing?
A320 Capt pay is the ""master rate". E190 Capt pay is 90% of A320 Capt pay. F/O rates are a fixed % of each representative capt seat's pay. Understand?

I have 15 years of first hand ALPA experience... and organizing is going to solve all of our problems? Really hot shot?
Let's see... I know of one ALPA airline that got stapled to the bottom of another airline. Another ALPA carrier dissolved its A Plan pension and is still operating under split contracts at substandard pay. And how many broken promises, no furlough clauses, guaranteed fleet sizes and scope clauses have been broken? GO ALPA!

If you would get your head out of your chute and go out and see the reasons Marketing and Planning are doing what they are doing, you would get some answers to your questions. All I see you doing is spouting off your mouth and crying about why we're not flying to Austin and Atlanta.

 

[8vATE]

Sorry guy, but no one has actually stated anything definitive about growth. Yes, we are taking delivery of more airframes, but I'm sure you know that the company has also historically dumped older airframes off the bottom of the list when we get new ones. The "40 to 90" number doesn't even meet the need for this summer, nevermind allow for some seniority list movement for any but the smallest percentage.

And what happened to the 7th bus that was being returned from BlueWings? How can a 9 year old aircraft be so unfit for duty that it has become unusable?

VU

They are going to deal off the bottom of the deck... about 20 too many Airbus's coming in the next 3-5 years. The 6 A320's + 4 E190s this year seem to be net growth. But the dialed back utilization we have had and the screwed up staffing model is fogging things up a bit. It appears that the Airbus utilization will shift around some. One of the 6 A320s is going to take an E190 line as there will be a maintenance mod line start up. The one A320 that was in a shambles.... I don't know what happened to it. Could have been some sort of serious airframe issue... or mismanaged maintenance records? Who knows... it was over someplace in Russia.

 

[aewanabe]

There are more opportunities to have face to face time with the Executive Leadership of this airline than ANYWHERE I've ever heard of. Not that that is a solution to our issues, but it is part of the culture here.

I wasn't talking about DC-9 pay or 717 pay. You can go that route if you want. I specifically stated a fact that E190 pay is based on 90 % of A320 pay. The highest E190 pay in the industry. Really, your F/O pay isn't 90% of an A320 CAPT pay? Wow? That's amazing?
A320 Capt pay is the ""master rate". E190 Capt pay is 90% of A320 Capt pay. F/O rates are a fixed % of each representative capt seat's pay. Understand?

I have 15 years of first hand ALPA experience... and organizing is going to solve all of our problems? Really hot shot?
Let's see... I know of one ALPA airline that got stapled to the bottom of another airline. Another ALPA carrier dissolved its A Plan pension and is still operating under split contracts at substandard pay. And how many broken promises, no furlough clauses, guaranteed fleet sizes and scope clauses have been broken? GO ALPA!

If you would get your head out of your chute and go out and see the reasons Marketing and Planning are doing what they are doing, you would get some answers to your questions. All I see you doing is spouting off your mouth and crying about why we're not flying to Austin and Atlanta.

Great SA focusing on the micro vs. macro issues. YOU specifically mentioned E190, so other jets with similar gross weights and missions don't count. Right, got it. Good thing the PVC and company didn't define PSIA that way... As far as fleet planning and growth go, it's funny how explosive growth was OK when it got you into a captain seat, now we need to be restrained. Got it. I actually agree with the restraint, but again you fail to see that the stagnation looks a lot different from the bottom than the top.

I defy you to find a post where I mention going to ATL. That was a fortress hub where DL promptly defended and drove us out. Since you're so chummy with the ELT you obviously
know the difference between that and a focus city such as AUS with point to point market potential and no single dominant carrier, right?

Nowhere have I said ALPA would be a panacea. I have said they would give us a voice we lack as a group. But of course, ALPA caused the furloughs and lost pensions, not 9/11, recessions and fuel-price escalation. Silly me.

 

[Splert]

A320 Capt pay is the ""master rate". E190 Capt pay is 90% of A320 Capt pay. F/O rates are a fixed % of each representative capt seat's pay. Understand?

Where does it say that in our contract?

It doesn't!

Understand?

You were told a story and liked it, so you are repeating it.

 

[kellwolf]

The math on the 90% checks out. The "fixed" percentage for FOs? Not so much. First year us about 34% of CA, 2nd year is about 49%, 3rd year 57%, 4th 61% and 5th 63%. That's a pretty varied "fixed" percentage. The percentages match for both fleet types, so the formula for arriving at FO pay is certainly off of a percentage, but it looks like the percentage changes from year to year. To me, a "fixed" percentage would be "FO pay is 60% of CA pay."

 

[curtaindriver]

The math on the 90% checks out. The "fixed" percentage for FOs? Not so much. First year us about 34% of CA, 2nd year is about 49%, 3rd year 57%, 4th 61% and 5th 63%. That's a pretty varied "fixed" percentage. The percentages match for both fleet types, so the formula for arriving at FO pay is certainly off of a percentage, but it looks like the percentage changes from year to year. To me, a "fixed" percentage would be "FO pay is 60% of CA pay."

Do some homework. Go look at every other legacy carrier and how they calculate FO pay. It pretty much follows our model, or the other way around. Read the PCRB from 2008, that's where the numbers came from.......studying and comparing other airlines method of pay.

CD

Vote ALPA

 

[curtaindriver]

Your point is accurate. I'm glad there are some new guys joining us, but please be realistic and have managed expectations. Your hope to improve your QOL once you are here will be very much dependent on Work Rule changes and the pay in your IOE seat. There will be very little chance for upgrade for quite some time. You will sit reserve FOR A LONG TIME. If you live in New York, Boston, Orlando, FLL, or So.Cal, bless your heart. You will probably be very happy (initially). Being on reserve every weekend and holiday for about 5 years will start to wear thin.

I've been with the company for about 5 years and can say that I am honestly never planning on upgrading here. At our growth/retirement rate a seat won't even be available for me for at least another 5 years. And then it will be sitting reserve probably until I retire. No thanks. I don't really want to be in my late 50's waiting for a callout while sleeping in a crashpad in NY, just to fly a red-eye turn to DR. But that's me. Your mileage may differ....

I'm confused, I've been with the company for about 5 years and have been a captain for 4, off reserve for 2 1/2. What happened with your bid?

CD

 

[kellwolf]

Do some homework. Go look at every other legacy carrier and how they calculate FO pay. It pretty much follows our model, or the other way around. Read the PCRB from 2008, that's where the numbers came from.......studying and comparing other airlines method of pay.

CD

Vote ALPA

Oh, I'm aware of that. I was just pointing out that the FO pay being a fixed percentage of the CA pay wasn't an entirely true statement.

 

[flydoc]

I'm confused, I've been with the company for about 5 years and have been a captain for 4, off reserve for 2 1/2. What happened with your bid?

CD

Not sure you've noticed, but 190's have gone kinda senior lately... I expect that to continue. Don't you?

 

[curtaindriver]

Not sure you've noticed, but 190's have gone kinda senior lately... I expect that to continue. Don't you?

Absolutely, I figure 20 planes for me to move up at all. Just responding to someone with my same seniority saying no upgrade.......could have, but obviously didn't. There are 190 Capt. with just over 4 years.

CD

 

[Splert]

The math on the 90% checks out. The "fixed" percentage for FOs? Not so much. First year us about 34% of CA, 2nd year is about 49%, 3rd year 57%, 4th 61% and 5th 63%. That's a pretty varied "fixed" percentage. The percentages match for both fleet types, so the formula for arriving at FO pay is certainly off of a percentage, but it looks like the percentage changes from year to year. To me, a "fixed" percentage would be "FO pay is 60% of CA pay."

Nothing in our PEA says that rates will be 90/66-60%.

We can work backwards to find the percentage but the percentage is not in our agreement.

I would expect the next contract for the E190 to be less than 90% of the A320 CA because certain select CBCers are already rumbling that was to rich even though they proved to themselves that it was industry standard.

 

[BeachBummer]

All this 90-60-66% talk is moot. They gave us this last year to quell an uprising. NOTHING states that it can will or should stay that way. Well all the promises that followed have been nothing but lip service and lies, work arounds and well placed delays.

Soon we will not have to beg for scraps, we will negotiate what is the best available.

Vote early vote often.

It's just business.

 

[Splert]

First new hire class will be in September. I think it will be held on or about the 8th...

This was said by VP of OPs but he doesn't make the decision.

The CFO a week or so ago said that we 'plan' on 'netting' 8 aircraft a year though 2016.

He makes the decision.

Good luck to all new hires. If you live in base, all we be okay if you can live on reserve guarantee for 2-3 years.

 

[coogebeachhotel]

This CFO is calling the shots. Barger out busy getting new international feed. It is concerning he says 'Jetblue wants to fund all growth through cash flow' . Capital intensive industries do not fund all growth through free cash flow. This is not a low barrier to entry arena. Would any CFO fund an automobile or steel factory with free cash flow? The place would never get off the ground. His comments have been cryptic.

CFOs take over when the BOD says fatten this cattle up for the ranchers auction.
A very influential CFO took over CAL. 6 months later shazam...............