Is a pilot worth anything without a degree?

[LXJ31]

While a degree doesn't make one "better" than another, it certainly doesn't hurt to have it. I didn't finish my BS until recently and its one of the best decisions I've made. Besides, how much television can you watch on the overnights? Take a laptop, your textbooks and do schoolwork; I've seen every episode of Seinfeld anyway.

Some of the classes are a real grind, lots of homework and dry material. But some of the classes can be fascinating; philosophy classes were my favorite.

I took the untraditional route; college dropout, flight instructed, flew cargo etc. My only regret is that I did not start classes sooner, but online courses were pretty rare until the last three or four years.

I also happen to think that companies that do not require a degree, or at least prefer them strongly, probably do not hold their flight crews in much regard. Let the management do the thinking, you just show up and do as your told.

EDIT: This WSJ article discusses the pros and cons of an online degree.
http://www.collegejournal.com/careersqa/choosingschool/20040924-school-qa.html

 

[Gulfstream 200]

While a degree doesn't make one "better" than another, it certainly doesn't hurt to have it. I didn't finish my BS until recently and its one of the best decisions I've made. Besides, how much television can you watch on the overnights? Take a laptop, your textbooks and do schoolwork; I've seen every episode of Seinfeld anyway.

Some of the classes are a real grind, lots of homework and dry material. But some of the classes can be fascinating; philosophy classes were my favorite.

I took the untraditional route; college dropout, flight instructed, flew cargo etc. My only regret is that I did not start classes sooner, but online courses were pretty rare until the last three or four years.

I also happen to think that companies that do not require a degree, or at least prefer them strongly, probably do not hold their flight crews in much regard. Let the management do the thinking, you just show up and do as your told.

EDIT: This WSJ article discusses the pros and cons of an online degree.
http://www.collegejournal.com/careersqa/choosingschool/20040924-school-qa.html

well said!

gotta love it if your company also picks up the tab for your online degrees that you can do in hotels on overnights! nothing beats getting paid to get a free education.

heck, overnights are about the only time I get classwork done anymore....

"what did you do in London?"..."homework"...

(Be sure to keep FI.com in another window to catch up on the dirt also)

 

[pilotyip]

G200 are you agreeing with me, supporting do your degree on-line while flying full time? BTW LXJ31, do you place SWA and Jet Blue in the lower class companies that do not require a degree? 15% of the pilot hired at JB on 4-yr. degree, 10% at SWA no 4 yr. degree. 25% at USA Jet no 4-yr degree.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

G200 are you agreeing with me, supporting do your degree on-line while flying full time? BTW LXJ31, do you place SWA and Jet Blue in the lower class companies that do not require a degree? 15% of the pilot hired at JB on 4-yr. degree, 10% at SWA no 4 yr. degree. 25% at USA Jet no 4-yr degree.

You hear what you want old guy!

extended degrees YIP. Free - its on the employer. But rememeber, you have to GET the job where the employer pays the tuition FIRST.

15%?

10%?

those aren't great odds YIP.

USA JET is your best chance at 25%? No offense....but NO THANKS.

again, the choice is yours. Some might find this very suitable. Many dont.

I think those odds you quoted speak volumes as to the desire to have a 4yr degree before attempting to make it in aviation. But no, NOT REQUIRED. I also bet I can do better than 10% on a roulette table in Vegas.

Does USA JET have tuition reimbursement? IMHO many companies that dont are afraid of losing thier cheap labor....but if they do, might be a way for someone to get out of there without banking on the 10% thing? everyone should take advantage of this.

Others might say avoid USA JET type places altogether by having the requirements checked before the journey begins.

 

[TurboS7]

I have 4 years of college but no degree. I work for a charter outfit flying a 737-800, as a captain I make about 100K per year. FO pay is about half of that. You don't need a degree to fly here just the flight time and experience. Not having a degree I am sure kept me out of the majors in my younger years, the competition is brisk and my stuff went to the non-degree pile from there to the circular file. I do have my Airframe and Powerplant which has been very useful in getting corp jobs. My problem is that when I get out of aviation I will have to make my living at home depo selling toilets or something like that.

 

[CaptainMark]

Actually Capt Mark my Falcon auto loads, I open the door and say "What time will you be back sir" and then the cargo unloads. I open the door about the time the "Sir" guy said he would be back and the cargo then loads itself again. This cargo only likes to fly during the in daytime on weekdays. It is the fastest growing portion of our business.

do you have to pick up all the crushed peanuts on the floor and the drink cups?

 

[LXJ31]

G200 are you agreeing with me, supporting do your degree on-line while flying full time? BTW LXJ31, do you place SWA and Jet Blue in the lower class companies that do not require a degree? 15% of the pilot hired at JB on 4-yr. degree, 10% at SWA no 4 yr. degree. 25% at USA Jet no 4-yr degree.

No offense, but wouldn't those percentages indicate that those companies "strongly prefer" a college degree, kind of like what I said? I would bet that the small percentage of people who do get hired at those companies probably had something else significant going for them like nepotism or some unique skill sets.

In addition to making yourself more marketable for higher paying jobs in and out of aviation, even if you never earned an extra dime for it, its beneficial for your own personal development and satisfaction. (Especially if your company helps foot the bill...)

 

[kman]

Timing and who you know is more important than a degree.

Two guys who went to the same high school together.

First guys goes to ERAU, and also gets an MBA. Gets laid off my two majors, 1 regional and two corporate companies. Who is now giving up and is looking for a job for the last last 6 six months thats not flying related.

Second guy get his CFI two months after high school, gets a corp gig two years later and gets hired at southwest 3 years later.

Its all a crapshoot, Timing, Who you Know, and Luck determine your career. I know 6 guys who are working or have worked and the majors (UAL,SWA,AA,USAIR,CAL), 3 guys did not have a degree. 3 of that 6 are now furloughed ( 2 of them have degrees ).

If the airline or company you want to work for requires a degree, get one. If not I would be more concerned about making the right contacts, quality time.

It is not put any importance on degrees, It just that with my experience, I have found that luck,contacts, and timing will have a greater impact on your career.

I can only hope looking back when I retire, I can say I did the best I could with what I had.

 

[bubbers44]

I just retired from a major without a college degree and so did half of my friends. So making over 200K per year does not require a college degree. And getting over a million lump sum did not require a college degree for me and half my friends. Those who insist it does are not dealing with reality.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

I just retired from a major without a college degree and so did half of my friends. So making over 200K per year does not require a college degree. And getting over a million lump sum did not require a college degree for me and half my friends. Those who insist it does are not dealing with reality.

hey Mr Alzheimers, what year were you hired?

Things have changed a bit since 1952.

Consider yourself the last of the lucky, getting hired out of high school and 200K+ in the "golden years" may have been the norm in your time -- not so anymore or for the concievable future IMHO. and pensions...yeah we know how those are fairing....

Its a whole new ballgame today - and its not pretty.

 

[CaptainMark]

I just retired from a major without a college degree and so did half of my friends. So making over 200K per year does not require a college degree. And getting over a million lump sum did not require a college degree for me and half my friends. Those who insist it does are not dealing with reality.

yeah...you would not even be able to apply anywhere but jetusa nowadays...and a million lumpsum....big deal...i almost have that now and i have 23 years to go....enjoy that retirement..are u going back to college?

 

[pilotyip]

Tution Reimbursement anyone

USA Jet has an employee tution reimbursement progrm, many of our pilots use it for both the BA/BS and Masters. It goes along with proving the CASS program for our pilots, it one of things you do to make it the best place possible to work in its segment of the industry. BTW bubbers ignore G200 and Capt Mark they are both kids in their thirties and have a ways to go to have any hindsite. BTW (2) G-200 how is the CASS program woking at your place.

 

[pilotyip]

Let me give you the background on the college degree thing. I do not judge a man by his degree, where he lives, or what he does for a living. I judge a man on the content of his character. I find the college degrees only crowd here, a bit arrogant, a smacking of if you do not have a degree you are not as good as me. I know too many people who are successful and fine men who do not have a degrees, I know many people with degrees who will never make any impact upon anything. I know too many pilots without degrees who I consider some of the most successful people I know I admire them and the lives they have built. So I bait, about the non-importance of the college degree in this business. I think this sets off the college degree only crowd because it distorts their view of what they have done. Secondarily my pilot heroes did not have college degrees and they performed feats that would test the metal of anyone. They flew in WWII, George Bush I in the Pacific, the 10,000’s of B-17 and B-24 pilots in Europe, and the C-46 pilots over the hump in China. I meet these guys on the air show circuit, they come to see the C-47 and B-17, and I ask them about their adventures during the war. I am in awe of what they did. How can anyone say these guys without degrees were not as good as today’s degreed pilots?

 

[sluminginpit]

Well I guess one thing for sure is that a degree does not teach class! G200 and CaptMark, you guys are such studs! You get on these boards and spout off your opinions so matter of factly! People have reasons for not going to college, maybe money, kids or others.

CapMark, why did you ignore my comment? Hired a FedEx at 25 with no Military, come on like you did'nt know someone, maybe Daddy?

You guys both should be proud of your positions in life, very impressive, but come on guys why the need to make others feel like crap? Your wife looking for something you don't have? Maybe you think you can find it here!

For me I have no degree and love my life! I will never be CaptMark at Fed Ex but so what, not my type of flying. I don't even like this career, its full of hassel, disapointment, backstabbing and greed to name a few.

To each his own!

BTW, CaptMark how have you been at Fed Ex for 11 yrs and only have 8000 hours? Wait, Must have been the degree!

 

[CaptainMark]

BTW, CaptMark how have you been at Fed Ex for 11 yrs and only have 8000 hours? Wait, Must have been the degree!

well fyi..fedex pilots only average about 250 to 350 hours a year...does that explain it...and a degree was a requirement to get hired..so back to the original question...get your degree if u have the means and good luck!...and i am so happy..living the dream...just responding to comments..no big deal...i hope u guys are all happy doing what u r doing...if you feel bad..sorry....u should have gotten that degree...and class...u r right..don't have any..just a dirtbag trash hauler who was ridiculed for wanting to work at fedex some years ago....enjoy the rest of your weekend...it is a beautiful night in socal on my 3 day layover..time for a cigar...

 

[FN FAL]

I just retired from a major without a college degree and so did half of my friends. So making over 200K per year does not require a college degree. And getting over a million lump sum did not require a college degree for me and half my friends. Those who insist it does are not dealing with reality.

I hear what you're saying bubbers, but on the same token...if I was to grab a just ready to retire mainline guy and asked them about the job market and how to apply, they wouldn't have a clue.

It doesn't mean they are dumb, it just means they are far removed from the reality that most of us upward looking technicians face today. It's the same with any career. Ask any Police or Fire department employee that possesses the rank of Sgt or above how to get a job in their field and they'll have to get a google to answer your question.

 

[sluminginpit]

How do you only fly 250-330 hrs per year and make 200k? At 11 yrs your pay is $198 per hour, must be nice per diem.

 

[CaptainMark]

A-300 CAP 293:34
F/O 3797:48

there is 10 and 1/2 years on the bus...i year on the panel of the 72

do some research..we get paid credit hours..not block..we get paid around 1000 hours a year credit and only block around 250-350...great work rules...

 

[FN FAL]

How do you only fly 250-330 hrs per year and make 200k? At 11 yrs your pay is $198 per hour, must be nice per diem.

He requested that he be paid in dimes?

 

[sluminginpit]

No reason to research, don't care, can't get hired there without the degree! Not that I would want to.

Still no answer on how you got hired at 25, with no military?