I need copies of CBAs from other carriers

[SWA Bubba]

If management "offers" to "help" us form an in-house union it will be nothing more than a trojan horse. Beware of executives bearing gifts to its employees.

Also, an in-house union will be weak and way underfunded. CBAs mean nothing without a legitimate way of enforcing them.

Not sure this is or has to be true. American has an in-house union. Southwest pilots have always had an in-house union, even when we were JetBlue's size. We only have 1% dues, and we always have enough money. in fact, our reserve fund is getting so big, they're talking about a dues holiday or reduction. Guess it all depends.

Bubba

 

[Ski-N-Fly]

Not sure this is or has to be true. American has an in-house union. Southwest pilots have always had an in-house union, even when we were JetBlue's size. We only have 1% dues, and we always have enough money. in fact, our reserve fund is getting so big, they're talking about a dues holiday or reduction. Guess it all depends.

Bubba

One major reason SWA's In House works is because Herb Kelleher welcomed it. Therefore, the SWA pilots benefitted from being able to build a stong In House union while also having a labor friendly relationship with management. JetBlue's management is extremely anti-union and would crush another In House drive, as they did a few years ago.

American Airlines' pilots were formerly represented by ALPA for many years and therefore already had a strong foundation from which to start the APA.

JetBlue pilots have absolutely nothing. ALPA is our fastest and best route to a CBA at this point in time. We need representation yesterday. As each day passes without representation, this pilot group becomes more and more vulnerable.

Send in a card. Tell your friends to send in a card.

 

[kommutrdog]

This ^^^^^^^^

In-house union at bluejet is DOA.

 

[SWA Bubba]

One major reason SWA's In House works is because Herb Kelleher welcomed it. Therefore, the SWA pilots benefitted from being able to build a stong In House union while also having a labor friendly relationship with management. JetBlue's management is extremely anti-union and would crush another In House drive, as they did a few years ago.

American Airlines' pilots were formerly represented by ALPA for many years and therefore already had a strong foundation from which to start the APA.

JetBlue pilots have absolutely nothing. ALPA is our fastest and best route to a CBA at this point in time. We need representation yesterday. As each day passes without representation, this pilot group becomes more and more vulnerable.

Send in a card. Tell your friends to send in a card.

Not disagreeing with you, as I'm not there. And I believe you that your management can be anti-union, but how can your company "crush another in-house drive," but have to allow an ALPA drive? Wouldn't it be the same process?

Bubba

 

[Blue Dude]

Not disagreeing with you, as I'm not there. And I believe you that your management can be anti-union, but how can your company "crush another in-house drive," but have to allow an ALPA drive?

They're not "allowing" jack spit. They fight a daily battle against unions of all sorts. But if they perceive that a pilot union is inevitable, their next move would be to "concede" victory and set up and fund a captive union based on the weak "representative" structure already in place. The structure has the appearance of supporting pilot interests but has no voice and no teeth. Turning this into a captive in-house is just one propaganda push away. We've got plenty of pilots who are more interested in the appearance of security than in dealing with the reality of our situation, and are primed to be lulled to sleep again.

 

[Ski-N-Fly]

Blue Dude speaks the truth. Sadly, I believe that our current "leadership" is too arrogant to concede to the idea that a union is inevitable. The messages disseminated to the masses on a weekly basis merely reflect the out of touch egos who dwell high up in the bluthisphere, which is a far cry from reality......where the rest of us live.

 

[waveflyer]

Blue dude-

http://www.nmb.gov/documents/rla.html

Company funded collective bargaining agents are not legal under the RLA - But you have to press the issue to the courts yourselves. Might be a way to convince those who are on the fence to vote in the real thing

? 152. General duties

Fourth. Organization and collective bargaining, freedom from interference by carrier, assistance in organizing or maintaining organization by carrier forbidden; deduction of dues from wages forbidden

Employees shall have the right to organize and bargain collectively through representatives of their own choosing. The majority of any craft or class of employees shall have the right to determine who shall be the representative of the craft or class for the purposes of this chapter. No carrier, its officers, or agents shall deny or in any way question the right of its employees to join, organize, or assist in organizing the labor organization of their choice, and it shall be unlawful for any carrier to interfere in any way with the organization of its employees, or to use the funds of the carrier in maintaining or assisting or contributing to any labor organizabion, labor representative, or other agency of collective bargaining, or in performing any work therefor, or to influence or coerce employees in an effort to induce them to join or remain or not to join or remain members of any labor organization, or to deduct from the wages of employees any dues, fees, assessments, or other contributions payable to labor organizations, or to collect or to assist in the collection of any such dues, fees, assessments, or other contributions: Provided, That nothing in this chapter shall be construed to prohibit a carrier from permitting an employee, individually, or local representatives of employees from conferring with management during working hours without loss of time, or to prohibit a carrier from furnishing free transportation to its employees while engaged in the business of a labor organization.

 

[Blue Dude]

Let's just say that the spirit of the law has rarely slowed down this management team. They could legitimately claim that they didn't use a single dollar of company funds and still heavily influence the selection of bargaining units, its structure, its operation, and its staffing. The could remain technically within the law, and yet they would own the union in all but name. That's the lazy way out for the pilots and I'm concerned too many would take it.

There has already been a legitimate grass roots in-house union effort, one that would have preserved everything the company claimed to treasure, yet still protected pilots' rights and careers, and it was ruthlessly crushed. This management team has shown no signs of becoming more pro-pilot - or pro-employee for that matter - in the interim. Therefore, any move by them toward a compromise in-house is just a manipulative, focus-grouped ploy to retain control of contract terms and communication channels (of which the latter is by far the most significant). The appearance of cooperation henceforth must be assumed to be a tactic, not a sincere attempt to reach an accommodation. Too much water under the bridge to assume otherwise.

 

[waveflyer]

Word.

Good luck my man.

Just be prepared for a certain amount of blowback against alpa- as formidable as it once was, there is quite the bureaucracy there now and lots if pilots are ideologically against them-
I am very much pro-alpa, but they have played many a game that has affected my career- ignore that to your detriment. Got more than a few very conflicted blue dudes with my exact background in my circle. (Furloughed former legacy, etc)
Just have a positive strategy in place, not just a negative one. What will alpa do for pilots?
Bc ford and Harrison is very well organized as you well know

 

[Ky.BrownBourbn]

Article published today says you guys may be represented by APA soon.

Good luck,
KBB