How is Life at Gojets?

[redbook]

The former GoJet guys and girls who moved on to all the different majors might have a tough time buying your story

The larger number of gojet pilots who got shot down from numerous carriers won't have a hard time with the facts.

Ask around, its not hard. Some have gotten hired, but many due only to the fact that they worked at gojet were not.

 

[Freight Dog]

OK... Maybe a TSA guy can fill me in, but aren't the TSA furloughed all probies? Why not go to GoJet? First year pay is crappy at both places.

 

[joeywoofwoof]

The larger number of gojet pilots who got shot down from numerous carriers won't have a hard time with the facts.

Ask around, its not hard. Some have gotten hired, but many due only to the fact that they worked at gojet were not.

You have got to be the TOUGHEST internet guy I have ever seen. I bet you could beat up the hulk in an internet death match.

Seriously, you are probably the most arrogant, self-righteous internet tough-guy I've ever seen. Like you have any idea of the 'numerous guys' that did or did not get hired because of their affiliation with GoJet. It's almost not worth ripping on you... you do a better job of it yourself.

Always, the same old- "you'll never get hired" scare tactics.. hilarious, really.

 

[McNugget]

You have got to be the TOUGHEST internet guy I have ever seen. I bet you could beat up the hulk in an internet death match.

Seriously, you are probably the most arrogant, self-righteous internet tough-guy I've ever seen. Like you have any idea of the numerous guys that did or did not get hired because of their affiliation with GoJet. It's almost not worth ripping on you... you do a better job of it yourself.

Always, the same old- "you'll never get hired" scare tactics.. hilarious, really.

Tough enough to take on Chuck Norris?

 

[redbook]

You have got to be the TOUGHEST internet guy I have ever seen. I bet you could beat up the hulk in an internet death match.

Seriously, you are probably the most arrogant, self-righteous internet tough-guy I've ever seen. Like you have any idea of the numerous guys that did or did not get hired because of their affiliation with GoJet. It's almost not worth ripping on you... you do a better job of it yourself.

Always, the same old- "you'll never get hired" scare tactics.. hilarious, really.

Okay, you convinced me. I just changed my mind about alter ego pilots.

 

[PBRstreetgang]

Show me a single pilot in the industry who is any different. You are no less "the help" than I am. You are no less a whore than I am. GoJet is not struck work. I do not condone or agree with the proposal that was offered the TSA pilots. I would have also voted no. However, the fact that they voted no does not mean I nor anyone else should not have applied and taken a job at GoJet.

There is not much I wouldn't do to support my family. Crossing a picket line is about the only thing I would not do. I would dig ditches to support my family. You have the luxury of not having to be unemployed and looking for a job in a market that floods more every day with high-time pilots. Even GoJet won't even look at your resume now if you have less than 4500 hours, and thanks to larger carriers like Aloha and ATA going OUT OF BUSINESS there are MANY, very high time pilots out there looking for work. Get real and grow up.

Keep saying that, you obviously believe it. I quit TSA by simply walkind away, no letter, no phone call nothing. Mailed my ID back and guess what I still got hired anyway. I have news for you, you say you would dig ditches for your family, but you won't, you will make a TSA pilot dig your ditches so he can feed his family. Your eagerness to get a street captain at fagjet, just demonstrates just how selfish you truly are. You got your left seat in an airliner, and a TSA gets unemployment, sounds fair right? I have more respect for hellownewwoman than you, he just hired into a ALPA carrier being anti-union. You on the otherhand take a job at an alterego carrier, being after saying you are a "strong union organizer", one word Judas, enjoy your 30 pieces of silver, you will get yours in the end, you are a TSAH employee. "Dig ditches for your family", gimme a break!
eric

 

[rtmcfi]

OK... Maybe a TSA guy can fill me in, but aren't the TSA furloughed all probies? Why not go to GoJet? First year pay is crappy at both places.

Um, some folks have pride in themselves. Some folks are scared of fallout later in their careers. These are the quickest reasons not to go to hojets. There are lots more. For someone without a dog in this fight, you sure try to legitimize the boot-liking swine that are hojets trash. It is about more than just payrates.

 

[Turtlesfly]

I would NEVER have thought that this board would be filled with more people who sympathize with, or are flat-out approving of, GoJets.

I have no idea what has happened in the last 3 years.

 

[ROSWELL41]

I would NEVER have thought that this board would be filled with more people who sympathize with, or are flat-out approving of, GoJets.

I have no idea what has happened in the last 3 years.

Remember, if furloughed mainline or terminated fractional pilots say its ok now, it must be ok. The height of hypocrisy.

 

[McNugget]

At least at gojets, they were able to take their experience and obtain entry-level Captain positions.

 

[Foxcow]

g0jet sucks

 

[theo]

I would NEVER have thought that this board would be filled with more people who sympathize with, or are flat-out approving of, GoJets.

I have no idea what has happened in the last 3 years.

Probably because you never realized your anti GoJet position has and always will be in the minority. I don't fly there either but I do see and talk to a lot of their pilots in ORD and DEN. All seem to like the company and seem glad to be there. I enjoy talking with them just as much as anyone else.

In the past I had defended GoJet..more for the sake of balance than any real "dog" in the fight. I have tried in the past to make it clear that most pilots do not care about this little fight. We all realize TSA pilots made a decision as was their right. Now we would just like to see them live with it like big boys and girls do all over the world.

 

[ROSWELL41]

Probably because you never realized your anti GoJet position has and always will be in the minority. I don't fly there either but I do see and talk to a lot of their pilots in ORD and DEN. All seem to like the company and seem glad to be there. I enjoy talking with them just as much as anyone else.

In the past I had defended GoJet..more for the sake of balance than any real "dog" in the fight. I have tried in the past to make it clear that most pilots do not care about this little fight. We all realize TSA pilots made a decision as was their right. Now we would just like to see them live with it like big boys and girls do all over the world.

The anti-GoJet position is not in the minority. As a SkyWest pilot you should know this.

 

[theo]

The anti-GoJet position is not in the minority. As a SkyWest pilot you should know this.

Well there you go. We disagree. We probably disagreed on if SkyWest would vote ALPA in as well. I never thought it would happen. Did you?

 

[motch]

Ladies and Gentleman,
OS said it best-
"Hulas outsmarted ALPA and got what he wanted"

That is the issue. Hulas is the indian version of Johnny O, who is the regional version of Ichan and Lorenzo. Those of you who don't know those names should do a little search of Airline management and labor.
There are some CEO's out there that are great (Keller/SWA), more that are indifferent and a few that are truly awful (Tilton/UAL). Hulas falls into the awful category.

The Gojets of early is not the same as now, but the roots are the same.
There is no doubt that Hulas and TSAH will do what they have done to TSA, given the chance.

The fact that they are hiring CQFO's should raise a question because it opens the door to allow the company to pay someone 1st year Captain pay versus 3 yr Captain pay by not upgrading FO's.
And since GoJet has been around for 3 years, there should be enough FO's to upgrade. Of course all you have to do to prevent upgrades is raise the minimums to upgrade, thereby lowering your insurance rate while paying people less.

That being said, A person will do what a person is going to do regardless of anything we say here.
I will never forget GoJet, I will always look at them with distain, even if it's a newhire that had nothing to do with the original GoJet.

And as far as getting hired somewhere after GoJet.. sure, it has happened and will probably happen again. But there are more ex TSA and pro TSA people at majors/LCC's/Cargo carriers out there than GoJet people.
Even at my carrier, we have at least 2 and possibly 3 or 4 ex GoJet pilots.. but we have over a dozen ex TSA pilots and we spread the word whenever we can.

Good luck MDW whatever you choose.

 

[AirCobra]

As a former United guy who has seen much of United's domestic flying go to TSA and others I have this to say: it seems to me many regional airline pilots had no trouble taking flying away from United mainline flying on shorter routes keeping United pilots on furlough longer after 2001 (SAT used to be a United 737), had no trouble flying AWAC routes for United at O'Hare when your management underbid AWAC, and now you have the gaul to call out Go Jets for doing what you did. Did a United or AWAC pilot ever turn a TSA guy down for a jumpseat? Maybe they should have.

Regionals at United picked up 20-30 precent of the domestic flying depending on the time of year. STL, SAT, COS, three flights a day to IAD, and Montreal are not feeder routes, these were flights flown by Mainline. Mainline United took two 737's off ORD to IAD and replaced the with three RJ flights (nearly equal number of seats, lower paid pilots). United also did something similar in COS.

TSA was willing to take routes for lower wages than mainline United, and TSA ERJ pilots happily flew them. TSA booted AWAC out of ORD by bidding lower and TSA pilots happily flew those routes too. Where were your principles when it came to United 737 and A319 pilots or AWAC BAe-146 guys? AWAC was at ORD for the 19 years. TSA, Mesa, and Skywset came in and underbid AWAC just like Go Jet underbid TSA. TSA was willing to fly United Mainline routes for less than half the pay a United FO makes. Well no wonder you fly ORD to IAD or ORD to DFW instead of places like Evansville and Champaign like in the old days. It is also why 43% of the United domestic flights out of ORD are UAX. Your company underbid mainline pilots, then you fly around in United colors, using United's reservation system to fill your planes, using United ground crews, and try to say that somehow you are better than Go Jet. Do you see how giving domestic flying to regionals has kept United pilots on furlough? Now what you did to United is being done to you. You have benefitted from flying in United colors. You probably dropped the "Express" part of United Express when talking to girls at a bar. Now you come on here and speak with such self indignation about denying Go Jet pilots jumpseats and how much better you are than Go Jet. Look in the mirror, what routes are you flying today that were flown by United or AWAC? Has a United or AWAC pilot ever denied a TSA guy a jumpseat? Probably not. Its time you mature and cut the vendetta stuff and realize the nature of the industry you are in.

I understand that that is the law of the jungle and I accept it, and I have never blamed a regional airline pilot for taking jobs away from anyone. Nor would I ever deny a jumpseat to TSA, Mesa, or Skywest. I just can't stand the hypocrisy of the guys on here claiming they are better than Go Jet and making excuses like United pilots didn't want to fly 50 seat aircraft and that everything was just wonderful when you booted AWAC out of ORD. Give me a break!!!

Sometimes you need to look at the plank in your own eye before looking at the speck in your brothers eye.

 

[theo]

Ladies and Gentleman,
OS said it best-
"Hulas outsmarted ALPA and got what he wanted"

That is the issue. Hulas is the indian version of Johnny O, who is the regional version of Ichan and Lorenzo. Those of you who don't know those names should do a little search of Airline management and labor.
There are some CEO's out there that are great (Keller/SWA), more that are indifferent and a few that are truly awful (Tilton/UAL). Hulas falls into the awful category.

The Gojets of early is not the same as now, but the roots are the same.
There is no doubt that Hulas and TSAH will do what they have done to TSA, given the chance.

The fact that they are hiring CQFO's should raise a question because it opens the door to allow the company to pay someone 1st year Captain pay versus 3 yr Captain pay by not upgrading FO's.
And since GoJet has been around for 3 years, there should be enough FO's to upgrade. Of course all you have to do to prevent upgrades is raise the minimums to upgrade, thereby lowering your insurance rate while paying people less.

That being said, A person will do what a person is going to do regardless of anything we say here.
I will never forget GoJet, I will always look at them with distain, even if it's a newhire that had nothing to do with the original GoJet.

And as far as getting hired somewhere after GoJet.. sure, it has happened and will probably happen again. But there are more ex TSA and pro TSA people at majors/LCC's/Cargo carriers out there than GoJet people.
Even at my carrier, we have at least 2 and possibly 3 or 4 ex GoJet pilots.. but we have over a dozen ex TSA pilots and we spread the word whenever we can.

Good luck MDW whatever you choose.

Correct me if I am wrong...but werent you one of the ALPA leaders of TSA during this vote? Wer'ent you one of the "leaders" who suggested to vote this down and the company would come back with a better offer? You not only voted it down but used your position as a leader to convince a whole bunch of other guys to do so as well?

Don;t you feel bad that it was your leadership that cost a lot of TSA pilots jobs and opportunity? I wonder how anyone could take your comments seriously. It looks like you are just trying to shift blame for poor decisions by you and your fellow leaders at TSA ALPA. Why not take responsibility for a bad call and move on? Quit blaming others for your missteps>

 

[CX880]

The anti-GoJet position is not in the minority. As a SkyWest pilot you should know this.

Hey Roswell, how much do you make flying 90 seat airplanes on mainline routes? STFU

 

[motch]

Yes, I was the Sec Tres of LEC38/RIC
No, I did not voice my "official" opinion of voting it down. I did state that I would vote No and that I did expect the company to come back to this pilot group with a decent LOA.
-Not an LOA that gave vague furlough protection to the current GoJet pilots.
-Not an LOA that had poor 70 seat payscales but ALSO 90 seat payscales!
-Not an LOA that extended our current CBA by 4 years, thereby making it a 10 year CBA!
-Not to an LOA that rewarded those pilots who crossed over to GJ with higher seniority than they should have had.

I expected the company to treat the pilots of TSA with the respect they had earned. It was TSA pilot's hard work flying under the United Express banner that even brought the possibility of 70 seat flying for United to TSA management. Those same pilots earned the right to have our CBA honored. We had a formula for 70 seat aircraft pay within the CBA, the company didn't want to follow that formula.

I told every pilot I spoke to that the company did not have to come back to the table but I did expect them to.. and to that I was wrong. Not the Union.

Do I feel bad. No.
Had we voted yes (and our MEC thought it might be a close vote) we would have been stuck with a bad deal while at the same time lowering the bar. We also would have had to look fellow Regional pilots in the eyes and said "we caved".
The reality is, the TSA pilots lost and the company lost because TSA would have been a much stronger company had they given the pilot group a decent deal that was voted in. Then TSA would have been no different than CHQ, 50 and 70 seat aircraft, one list and future growth.
Now, TSAH will try and grow GJ while shrinking TSA. A lost oppurtunity.

I have moved on and I admit that I gave the company the benifit of the doubt. That they would do both the right thing and the smart thing. They did neither.

After the vote and the companys refusal to talk with the TSA pilots, we were left to play our cards in the court system. We lost.
Courts have been known to make mistakes and I will always consider this a big mistake. but one only has to look at the OJ trail, all the stories of people on death row being found innocent by DNA to realize that our legal system isn't perfect and does make mistakes.
I always started to tell every FO I flew with to think of leaving TSA. Many did. They saw the writting on the wall.. that Hulas and company just didn't care about them. Frank was Right!

I have moved on, but anytime I can explain the GoJet situation I will.

Motch

 

[CX880]

Yes, I was the Sec Tres of LEC38/RIC
No, I did not voice my "official" opinion of voting it down. I did state that I would vote No and that I did expect the company to come back to this pilot group with a decent LOA.
-Not an LOA that gave vague furlough protection to the current GoJet pilots.
-Not an LOA that had poor 70 seat payscales but ALSO 90 seat payscales!
-Not an LOA that extended our current CBA by 4 years, thereby making it a 10 year CBA!
-Not to an LOA that rewarded those pilots who crossed over to GJ with higher seniority than they should have had.

I expected the company to treat the pilots of TSA with the respect they had earned. It was TSA pilot's hard work flying under the United Express banner that even brought the possibility of 70 seat flying for United to TSA management. Those same pilots earned the right to have our CBA honored. We had a formula for 70 seat aircraft pay within the CBA, the company didn't want to follow that formula.

I told every pilot I spoke to that the company did not have to come back to the table but I did expect them to.. and to that I was wrong. Not the Union.

Do I feel bad. No.
Had we voted yes (and our MEC thought it might be a close vote) we would have been stuck with a bad deal while at the same time lowering the bar. We also would have had to look fellow Regional pilots in the eyes and said "we caved".
The reality is, the TSA pilots lost and the company lost because TSA would have been a much stronger company had they given the pilot group a decent deal that was voted in. Then TSA would have been no different than CHQ, 50 and 70 seat aircraft, one list and future growth.
Now, TSAH will try and grow GJ while shrinking TSA. A lost oppurtunity.

I have moved on and I admit that I gave the company the benifit of the doubt. That they would do both the right thing and the smart thing. They did neither.

After the vote and the companys refusal to talk with the TSA pilots, we were left to play our cards in the court system. We lost.
Courts have been known to make mistakes and I will always consider this a big mistake. but one only has to look at the OJ trail, all the stories of people on death row being found innocent by DNA to realize that our legal system isn't perfect and does make mistakes.
I always started to tell every FO I flew with to think of leaving TSA. Many did. They saw the writting on the wall.. that Hulas and company just didn't care about them. Frank was Right!

I have moved on, but anytime I can explain the GoJet situation I will.

Motch

Wow I believe this is the first post where a TSA pilot admits they F#cked UP!