Gulfstream International

[jppt2000]

"Here's a newsflash for you. Gulfstream style PFJ is not popular amongst the masses. I think for good reason. Once you leave the bubble your in, you'll see that, if you don't already understand it. "

Just about every person I've met who has the same opinion of Gulfstream as de727ups is misinformed, envious, or "just plane weird".

"The two PCL capts I know loathe the guys."
Are these among the folks that were hired as "off the street captains"? Must be hard to see the ex-GIA upgrade CA's bid hard lines, instead of reserve.

"People that do the Gulfstream program should be treated with extreme prejudice by all professional pilots who work for a living."

I personally know 2 DAL FE's who each did 500 hours at GIA so they could fly right seat. Gee if only the DAL mainline guys knew. de727ups, phone up the DALPA union let 'em know, be sure to include the extreme prejudice crap too in your tirade!

The testimonial page is full of CAL scabs raving about the place, plus, I've heard a scab owns it. Is that true? Does having so many scabs involved bother you?

Someone phone the Teamsters local 747 up. I'm sure they'll be shocked to learn about the "scabs".


Oh yeah, de727ups, be sure to blab your Gulfstream hatred to your fellow pilots on the line, you might be surprised to find out your Check Airman or Instructor was a graduate of GIA.


"Someone could submit an article to the USA Today or 20/20 and let them investigate. A lot of pax think they are getting on a Beech 1900 with highly qualified pilots at the controls due to the fact that their ticket was purchased through Continental."

Oh yeah, a conspiracy theorist! Wow, hurry the news media might have a scoop! Maybe ABC will put their chat room pedophiles investigation on hold so that they can expose the nasty PFJ epidemic. Gees maybe Oprah can do a show on PFT, have de727ups as a guest on her Oprah's book club segment. Dang, she now doublechecks her guests credentials and stories, might not be a good idea 727.

It's hard to believe de727ups is "a professional pilot who flies for a living". LMAO!

 

[The_Russian]

It's hard to believe de727ups is "a professional pilot who flies for a living". LMAO!

Agreed! Maybe I should report his posts like he did to me two years ago when he didn't "like" my tone. de727 you are way out of line.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

"de727 has a poor attitude towards others"

They love me at the other board. Even made me a moderator.

Now you are somebody! Buy yourself an ice cream!

Gulfstream style PFJ is not popular amongst the masses.

You speak for the masses?

I think for good reason. Once you leave the bubble your in, you'll see that, if you don't already understand it.

You may or may not be right. However, again, what are YOU really going to do about except, blow smoke on a message board. No worries, when/if the industry turns around and descretionary income and growth are back, spewing hate like this will not be in vogue.

The testimonial page is full of CAL scabs raving about the place, plus, I've heard a scab owns it. Is that true? Does having so many scabs involved bother you?

Scabs have thier place in hell. However, scabs don't define the individuals that fly at GIA. There are scabs at Airtran, but the professional pilots that I know there have nothning to do with those guys. Same with the scabs at CAL. There is a pedaphile that lives in your neighborhood, what does that say about you?

Ahh...I better stop now lest I be accused of having a poor attitude towards others...

You've been called on your bad attitude already, now you are just telling yourself....

.....

I count about 20 scabs at UPS..... what does that say about you?

 

[de727ups]

"Are these among the folks that were hired as "off the street captains"

One for sure wasn't. The other might have been. What does that have to do with it again?

"Gee if only the DAL mainline guys knew"

If you explain to them that the Gulfstream program is one where people pay money so they can gain experience as an airline pilot at an airline, they don't believe it. Really, I've seen it happen. I'm confident that your average DAL or UPS guy isn't impressed with PFJ. There is a percentage that would say, "Whatever, however you get your experience to get qualifed is fine. Do what you have to do". However, the vast majority would see it as a bad practice and a bad way to enter the industry. Do you really doubt that? The guy who started jetcareers is a DAL line guy, ask him what he thinks of Gulfstream. Better yet, come over there and start a Gulfstream thread. It's great entertainment when it happens.

"you might be surprised to find out your Check Airman or Instructor was a graduate of GIA"

You're right, I would be surprised.

"It's hard to believe de727ups is "a professional pilot who flies for a living". LMAO!"

Believe it. 833 at UPS.

 

[de727ups]

"Agreed! Maybe I should report his posts like he did to me two years ago when he didn't "like" my tone. de727 you are way out of line"

I don't remember doing that. Can you refresh my memory? I left this site for a while because there is no "line", here, unlike jetcareers and APC. Came back cause I love talking about this stuff with you guys. Anyhow, report away...

 

[jppt2000]

Believe it. 833 at UPS.

I knew someone where I worked, that swore up and down they had won the powerball lottery. Couldn't prove it, along with other wild claims. You could say you are number 1 at UPS, or Fedex, or any other airline, heck you could say you're Santa Claus, being anonymous allows you to do that. Based on your previous posts, I'm inclined to believe you make stuff up.

Really, I've seen it happen. I'm confident that your average DAL or UPS guy isn't impressed with PFJ. There is a percentage that would say, "Whatever, however you get your experience to get qualifed is fine. Do what you have to do". However, the vast majority would see it as a bad practice and a bad way to enter the industry.

Early 90's, many regionals were PFT, ASA, Comair, to name a couple. How many of those folks went on to the majors? UPS, Fed Ex?
Seems like a heck of alot of people.

You seem to think GIA FO's upon completion of their 250 hours automatically get hired. I beg to differ. Ability, attitude, and timing all have to be aligned at the right moment to get a permanent position. I think you were one of the many that had problems with the first two.

 

[de727ups]

"Early 90's, many regionals were PFT"

That was where you paid for your own initial ground training if you wanted to work there. A little different than paying for flight time in airliner that says Continental on the side of it. However, the practice of 90's PFT went away with supply and demand and union pressure. This was a good thing. Gulfstream is a bad thing. Bringing up the PFT of the 90's hardly disproves that.

"You seem to think GIA FO's upon completion of their 250 hours automatically get hired"

Really, I didn't know that. Would you like to guess a percentage that don't? How would that make you feel. I mean, to PFJ and then not be able to get a job. Wonder how many of those guys are still pro-Gulfstream.

By the way, there are two guys at the other board than did Gulfstream and now advise against the program. Are they somehow as misinformed and "hate spewing" as me or just expressing their honest opinion, kinda like me.

"It's hard to believe de727ups is "a professional pilot who flies for a living"
"Based on your previous posts, I'm inclined to believe you make stuff up"

Anybody else here think I'm not number 833 at UPS like this guy?

 

[jppt2000]

Anybody else here think I'm not number 833 at UPS like this guy?

How about, I'm convinced you think you're 833 at UPS.
Happy flying, Santa.

If I remember the lyric correctly from Don Henley's song , "I'm an expert witness because I say I am" .

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

de727ups- what do you hope to gain by your posts?

 

[de727ups]

"How about, I'm convinced you think you're 833 at UPS"

What made you change your mind?

"de727ups- what do you hope to gain by your posts?"

A few things....

One, you pro-Gulfstream guys are foaming at the mouth and I find that darned amusing and entertaining. Please don't stop....

Second, just maybe, and I've seen it happen before, some kid who is thinking of Gulfstream will see why it's a bad idea and look beyond the webpage or a job at Pinnacle.

Third, the silent masses really do abhor PFJ and what it stands for. Again, if you're not sure about that come over to jetcareers and ask. Explain PFJ to your random major pilot and see what they say.

Fourth, scabs seem to have a lot to do with Gulfstream. Correct me if I'm wrong. I just want to make sure everyone understands that so I keep talking about it.

Fifth, can't think of anything right now but I'll work on it.

 

[rtmcfi]

The instructors there were some of the finest pilots I ever flew with.

Where else have you bought a job? I mean, prior to purchasing your job at gia you must have purchased a job elsewhere, in order to make this comparison.

You and the rest of this circle-jerk are attempting to defend the indefensible.

 

[jppt2000]

What made you change your mind

Never did change my mind, like I posted, I'm convinced you think you're 833.
I'll bet you're on the super secret, UPS special operations team too. Got lots of neat pictures on the wall of 4 engine jets.

the silent masses, the vast majority , They love me at the other board. Even made me a moderator.

this is why cyberspace can be dangerous.

Simply because you claim to work for UPS, does that somehow magically lend credibility to your argument(s)? I believe since you are so willing to volunteer to the silent masses the name of your employer, you have no substance to your claims.

Do you have the 747 or DC-8 screen saver?


You and the rest of this circle-jerk are attempting to defend the indefensible.

I'm just pointing out the way you try to make your case. What's indefensible is your logic. Once again, in anonymity, you can make these posts without fear of reprisals. Since you didn't, couldn't, or wouldn't go to GIA doesn't make anyone else who did, less of a pilot than you.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

"de727ups- what do you hope to gain by your posts?"

A few things....

One, you pro-Gulfstream guys are foaming at the mouth and I find that darned amusing and entertaining. Please don't stop....

So this is really about you getting a chuckle at anothers expense.

Second, just maybe, and I've seen it happen before, some kid who is thinking of Gulfstream will see why it's a bad idea and look beyond the webpage or a job at Pinnacle.

You are a freedom fighter of the avaition profession. Actually, you are on the wrong path. You cannot expect individuals who are not a part of the pilot profession to defend it. What does the individual who is contemplating GIA get in return for not going there? A donut with pink frosting and spinkles from you?

Money is money. Whenit comes down to it, we cannot control how people become pilots, but once they are, THAT is when we put an expectation of professionalism on them. Control what you can. You have no control here.

Third, the silent masses really do abhor PFJ and what it stands for. Again, if you're not sure about that come over to jetcareers and ask. Explain PFJ to your random major pilot and see what they say.

So now you the massses you speak for are silent. The "people" you represent are nothing without you and of course you are nothing without them. Question is who are They? How about a striaght jacket and rubber room. And to convince us this time you used the word really!

Fourth, scabs seem to have a lot to do with Gulfstream. Correct me if I'm wrong. I just want to make sure everyone understands that so I keep talking about it.

You are wrong and being corrected. Scabs define themsleves. Not you or I. They have to live with thier sins and wrong doing. Not you or I. We all understand, so stop talking about. The question why do feel you need to make sure? Ego?

Fifth, can't think of anything right now but I'll work on it.

Speaking of a fifth, why not get one, as wacked as you are it can only help you. For medicinal purposes, of course.

Finally, all you are doing is spreading hate and negativity. There a plenty of air line pilots that are looking for a reason to explain why thier expectations aren't met. You're providing one, albeit the wrong one.

If you are to bash GIA then you must also bash other PFT operations: CMR, PCL, ACA and the coup de grace SWA!

Really though, guys that feel the need to bust down others are really masking thier own lack of self confidence. Usually it is Capts whining like school girls about having to fly with GIA pilots. What they are really saying is this: I am not comfortable with my own skills and experience level. I really would like an experience FO to carry me. Be a real professional and call the training department and ask for more training for yourself. It would mean alot to all of us.

Therefore, I submit that you are worse than the effect you say GIA has on our industry.

 

[jppt2000]

Second, just maybe, and I've seen it happen before, some kid who is thinking of Gulfstream will see why it's a bad idea and look beyond the webpage or a job at Pinnacle.



Or, that same person can see what kind of person you are. Maybe you're trying to keep that person from getting the job you want.

This isn't about GIA, or PFT or PFJ, its all about de727ups.

 

[The_Russian]

Where else have you bought a job? I mean, prior to purchasing your job at gia you must have purchased a job elsewhere, in order to make this comparison.

You and the rest of this circle-jerk are attempting to defend the indefensible.

You obviously have never read any of my previous posts on GIA. First off, you don't know whether or not I paid GIA a dime. More than half the pilots at GIA were hired off the street or flowed up into the airline after instructing. Second off, I was a CFI for three years first. Freelance the first two years and the last year I spent as a 141 instructor at GAA. I did not purchase a job to become a CFI at GAA. I did not purchase a job at GIA. I don't know who you think you are but you don't know the first thing about GIA or myself. Why don't you just go ahead and tell us what you think is wrong with my career path. Do you think that I did something wrong? Do you think that I am wrong for associating myself with the hard working people at GIA? You most likely think that my time after work that I put in for the union is bad too. Are you even an airline pilot? I'll have more for you when you answer that last question.

I don't remember doing that. Can you refresh my memory? I left this site for a while because there is no "line", here, unlike jetcareers and APC. Came back cause I love talking about this stuff with you guys. Anyhow, report away...

I remember joining this site in 2003 after some of my students at GAA told me what people were saying about them. When I attempted to staighten out the truth, you reported me to the moderators because you didn't like my tone. Of course I was new and they sided with you. But you were wrong, and you are still wrong. Your tone is no different than mine was then. And your moronic arguments and fingerpointing show your true ability to listen and understand. As with your mental age of between 13-14 years. I do not believe that a professional pilot in the top echelon of UPS would respond to others in such a way concerning something that no longer even affects him/her. At GIA we have had some instructors from UPS doing part time work teaching the FO's. They are very supportive of the newbies and even back us up when people say we "PFT'd". Why? Because they know that GIA is not a true version of PFT and really isn't hurting the industry. You also like the term scab. You use it a lot. Have you ever been at an airline that has had to strike? What do you really know about scabs?

 

[de727ups]

"If you are to bash GIA then you must also bash other PFT operations: CMR, PCL, ACA and the coup de grace SWA!"

Ahhh...huh? Comair, Pinnacle, and ACA are PFT operations? You wanna explain that one again? Just so we can be on the same page? ACA isn't even in business anymore. Southwest....well, you need a type to work there. It's a way to weed people out. Kinda like having a degree. Their F/O's don't pay for a chance to build time in the right seat, either.

"I did not purchase a job to become a CFI at GAA. I did not purchase a job at GIA."

Good for you. Those are the practices that the vast majority of the industry takes issue with.

"I do not believe that a professional pilot in the top echelon of UPS would respond to others in such a way concerning something that no longer even affects him/her"

Believe it. Here's why. I think it's wrong. Everyone I talk to, except for here, thinks it's wrong. It's wrong to buy a job in this business. Who would even think of such a thing?

"At GIA we have had some instructors from UPS doing part time work teaching the FO's"

Really. I'll believe that when I see names. Be sure to remind them the UPS FOM prohibits outside commercial flying. Not an issue if they are teaching ground school.

"Have you ever been at an airline that has had to strike? What do you really know about scabs?"

Yeah. UPS, was it 1998? Walked a picket line at BFI for a week in support of the teamsters.

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

For the record, DE727UPS is for real.... I've got alot of respect for him.




I can't stand what the GIA guys do...and it drives me nuts seeing more and more guys diving over there.

The younger guys are typically pretty sharp b/c of a quicker learning curve. The combination of GIA, middle aged, non-military, and late career changer is typically a flag that I'm gonna be watching them get behind and stay way behind the airplane the entire trip. Makes me glad I've got an instruction background. There are exceptions...

 

[Tank Commander]

Oh so that's why....... I'm a career changer, I'm middle aged, Oh, you better keep both eyes on me............ your an a$$ that stereo types way to much!

 

[jppt2000]

"At GIA we have had some instructors from UPS doing part time work teaching the FO's"

Really. I'll believe that when I see names. Be sure to remind them the UPS FOM prohibits outside commercial flying. Not an issue if they are teaching ground school.

de727ups,
So now you want names, can't believe people on the web?
Just like I posted earlier, you simply can't take anonymous posters more than face value.
You want to see names LMAO!
I don't believe you de727ups, although I do believe you might sleep in a ups uniform.
This person gets off on flaming GIA, IMHO there is no point responding to him. He even eludes to having fun, getting people upset.
Although there might be an unintended side-effect to de727boobs' crusade. People thinking about going to GIA that read this thread will now be convinced there are plenty of very lonely anti-PFT-PFJ whackos out there in cyberspace.
These wackos will do anything to get off, even flame threads on messageboards.

 

[de727ups]

"This person gets off on flaming GIA, IMHO there is no point responding to him"

And yet you can't stop, can you? All you guys can do is personally attack me rather than have a debate on the issues. It shows through the last half of this thread and is why I posted a link to this thread at another popular aviation careers website. Anyone reading this can see how you don't have a leg to stand on so you resort to the flames. It's friggen hilarious, thus my statement about how I find this entertaining and amusing.

Here's a link with my pic and an artice I wrote for another popular aviation careers website. You can print my picture out and throw darts at it during your Gulfstream ground school breaks. That would make me happy....

http://www.jetcareers.com/content/view/65/132/