Gulfstream International

[fatazz]

Who really cares how people get to where they are. It is really no ones business. I think Gulfstream is a very very small percentage of the problem with this industry if any at all.

 

[Alchemy]

It's a huge problem. If people will pay to occupy a seat on a 1900 that is REQUIRED to be manned by a qualified crewmember, what's to stop some scumbag from deciding this could work in an RJ next? Then what, a 737?

 

[PCL_128]

So where are you PCL 128?

Oh, I'm right here watching all of the ignorant fools behave like a bunch of moronic twits. It's quite entertaining, actually. But by all means, continue with your constant GIA bashing. It's not like there's anything more important going on in the industry that affects more than 250 pilot jobs. Yep, that's right; for all of the GIA bashing that goes on around here, there are only 250 total pilots that work at GIA at any given time. Meanwhile, HoJet is busting ALPA on the TSA property, pensions are being raided, contracts are being gutted to finance outrageous CEO compensation packages, politicians are pushing for cabatoge, and NWA management is trying their best to ruin what little is left of scope protections. Yeah, those 250 pilots at GIA are really the problem here.

 

[Alchemy]

Just because there are other problems in the industry doesn't lessen the severity of the problem that is "GULFSTREAM INTERNATIONAL". Now with EMB-120's. Maybe you'll get some of those 69 RJ's from Expressjet? Larry K. and the boys won't mind if the FO's fly for free!

 

[PCL_128]

Just because there are other problems in the industry doesn't lessen the severity of the problem that is "GULFSTREAM INTERNATIONAL".

No disagreement there. However, the people on this board spend 10 times the energy bashing GIA than they do discussing the really important issues that affect all of us like foreign ownership and age-60. The reason is simple: it takes no brain power or industry saavy to yell "GIA pilots suck," but it does to discuss the complexities of the real issues like pension reform. Most pilots are simply too lazy to study the important issues, and would rather scream and yell about something almost trivial like GIA. GIA certainly isn't a good place, but it's really not negatively affecting the industry like the fools on this board proclaim. Other things really are causing problems in this industry though, and they are being ignored because everyone is too focused on the red herring that is GIA. Get informed on the real issues and stop getting all worked up over a couple dozen planes in south Florida. That SCAB Cooper will be dead in a few years anyway, and GIA will probably cease to exist. It's really not worth getting that upset over.

 

[AAflyer]

It's a huge problem. If people will pay to occupy a seat on a 1900 that is REQUIRED to be manned by a qualified crewmember, what's to stop some scumbag from deciding this could work in an RJ next? Then what, a 737?

Yea, like being paid roughly $20 bucks an hour to fly as 40-50 passengers in a jet airliner painted in the same color of the mainline carrier. Would like to bet which is causing more of a problem for me?

AAflyer

What about paying to play at companies like Comair back in the mid 90s. The rationale I heard was everyone was doing it so it was OK. Eagle wasn't, Skywest wan't, Alleghany wasn't, Horizon wasn't. They are a lot more industry variables that are effecting pilots than Gulfstream. What about Aeroservices in MIA. Buy 747 type and you might get a job at Southern?

 

[Alchemy]

If paint jobs are so important to you, yes, Gulfstream does fly around with a Continental livery.

So you're saying it's just as bad to get paid 23 bucks an hour to fly for a regional jet in mainline's colors as it is to get nothing to fly a turboprop in mainline's colors? And let's see....that 22 bucks is how much less than starting pay at mainline on the 737....wow 8 dollars less. Geeze, what a disservice we are doing to the industry by actually wanting to be paid to do a job. Mainline scoped the flying to us, we didn't make them do it. If you want to try and get the 50 seaters back at mainline on your next contract, more power to you! Try to bring the turboprops back too while you're at it! I honestly hope you're successful! The only thing we can do now is try to bring the pay up on the planes you scoped away once upon a time!

 

[Rook]

I have yet to meet a gulfstream pilot i considered, smart or eaven sharp.quote]

Eaven? Pot, meet kettle.

Rook

 

[txpilot1974]

Hockeypilot44, your right on.

Back in my flight instructing days there were several students that quit college to go to GIA. Every last one of them quit because they could not cut it at a part 141 school. (as if its that hard) These were the students that consistantly failed stage checks and pinked checkrides. If these morons could not even make it through a part 141 school, how in the hell can they make though training to fly for a part 135 or 121 carrier? The scary part is that most of these idiots are flying RJ's now.

 

[de727ups]

"Oh, I'm right here watching all of the ignorant fools behave like a bunch of moronic twits."

Guess I'm happy to be in the ignorant fool catagory. Did you do their program but now feel it was a mistake? I've noticed how you're all pro-union now. Just want to forget about Gulfstream. The Gulfstream program is a blight to the career. Quit trying to sweep it under the rug. You wanna say it was a mistake then I'd have some respect for you but trying to minimize what it stands for it a joke. You can't explain yourself around that by bringing up other problems. Nice try though...

People that do the Gulfstream program should be treated with extreme prejudice by all professional pilots who work for a living.

 

[jeroom]

It's a huge problem. If people will pay to occupy a seat on a 1900 that is REQUIRED to be manned by a qualified crewmember, what's to stop some scumbag from deciding this could work in an RJ next? Then what, a 737?

Duh.. a 737! yep. they got that too...check this out. http://www.eaglejet.net/

The world of PFT, they will send you to Africa or China to get your experience...

 

[BOHICAgain]

Duh.. a 737! yep. they got that too...check this out. http://www.eaglejet.net/

The world of PFT, they will send you to Africa or China to get your experience...

THAT IS OUTRAGEOUS...who the hell would do that... Gulfstream ok maybe but this is just ridicoulous. Its unreal actually selling PIC time in a 737-400 That is some crazy sh1t hopefully you didnt give anyone any ideas. I hope no one actually does that. And for those low time 300 pilots it even tells them they can log PIC when they are flying as SIC.. Where did they get that from??

 

[Tank Commander]

People that do the Gulfstream program should be treated with extreme prejudice by all professional pilots who work for a living.

So, I guess you are the standard for a professional pilot. So, because I was born in to a poor white family in Los Angeles, and went into the USMC at eighteen. Served for 20 years, Columbia, gulf war, Bosnia, Kosivo, I have no right to be here?

To bad you never got to do any thing else, but this.
If I were you, I'd probably be bitter to........

 

[PCL_128]

I've noticed how you're all pro-union now. Just want to forget about Gulfstream. The Gulfstream program is a blight to the career. Quit trying to sweep it under the rug. You wanna say it was a mistake then I'd have some respect for you but trying to minimize what it stands for it a joke.

Take a look at my old posts and you'll find many times where I did say it was a mistake. In fact, I believe you and I discussed this on the JetCareers board a number of months ago and I said the same thing. GIA was a big mistake and I don't disagree at all that PFT is bad for the industry. However, that doesn't change my posts in this thread. PFT may be bad for the industry, but it's not a very important issue right now with all of the other things going on in the industry. If PFT was wide-spread now like it was in the early to mid 90s then maybe all of this focus on PFT on flightinfo would be justified, but with just a couple of very small companies doing it, it's just not that important in the current environment. We have much more important things to worry about than PFT.

People that do the Gulfstream program should be treated with extreme prejudice by all professional pilots who work for a living.

If you treat someone who made an honest mistake in going to GIA with "extreme prejudice," then you aren't a professional.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

I have yet to meet a gulfstream pilot i considered, smart or eaven sharp. They are usualy the outcast and total moron in the basic indoc classes when they stumble into a real airline. The lack of knowlege is scary. flying a Beech in florida is a cake walk. Flying a CRJ one of the few cat D aircraft in the Northeast with a Gulfstream grad next to you is hard. And for the record i would like to see more GS bashing on this site its the only thing that gets my blood going.

The PCL Capts that I have spoken to say the GI FO's are pretty sharp....

As an FO how can you speak to the issue when you have never flown with a GI pilot in a jet. In addition, if you put the GI pilots on guard they will naturally be defensive...

As long as you can jackboot the GI pilots you won't have to worry about your own performance.... that is the premise at least.... right...?

 

[de727ups]

"If you treat someone who made an honest mistake in going to GIA with "extreme prejudice," then you aren't a professional."

If they admit is was a mistake, then no. I didn't see that in this thread, you'll need to keep reminding us.

"The PCL Capts that I have spoken to say the GI FO's are pretty sharp...."

Pretty sharp for a 500 hour pilot, maybe. The two PCL capts I know loathe the guys. Anyhow, how "sharp" they are isn't the issue. The issue is they participated in a program that makes a mockery of the profession by having you pay 30K to "build experience" as a required cockpit crewmember in a 121 passenger airline that says Continental on the side of it. You can't argue that isn't a BAD for the profession as a whole.

The Gulfstream website says they placed 450 pilots in jobs in the last two years.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Pretty sharp for a 500 hour pilot, maybe. The two PCL capts I know loathe the guys. Anyhow, how "sharp" they are isn't the issue. The issue is they participated in a program that makes a mockery of the profession by having you pay 30K to "build experience" as a required cockpit crewmember in a 121 passenger airline that says Continental on the side of it. You can't argue that isn't a BAD for the profession as a whole. .

As a pilot or employee there isn't much you can do about a GI pilot in your airplane. Since the GI pilots still exist and are not defending the profession why don't you defend the profession..call you supervisor and refuse to fly with them....

Sharp for a 500 pilot.... sure. But why would I epxect a pilot to be someone he isn't? A 500 pilot is a sponge. I can show him the right way...be a guide and a mentor. Or I can be a toolbox like the two clowns you know. How do you expect a GI pilot to respond attitude wise when they fly with a guy who loaths them? All your buddies are doing is turning these GI pilots into bitter clowns that will fly your family

The issue is GI is bad for the profession. What are you doing to stop the GI program in general? Are you contacting the company? No all, you got is bitter for fellow pilots.

And how do GI pilots really effect you? Don't say they lower the bar, because that is all done between the company and the union...

IOW, pay is so low at PCL that the company offered a signing bonus...

 

[huncowboy]

I've shot an approach to your mom... It's an easy approach, but go missed and theres no way to keep terrain clearance.

I nominate this for the best line of the year

 

[de727ups]

"What are you doing to stop the GI program in general? Are you contacting the company"

HAHA. Are you serious?

I do what I can by educating folks at a couple of aviation career sites on the evils of PFJ. If you have any questions about that, go to jetcareers or APC and ask about it. Any other suggestions? I'd love to find something more effective but I don't see anything that's practical.

"I can be a toolbox like the two clowns you know"

Why are the two PCL Capts I've talked to at JC toolboxes but the ones that you know who like flying with streamers are okay?

 

[jeroom]

THAT IS OUTRAGEOUS...who the hell would do that... Gulfstream ok maybe but this is just ridicoulous. Its unreal actually selling PIC time in a 737-400 That is some crazy sh1t hopefully you didnt give anyone any ideas. I hope no one actually does that. And for those low time 300 pilots it even tells them they can log PIC when they are flying as SIC.. Where did they get that from??

Their office is in Miami, not far from TMB. I believe that they are doing great...
Especially with the EU market...
Gulfstream compared is a joke...

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

"
Why are the two PCL Capts I've talked to at JC toolboxes but the ones that you know who like flying with streamers are okay?

Look if you have an issue with GI... fine...

But when it comes to your fellow pilot, it doesn't matter....

It doesn't matter if they are Gulf Int'l, white, black, Arab, female, interns, freight dogs, CFI's, etc....

You support your fellow pilot....

It is all about attitude. If your fellow pilot has a bad attitude, it doesn't give you carte blance to respond in kind... Rather, use a postive attitude to correct them....

 

[hockeypilot44]

As a pilot or employee there isn't much you can do about a GI pilot in your airplane. Since the GI pilots still exist and are not defending the profession why don't you defend the profession..call you supervisor and refuse to fly with them....

Sharp for a 500 pilot.... sure. But why would I epxect a pilot to be someone he isn't? A 500 pilot is a sponge. I can show him the right way...be a guide and a mentor. Or I can be a toolbox like the two clowns you know. How do you expect a GI pilot to respond attitude wise when they fly with a guy who loaths them? All your buddies are doing is turning these GI pilots into bitter clowns that will fly your family

The issue is GI is bad for the profession. What are you doing to stop the GI program in general? Are you contacting the company? No all, you got is bitter for fellow pilots.

And how do GI pilots really effect you? Don't say they lower the bar, because that is all done between the company and the union...

IOW, pay is so low at PCL that the company offered a signing bonus...

Someone could submit an article to the USA Today or 20/20 and let them investigate. A lot of pax think they are getting on a Beech 1900 with highly qualified pilots at the controls due to the fact that their ticket was purchased through Continental. How do you think pax would react knowing that the kid in the right seat does not have enough experience to fly for any other airline out there. How about the fact that the first officer is a paying paseenger also?

 

[Tank Commander]

How do you think pax would react knowing that the kid in the right seat does not have enough experience to fly for any other airline out there. How about the fact that the first officer is a paying paseenger also?

I really don't think they give a $hit! As long as the ticket is cheap!

 

[dogismycopilot]

These low time pilots who couldn't get a job at any other airline are flying the smallest aircraft in 121 service. In fact, the airplane can be operated single pilot (just not in a 121 operation). These low time pilots are appropriately trained and possess the appropriate FAA pilot certifications and medical certificates. In lieu of Gulfstream, these pilots could be responsible for teaching another individual how to fly with the same amount of limited experience. Which is the greater evil?

 

[The_Russian]

Look if you have an issue with GI... fine...

But when it comes to your fellow pilot, it doesn't matter....

It doesn't matter if they are Gulf Int'l, white, black, Arab, female, interns, freight dogs, CFI's, etc....

You support your fellow pilot....

It is all about attitude. If your fellow pilot has a bad attitude, it doesn't give you carte blance to respond in kind... Rather, use a postive attitude to correct them....

Well said Rez. de727 has a poor attitude towards others. He has been this way since before I joined this board.

As a CA at GIA, I do my best to mold the newbies into the industry. I have had some good results. I have met some fantastic pilots with excellent knowledge. I have also made friends for life. I am not ashamed of where I came from or how I entered this industry. The people who make these types of comments have never even seen the GAA building or hung out with a GIA guy or gal before to get the real scoop.

the FAA shut down their flight school because it was unsafe?

That is not true. I worked closely with the FAA to ensure that this did not happen. We were never even threatened by the FAA to be shut down. I was in charge of the pilot-to-mx squawk paperwork and communication. I did the test flights on all of the major repair work. The instructor group and myself worked very hard to build a 141 syllabus and even attempted to obtain examining authority. The instructors there were some of the finest pilots I ever flew with. I take great pride in the work that I did at Gulfstream Academy as an instructor. Thanks for your uneducated words.

 

[Tank Commander]

I take great pride in the work that I did at Gulfstream Academy as an instructor

And great work it was. Thank for everything.
Till I see you on the high ground, Tank Daddy

 

[dal757]

Why don't you guys express anger towards the airlines that contract with Gulfstream to do their flying. Obviously these airlines are aware of the pilot situation. I'm not a pilot with nor have I trained with Gulfstream and I must say that treating or not speaking to those who do fly for them is pure childish. Grow up people! There are better ways to deal with this problem.

 

[txpilot1974]

AWWW, how cute, a gulfstream reunion.

 

[Tank Commander]

I've had a lot of four letter words used toward me, "cute" just has never one of them.

 

[de727ups]

"de727 has a poor attitude towards others"

They love me at the other board. Even made me a moderator.

Here's a newsflash for you. Gulfstream style PFJ is not popular amongst the masses. I think for good reason. Once you leave the bubble your in, you'll see that, if you don't already understand it. The testimonial page is full of CAL scabs raving about the place, plus, I've heard a scab owns it. Is that true? Does having so many scabs involved bother you?

Ahh...I better stop now lest I be accused of having a poor attitude towards others...