Future pilot shortage...

[flyboyike]

PT,
The military pilots are the best of the best, cream of the crop, unlike the latest generation of entitlement generation crop of knuckleheads flying the average RJ.

Because certainly Annapolis would never admit any entitlement-generation knuckleheads with well-connected parents, right? Neither would Boulder, of course.

 

[JAFI]

Nevermind.

 

[pilotyip]

PT,
The military pilots are the best of the best, cream of the crop, unlike the latest generation of entitlement generation crop of knuckleheads flying the average RJ. To equate a 350 hr Naval Aviator doing night traps to a 350 hr Bridge School grad who's parents "loaned" him/her the money to jump start their airline career isn't appropriate. Kind of like comparing Sen. John Glenn to CX880.
'nuff said!
PBR

civilian pilots could be the same if they used the same screening process

 

[johnpeace]

civilian pilots could be the same if they used the same screening process

Except that if we were all that good, we'd want/expect way more money.

We're good enough...and that's all our employers can afford.

 

[the palm]

PT,
The military pilots are the best of the best, cream of the crop, unlike the latest generation of entitlement generation crop of knuckleheads flying the average RJ. To equate a 350 hr Naval Aviator doing night traps to a 350 hr Bridge School grad who's parents "loaned" him/her the money to jump start their airline career isn't appropriate. Kind of like comparing Sen. John Glenn to CX880.
'nuff said!
PBR

Military means nothing. I've flown with good and bad. Same goes with the low time Riddle guys. Flown with some of them that were better than military. Flown with some that shouldn't be flying at all.

For the most part I've enjoyed flying with civilian pilots more. Just sayin...

 

[JAFI]

Military means nothing. I've flown with good and bad. Same goes with the low time Riddle guys. Flown with some of them that were better than military. Flown with some that shouldn't be flying at all.

For the most part I've enjoyed flying with civilian pilots more. Just sayin...

+1, But I do not have a preference civ/mil. I like the ones that don't pound on their chest telling me how good they are because of XYZ, I would rather they just do the job.

 

[pilotyip]

Military means nothing. I've flown with good and bad. Same goes with the low time Riddle guys. Flown with some of them that were better than military. Flown with some that shouldn't be flying at all.

For the most part I've enjoyed flying with civilian pilots more. Just sayin...

I have hired and trained over 400 pilots. That includes 47 military, including helo drivers, with one failure. The other 350, had 30+ failures, there is a difference. There is a uniformity found in a military trained pilot, it is present in other pilots also, but you have to hunt for that guy amongst the 30+ who can not hack it. We like to hire them because of a higher percentage successfully complete training, like the one failure of 47 new hires. In addition, no military pilot has needed additional IOE time or had any problem going through upgrade. The same can not be said for civilian time only. This may be why the military guys seem to get head of the line previledges at the majors.

 

[pipi]

PT,
The military pilots are the best of the best, cream of the crop, unlike the latest generation of entitlement generation crop of knuckleheads flying the average RJ. To equate a 350 hr Naval Aviator doing night traps to a 350 hr Bridge School grad who's parents "loaned" him/her the money to jump start their airline career isn't appropriate. Kind of like comparing Sen. John Glenn to CX880.
'nuff said!
PBR"

Hey, at least they borrowed the money, you got it for free from me and everyone else who pays taxes.
And I have to say, with exceptions here and there, I haven't been impressed with most military pilots I have flown with. Some of the least disciplined pilots I have flown with were Air Force or Army pilots.

 

[JAFI]

This may be why the military guys seem to get head of the line previledges at the majors.

Or the people doing the hiring are ex-military.

I interviewed at a Cargo Carrier. We all had to take a written test. The interview class was 14 retired Airforce C-130 guys and me. They were through the test in 5 minutes. The exam was like nothing I had ever seen before. Later when I told a co-worker of the exam he said he knew the questions. He produced the Airforce Instrument Flying Handbook (AFM 51-37). I still have that copy. As I read the handbook, I found the questions. Nothing like stacking the deck.


In my experence about the same number of military and non military pilots pass to line status. I have been told by several former military pilots "you can't fail me, I was a B52 IP, or F16 fighter pilot, or something of the like.

Not once did a pilot say "you cant fail me, I flew single pilot night freight or flight instructed for 10 years, or had 6 companies go bankrupt on me".

It is interesting how the pilots that have the ability do not have to qualify their background.

 

[kf4amu]

Hey, at least they borrowed the money, you got it for free from me and everyone else who pays taxes.
And I have to say, with exceptions here and there, I haven't been impressed with most military pilots I have flown with. Some of the least disciplined pilots I have flown with were Air Force or Army pilots.

And by free you mean they willingly offered to lay their lives on the line to protect yours...you ungrateful ass

 

[pilotyip]

Hey, at least they borrowed the money, you got it for free from me and everyone else who pays taxes.
And I have to say, with exceptions here and there, I haven't been impressed with most military pilots I have flown with. Some of the least disciplined pilots I have flown with were Air Force or Army pilots.

How come if it was for free, you did not take advantage of it? BTW Then you have not flown with many of the civy background pilots I have flown with, talk about not disciplined.

 

[brokeflyer]

I started in the Air Force. We we're the best at what we had to do. But civilian flying is a different animal.

The best pilots i ever seen we're in the air force, the worst pilots i ever seen we're air force pilots flying civilian.

 

[trip]

Military pilots have better stories to tell, fights off the hours of boredom in cruise.

 

[CX880]

The elite best of the best. We'll make you better.

 

[atpcliff]

It will give politicians the perfect excuse to "offshore jobs" via cabotage. The MPL is the biggest threat since Ab Initio. Not only could there be foreign crews flying US domestic routes, the F/O will have a few hundred hours without a real pilot's license.

They will use Chinese pilots...wait, forgot that China is MASSIVELY understaffed and hiring foreigners.
They will use Indian pilots...wait, forgot that India is MASSIVELY understaffed and hiring foreigners.
They will use African pilots...wait, forgot that the Africa is MASSIVELY understaffed and hiring foreigners.
They will use Latin Amerivcan pilots...wait, forgot that Latin America is MASSIVELY understaffed and hiring foreigners.
So, where will these foreign pilots come from???

Furloughed American, United, NetJets, Midway, ATA, Aloha, Midwest, Independence

American will have all their pilots recalled and be hiring off the street this year.
UAL will have all their pilots recalled (they would have already if it wasn't for the merger) as soon as the merger details are finalized.
NetJets DOES have guys furloughed, and some will return (most will probably not return, as they will have another job they like better).
Many of the rest of the furloughees mentioned have other jobs, and many of them are in other aviation jobs and therefore already in the system. Some will return from overseas flying to fly back here (further increasing the MASSIVE overseas pilot shortage that is now occuring).

Yes, the 1500hr and atp rule which doesn't even go into effect for another 2 years, is nothing more then smoke and mirrors to appease the public. There will be tons of exceptions in there, I believe 4 year colleges are exempt. If fact, the pilot factories are already setting up programs to qualify their the students for rule exemption.

NO one is exempt from the ATP LAW! Could the LAW be changed? Theoretically, but it is NOT as easy as the FAA changing one of their rules.

Hahahahahaha. Wow.

If the airlines paid for training, they could be just as selective.

No, they could not, as there are not enough US residents at a high enough intelligence/physical level who would be willing to enter and complete flight training. They would have to lower the mental and physical qualification quite a bit below what the military is getting, to get enough bodies to fill the future seats.

And yet interviews are scheduled and classes are full...go figure.

Many recent regional classes were 1/2 full or less.

Near-term, the Flight/Duty/Rest rules that will be in effect prior to 1 Aug, will make a difference, especially at the Regionals who abuse their pilots.

cliff
GRB

 

[pipi]

And by free you mean they willingly offered to lay their lives on the line to protect yours...you ungrateful ass

Never asked them to...and if that is truly what they want to do, then stay in the military. That is the biggest guilt trip in the books. Military guys choose their careers like the rest of us chose ours. I will never feel like I owe them anything.

 

[pipi]

How come if it was for free, you did not take advantage of it? BTW Then you have not flown with many of the civy background pilots I have flown with, talk about not disciplined.

How about because I didn't care much for dropping bombs or playing war games? Just because it's free it doesn't mean it has to appeal to me.

 

[pipi]

I started in the Air Force. We we're the best at what we had to do. But civilian flying is a different animal.

The best pilots i ever seen we're in the air force, the worst pilots i ever seen we're air force pilots flying civilian.

I Agree 100%.

 

[jetwash]

They will use Chinese pilots...wait, forgot that China is MASSIVELY understaffed and hiring foreigners.
They will use Indian pilots...wait, forgot that India is MASSIVELY understaffed and hiring foreigners.
They will use African pilots...wait, forgot that the Africa is MASSIVELY understaffed and hiring foreigners.
They will use Latin Amerivcan pilots...wait, forgot that Latin America is MASSIVELY understaffed and hiring foreigners.
So, where will these foreign pilots come from???




cliff
GRB

They will probably open up the doors first to Canadian and Mexican pilots due to the provisions in NAFTA that allow the movement of skilled workers if there is a demand. There is already a list that includes nurses, engineers etc... The US government would just have to add pilots to the list.

The new license conversion agreement between the FAA and Transport Canada now only takes 30 to 60 days waiting time and costs you $100 to convert your FAA ATP to a Canadian ATP or from a Canadian ATP to an FAA ATP. (very easy and inexpensive)

There are lots of young Canadian Pilots with ATP minimums flying up north in -30C temps who would just love to come down here to fly even for a regional.

 

[atpcliff]

Prior to Mexicana going under, they were making more than US pilots. And now, most of the Mexicana guys that still want to fly are already in the system.

As for the Canadians, there ARE a number of Canadian airlines, and there are the same number of foreign jobs available to them as there are to us. And, the Canadians are less scared to move or commute overseas, so there are less of them available to domestic flying. Currently, you must be a citizen or a legal resident to fly in the US. If the change it to allow Canadians and Mexicans, which I doubt they would do, there are no big numbers there to fly our planes. The big numbers WERE in the US, until the aviation industry priced themselves (using a combination of rising training/airplane ownership costs, and lowered pay for pilots) out of pilot candidates. The former pilot-trainees are mostly in non-aviation jobs and/or UAV jobs.