Frustrated

[enigma]

Adam.

If you're not whining, you're doing a good job of pretending. Life's not fair, accept it and move on. Yes, you need a four year degree, and no, it's not a waste even though it seems to be so.

I suggest that you find a junior college that offers a flight program. (not San Juan, they are too expensive) Go there and get your two year along with a Commercial ME/CFI.Then instruct full time until you get the time to go to a regional. Then take classes from any of many on-line universities. CLEP out of every class you can and you'll be finished before the majors start hiring again.


Good Luck.
8N

PS get the four year in something other than aviation

 

[bobbysamd]

To swim with or against the current?

. . . . is how I see your dilemma. And, I believe that you want to swim against.

Let me enumerate a few reasons why a four-year degree will make you a better pilot.

For one thing, a degree will make you better prepared for life. While I love an Aeronautical Science degree and believe that you can do many things with it, a degree in any major signifies a certain level of preparation, qualification and skill. You have to go to at least a few classes and do at least a little studying to earn a degree. In so doing, you receive an education and some training in how to think and reason. That will make you a better pilot, and person, to boot. It helps to be a better person if you want any kind of decent-paying job, in any industry or profession. The degree signifies a skill that you can use either in or outside of aviation. Let's say you earn a degree in English. You can learn to be a copywriter at an ad agency. You can teach English. You can be a proofreader. There are many things you can do - things you may have to do and/or fall back upon if aviation does not (1) work out for you, which is possible or (2) circumstances beyond your control force you to take a hiatus from aviation.

Another thing is the degree signifies that you can complete a training program. All airlines have training programs. They may dubious of your ability to complete such programs with only high school - although you know otherwise. However, with a degree and a decent grade-point average, you've proven it. You need good study skills to do well in college. You need good study skills to get through class at an airline.

I think another reason why airlines want college-educated people is they want well-rounded people working for them. Airlines have tried to hire a diverse group of people. They don't hire strictly Aeronautical Science majors. They hire people with philosophy degrees. They hire lawyers (J.D. degrees) who want to change careers.

Having written all of this, let's boil this down to practicality. The airlines give preference to people with college degrees, with less preference given to people with some college, and the least amount of preference to people with no college. That's just how it is. Aviation is a highly competitive world. If you want to succeed in it, you have to present the best qualifications, always. Some things over which you have no control. With education, you have control. Go take the SAT and get into college. You'll find time to fly. If you cannot concentrate on both, finish college and then concentrate on flying. You won't lose out that much if you go that route.

Good luck with college.

 

[eriknorth]

I think its pretty obvious that you need a degree. I'm in the same situation. I go to college, and I study my butt off, both college and flight training, just do I can check the box on an airline application. Here's the thing; you can be a selective hearer and listen to the people who make you feel better about what you are doing, or you can just wise up and go to school. It's not even about if YOU think that it is needed or not. A college education shows a company that you are not only well-rounded, but there are a lot of life skills that you take out of college as well. Look at it this way: you need a degree. If you think you can make it without one, have fun wasting your money and time on flight training, because I will be sitting in your seat in the cockpit.
Good Luck.
BTW it is wise to have something to fall back on in life in the event that you lose your job, medical, etc.

 

[flydog]

I have yet to interview for a flying job where they gave a rats patooty about flying skills and most airlines have gotten rid of sim evaluations.

If you want a job flying especially in this economy you need the hours, college degree and a squeaky clean background. If you have all 3 you will someday fly for a major airline unless you have the interviewing skills of a Alfred E. Neumann. Bonus points if you are ex-military, a woman or a minority.

 

[Finch]

The great debate...

You guys have pretty much covered all my sentiments.

I can remember wondering why I was in primary school! What was the point I asked myself? The big rip is that it takes 12 fookin' years to even get to the stage where you are actually allowed to think and are expected to give your input on anything. Before that, you get the best marks for spitting up what is told to you. I loved education as soon as I was out of high school.

As aircraft become more complex and require less input from the pilot, we will see a greater importance placed on people that can:
Monitor systems
GET ALONG with their co-workers (on and off the flight deck)
Have a to the minute history of where they were and what they have done since birth
Be able to absorb the vast amount of tech needed to fly these new aircraft
Have good customer service skills
Be able to sit in one spot for hours


Getting a degree is perfect training for most of the above......glad I had fun doing mine. I can't really say that the money I paid got me anything in the way of an education that was relevant, but hey what do you want for 35K? And the girls were pretty good too!

Finch

 

[PositiveRate]

...and there are few greater things in this world then co-ed dormatories.

the airlines are great fun, but i miss college!

 

[Draginass]

It IS whinning when you complain about something that isn't going to change and you can do nothing about.

1. Flying is a job, not a life.

2. You will probably be furloughed sometime in your career and you need backup skills.

3. It is possible that you could lose your medical certificate and be forced out of the profession.

What is the cost of college degree? Maybe $35k at a state school? What's the cost of your flight training? Maybe $50,000?

Right today, what's the 2nd year pay at a major airline? . . . . about $85,000.

Look into scholarships, loans, etc. and start you college degree next semester.

 

[cvsfly]

Like many alluded to here, the best arguement for a college education is that it gives you a foudation for doing something else. I would get a degree in something other than "Aeronautical Science". There are no guarrentees in this life. You may never become a professional pilot - then where would you be. If you can't handle going to school and flight training at the same time, then I'd say you are already in the wrong business. Professional pilots are life long seekers of higher and recurrent education - you are never out of school for very long.

 

[Rush Limbaugh]

PFT aside, I have had many a wingman that have been flying much higher performing jets than you'll ever see with a lot less than 550 hours. What you have accomplished is nothing to brag about.

Personally, I can deal with you flying a jet next month and why would someone like me be p!ssed at you? PFT or not, I lump airline pilots in with everyone else I pay to get me where I want to go whether it be across an ocean or across town.

 

[Rush Limbaugh]

"You probably couldnt afford to fly on this aircraft with your lousy government salary"

That is oh so true...your insight is awe inspiring

 

[adam_jorgensen]

What I think I'm more worried about is not getting a degree, but when should I get a degree? I want it before I'm 30 years old (in 13 years) but are not going to go right to university right when I finish high school. I'm just not ready nor know what I want to take. What if I instead, got my privates probably next spring, get all my other licenses like the multi engine, COMM, etc then worked for somebody? I think that would be good because then I can get paid for flying then I would go to university at the same time because this time, I will have the money and won't have to learn 2 hard things at the same time. What about getting a diploma? I may get that and then get a degree later on. Either way, I'm not putting off flying for college and because that is just how my brain works. I'm not going to learn 2 really hard things at the same time. Probably going to get bashed as usual for this. Either way, I am going to do to university and get a degree, it just won't be right when I get out of high school and I will peruse all my licenses first because that is my priority. How does this sound? I just have a feeling that this is what I should I do.

I am going to stop asking these kind of questions here because the many different opinions of people are just too much for me. Between the 1001 answers here and my parents answers, I don't know who to believe anymore. Instead of trying to find an answer, I have done worse and have gotten my brain into thinking overload. From now on, I'm only going to go to either my parents, or real life pilots for questions like this. Your answers are all really appreciated and I thank all of you for responding so well to my questions, but I realize that it just does me no good to seek trouble of finding 1001 opinions. It just leaves me worst off in the end.

I was saying to my parents last night, I just want to be prepared. I don't want to be unprepared for the big picture. I want to have a happy life when I'm older with the job I want, a happy marriage and everything. I have seen how not being prepared and not making decisions to late in life have destroyed peoples lives. I want to get all the worry out of the way and over with so that I won't have to go through it later on. The thing is, I'm looking too much at the big picture. I need to look at what I need to do now and worry about crossing that bridge when I need to. Its just my character. Prepare for things. Don't do the test if you haven't studied and then fail. That is what I'm trying to put my future as. I don't want to be too late. This is where I wish I would start putting more of my faith in the big guy up above us. Only he knows what is the right answer for me and what is the right way for me. I need to start listening more to him, and less to the world.

So for now, I am going to put off all this silly worry, only worry about getting my privates, and worry about getting a degree when I will really need it and know more of what I will do. And I'm just going to concentrate on flying for now because that is what I love. I'm not going to let something ruin it for me.

 

[Beechnut]

Baby steps man, baby steps.

S.

 

[stardog]

You can certainly be a professional pilot without the four-year degree. I know people who don't have the degree and are flying for a living. Heck, Richard Bach (author) doesn't have a college degree.

There are plenty of flying jobs out there for folks without a degree. However, if your goal is to get to an airline, then you're going to need it. As for how to afford it: good grades, scholarships, grants, working while in school, and student loans are the key. I had to do all the above and managed without financial help from my parents.

 

[bobbysamd]

What I think I'm more worried about is not getting a degree, but when should I get a degree . . . .

Do yourself a favor. Go to college full tiime right out of high school, work hard at it, graduate, and get it out of the way while your mind is essentially in "school" mode. I can virtually guarantee that if you don't you never will go to college. You will get caught up with work, whatever it may be, and will never find the time for school. Don't make that mistake. Just do it.

Lots of luck with your plans.

 

[starvingcfi]

not to be rude here, but is adam getting on anyone else's nerves? asking a question, then arguing with people about their feedback. no matter how many times you ask the question, you're going to get the same answer. i'm in your shoes right now except a little farther up the road with less time to screw around. am i whining? am i b*tching? am i misspelling college? (by the way, lol at saabstory's post. hahaha) no. stop whining. (pretty sure you misspelled that too)

again, not trying to be rude, but i had to say something. grow up.

starvingcfi