Friendly NJI/NJA discussion

[Hawk Driver]

Regarding the belief of some NJA pilots that we at NJI think we are better pilots, in five years here I have NEVER heard any talk like that. However, we absolutely DO NOT want to join your stupid union. It is nothing against the fine pilots at NJA, I promise.

You don't have to worry about joining our union, you will just pay the service fee and continue ops as you did before. Although, I believe you will need to follow the guidance in the T/A when/if flying with an NJA pilot.

HD

 

[ghostrider64]

GV thank you for PMing SeaSpray it seems you may have asked him not to fall on is sword any longer....


I'm retired military (guard), I was striken with the worlds best pilot syndrome that the military breeds. For good reason. How else could a 19 year old fly a gunship into the sights of an enemy surface missile or gun?

That said I'm sure he will be humbled by what he finds out he does not know as I was. Fortunately though I was smart enough to keep most of my arrogance to myself


So back to the subject at hand and friendly conversations.


How are the NJI guys taking the news of NJA guys coming over? I'm hoping that the guys that come are the ones without attitudes. Best case scenario would be folks actually decide they like one another. How will they feel about flying with our Newhire FO's? I say new hires because given the scale of pay it wont make much sense for guys here now to bid it.

 

[BrnJetFuel]

I wasn't making an argument about anything, simply responding to an assertion that NJA pilots were more qualified than NJI pilots. NJI pilots that had 2500 hours in 40 ton jets in 1995 have certainly accrued more experience in the succeeding decade.

We at NJA have heard for years all the lame excuses for us not getting the G-strings. Maybe BBJ Pilot can insert a dose of reality here. Maybe you and the others who where there at EJI in the beginning really let Gulfstreams experience argument go to your heads and justified the holier than thou arrogance that permeates from NJI society today.

However it happened, I don't care. But your argument that NJI pilots are so vastly more experienced today than our own holds no water. NJA has pilots alone in one fleet that have experience flying around the globe in equipment that can carry more fuel or take a cr@p that weighs more than your stretched Falcon. We have C-5, B-747 and yes even Barbie G-string drivers that are going to have no problems holding the reigns of that mighty mind numbing stallion you think is the chariot of the gods.

I'm sure your a great guy and many of us are looking forward to the challenges of integrating the two groups together. But lets put the big (40 ton...ohh that's impressive) ego's to bed and start dealing with real issues, like how Union protections are going to provide better working conditions and QOL for our future NJI brethren.

 

[SeaSpray]

BrnJetfuel,

The union and company have already agreed to the terms of assimilation of NJI into NJA.

Gawd, sounds like the Borg! "You will be assimilated - resistance is futile."

It is not for any of us to talk about modifications of the Letter Of Agreement, a legal document, nor make false promises about its execution.

Uh-Oh! Better get in line, BrnJetFuel, the shop steward has spoken. No free thinking or expression allowed at NJA. The union thinks and speaks for you.

Whether or not people at NJI "like" NJA or its pilots is completely irrelevant. They can always quit and go to Hong Kong if they don't like unions.

Yep, Hawkered, that's consistent with the post you made earlier in this thread saying, "This post started out with all the good intentions of building a gentle path to a stable platform that could be built upon as a bridge at a later date." Typical teamster talk, glibly talking out both sides of your mouth at the same time. At least we know how you really feel about the pilots at NJI and how the union will treat them in this glorified seat grab.

 

[semperfido]

the others who where there at EJI in the beginning really let Gulfstreams experience argument go to your heads and justified the holier than thou arrogance that permeates from NJI society today.

However it happened, I don't care. But your argument that NJI pilots are so vastly more experienced today than our own holds no water.

it is all in your own heads. pilots always have too much time to grumble about imagined misc cr@p. blown way out of any reasonable proportion.

 

[BrnJetFuel]

GV thank you for PMing SeaSpray it seems you may have asked him not to fall on is sword any longer....


I'm retired military (guard), I was striken with the worlds best pilot syndrome that the military breeds. For good reason. How else could a 19 year old fly a gunship into the sights of an enemy surface missile or gun?

That said I'm sure he will be humbled by what he finds out he does not know as I was. Fortunately though I was smart enough to keep most of my arrogance to myself

I want to say that I have nothing but the utmost respect for those that offered their all and served in the military to protect this great Nation and secure the future for our families.

Unfortunately aviation draws plenty of neglected and low self esteemed children that grow into adults who fly airplanes while dragging their past's along with them. They hang out in their uniforms at malls or other public gatherings on their days off and spend their entire existence trying to obtain approval. Those of us who want to just do our job and count the days until we are home again with our families get so sick of lending ear to these obsessive control freaks who's favorite subject is themselves.

I'll grant that not everyone is flying airplanes and what we do is looked upon as amazing and rare. Well maybe it is. But all of us pretty much would agree that all but a small amount of the population could have easily done as good or better of a job than any of us with enough training and vigilance as any of us might have put forth. Pilots who need the constant approval and stroking, let them do it on their own time. Pilots who while hanging our with their peers should really find something interesting to talk about or just shut up.

ghostrider64 and pilots like him who have discovered that each and everyone of us has some unique experiences isn't necessarily a qualifier to incessantly blab ones resume all day long. I have flown with both civilian and military alike that just don't know how to shut up and realize that what they have done isn't equivalent to Mother Teresa or Niel Armstrong. Then I have met astronauts and huge humanitarians who most wouldn't recognize who they were as they never felt it necessary to rant endlessly on about themselves. I guess if you've actually been there and done that, the smile on your face says it all.

 

[BrnJetFuel]

Uh-Oh! Better get in line, BrnJetFuel, the shop steward has spoken. No free thinking or expression allowed at NJA. The union thinks and speaks for you.




Yep, Hawkered, that's consistent with the post you made earlier in this thread saying, "This post started out with all the good intentions of building a gentle path to a stable platform that could be built upon as a bridge at a later date." Typical teamster talk, glibly talking out both sides of your mouth at the same time. At least we know how you really feel about the pilots at NJI and how the union will treat them in this glorified seat grab.

Trust me, Hawkered doesn't speak for me nor the UNION. Fortunately he promised to not post on this board anymore. He sounds like one of our Assistant Chief Pilots who went into management because the fight was getting to fierce for him and now is rearing his head out from under mama's wing as he likes what he see's. Don't worry about him, I'm sure he's neutered and harmless.

 

[GVFlyer]

We at NJA have heard for years all the lame excuses for us not getting the G-strings. Maybe BBJ Pilot can insert a dose of reality here.

I think Tom may be a little less than objective on this issue.

Maybe you and the others who where there at EJI in the beginning really let Gulfstreams experience argument go to your heads and justified the holier than thou arrogance that permeates from NJI society today.

As I have stated many times in the past, I do not now nor have I ever worked for EJI / NJI. I was a Gulfstream Aerospace minor participant in it's formation, worked on joint committees, flew EJI jets when Gulfstream got 1/8 shares, represented Gulfstream in the joint marketing effort and worked on special projects representing the manufacturer. I simply admire the NJI corporate culture and respect the professionalism of it's pilots.

However it happened, I don't care. But your argument that NJI pilots are so vastly more experienced today than our own holds no water. NJA has pilots alone in one fleet that have experience flying around the globe in equipment that can carry more fuel or take a cr@p that weighs more than your stretched Falcon.

Interesting metaphor...

I only suggested that at the time that EJI was formed Gulfstream captains with 2500 hours in type (a condition of employment put in place by Gulfstream Aerospace) were more qualified to fly Gulfstreams than were the Citation pilots at EJA. I further submitted that now that these same Gulfstream captains have been flying the aircraft for an additional 10 years, they could only have become better qualified. As you learn more about Gulfstreams you will find that this is a community that values experience in the equipment.

I'm sure your a great guy and many of us are looking forward to the challenges of integrating the two groups together. But lets put the big (40 ton...ohh that's impressive) ego's to bed and start dealing with real issues, like how Union protections are going to provide better working conditions and QOL for our future NJI brethren.

Thanks, but I won't be flying with you. The G550 actually weighs forty-five and a half tons (without counting ego weight) and I sincerely doubt that forcing pilots that want nothing to do with the Teamsters into the union will in any way benefit them.


GV

 

[squonk]

GVflyer:

As you learn more about Gulfstreams you will find that this is a community that values experience in the equipment

So how does one sprinkle pixie dust and become part of the "community"?

Does one have to have a former address of AAFB?

 

[GVFlyer]

GVflyer:



So how does one sprinkle pixie dust and become part of the "community"?

Depends on the community - any use of pixie dust what-so-ever gets you booted out of the flight test community. Other mottoes of flight test - only girls check weather and training is for weak pilots.

Does one have to have a former address of AAFB?

In the Gulfstream community - that helps.

Let me tell you a "this is no sierra" story. I'll be sure to police up my brass afterwards. When I was flying C-21s in the Big Blue, our Chief of Stan Eval, arguably the best pilot in the detachment, decided to get out and go corporate. She went to Proctor & Gamble. After 10 years as a co-pilot and SLOJO she was promoted to provisional captain. This typlifies much of the industry. Of course, compensation at outfits like P&G is exemplary, as is their equipment: four G-IV SPs, one GV, one G550 and a G550 on order.

GV





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