Flying Pet Peeves!!!!!

[$$$4nothin]

Bos Ground/Tower

when KBOS tells me to pull up closer to the A340 or B757 when my Navajo only weighs 7400lbs fully loaded. Nothing like being hovering 2 feet off the ground on Taxi way November.

And slowing down for anything with jet engines on it when im in my Navaslow

 

[Indypilot]

IAD controllers.


More specifically, IAD controllers that need a physics lesson. Two airplanes doing 250kts stay the EXACT same distance apart from eachother as do two airplanes doing 170KTS. (Go to ORD, watch and learn)

 

[EagleRJ]

Guys that begin every radio call with "and". Usually they'll drag the word out a bit too:

"Aaaand XXX traffic, Cessna 123AB left downwind for 18."
"Aaaand XXX traffic, Cessna 123AB left base for 18."

Useless trivia for the day:

Early radios that had vacuum tubes took a second or two between when you mashed the mic button and when your words went out on the air. Some pilots started off with the extra words to make sure their calls were being transmitted completely. People who do it today probably heard an old-timer do it and figured it sounded cool or something.

I agree- knock it off!

 

[zeroline]

Pilots when approaching an uncontrolled field, call in for aiport advisories; meanwhile had they just listened for a second or two would have figured it out by the dozen or so aircraft in the pattern making their respective postion calls.
But no they still have to call in and ask which runway is in use.

Dont be so quick to judge. CFI's have to teach their students how to request an airport asdvisory. When your student flys once a week on saturday when every uncontrolled airports pattern in the area is busy as $h!t, you cant only have him/her listen to the radio to figure out whats going on in the pattern. Sure, thats what they should do. But, because of primacy, if thats all they do, thats alll they WILL EVER do. They will never ask for a traffic advisory unless you make sure they do it every once in a while. This scenario often happens to be the case more often than not.

 

[Jedi_Cheese]

Airport Advisories are used when there is a FSS on the field (as per AC 90-42F). I assume that you are using the term as it is normally used (if not - disregard the rest of this post).

You have to learn how to request an airport advisory? News to me and I have flown into airports where I have never seen another aircraft in motion when I was a student. I have also had it be me and an aircraft w/o an electrical system in the pattern and thus asking for airport advisories does jack.

If you want to know what I am talking about: http://www.avweb.com/news/news/183049-1.html (AC 90-42F)

 

[English]

Ok, my pet peeve...calling a non-towered airport "uncontrolled". Makes it sound like we are all out doing loopty-loops in the pattern.

 

[NJA Capt]

Student's who take all day to clear runways!!! Pilots who taxi all the way to the ramp with the flaps still down!!!

Dash 8 pilots who use 9000' on rollout so they can turn off in front of the commuter concourse.

ARTCCs who start your descents 250nm out.
ARTCCs who climb/descend you 1000' at a time.
500kt aircraft vectored behind 300 kt aircraft
Aircraft capable of 5000+ fpm stuck behind a plane struggling at 1000 fpm.
Any airliner above FL370.


Best clearance....Fly runway heading, climb and maintain FL410. Oh if we could only get that at TEB

 

[Typhoon1244]

Pilots who taxi all the way to the ramp with the flaps still down!!!

Our procedures require us to set the flaps for the next takeoff after landing (unless it's the last flight of the day). Get over it.

 

[zeroline]

Jedi:

Airport Advisories are used when there is a FSS on the field (as per AC 90-42F). I assume that you are using the term as it is normally used (if not - disregard the rest of this post).

You have to learn how to request an airport advisory? News to me and I have flown into airports where I have never seen another aircraft in motion when I was a student. I have also had it be me and an aircraft w/o an electrical system in the pattern and thus asking for airport advisories does jack.

If you want to know what I am talking about: http://www.avweb.com/news/news/183049-1.html (AC 90-42F)

No I am not talking about the local airport advisory provided by an FSS (AIM 4-1-9-d) Im talking about the the airport "advisory" provided by UNICOM. Check out AIM 4-1-9-h. I'll sumarize for you: UNICOM communication procedures; Report approximately 10 miles from the airport....and request wind information and runway in use (ie. airport advisory...kinda like saying "looking" instead of the official terminoligy: negative contact) And yes, you do need to know how to request an advisory on UNICOM frequency as well as know the difference between UNICOM and CTAF. Otherwise an examiner might fail you. As far as practical uses Id file it under the "good to know" category especially if you'd like to become a CFI oneday. Keep in mind I never said not to use the see and avoid method as well.

New Pet Peeve:
Low-time pilots who think they have been "studying" and know more than the pilot who flys something a little bigger than a warrior just cause he/she is not flying little planes anymore.

 

[dseagrav]

Dont be so quick to judge. CFI's have to teach their students how to request an airport asdvisory. When your student flys once a week on saturday when every uncontrolled airports pattern in the area is busy as $h!t, you cant only have him/her listen to the radio to figure out whats going on in the pattern. Sure, thats what they should do. But, because of primacy, if thats all they do, thats alll they WILL EVER do. They will never ask for a traffic advisory unless you make sure they do it every once in a while. This scenario often happens to be the case more often than not.

My CFI does not do this. At least he hasn't done it yet. Radio's busy as hell, and we can hear all the way to Joliet from pattern altitude (from Peoria), but he just has me look out the window and make sure I'm not going to hit anyone before entering the pattern. (Granted there is only one runway so it's not very difficult. Maybe he'll ask me to do it later when we go somewhere busier. I'll probably say "I have eyes" or something and see if he insists, but he doesn't seem the lazy-shortcut type.)

 

[machtuck]

pilots who think every flight is a leg going to the F`in moon... they take it sooo serious they dont enjoy it.

and 2nd, guys senior to me that are younger.

 

[pilotman2105]

Thinking for Yourself

Dont be so quick to judge. CFI's have to teach their students how to request an airport asdvisory. When your student flys once a week on saturday when every uncontrolled airports pattern in the area is busy as $h!t, you cant only have him/her listen to the radio to figure out whats going on in the pattern. Sure, thats what they should do. But, because of primacy, if thats all they do, thats alll they WILL EVER do. They will never ask for a traffic advisory unless you make sure they do it every once in a while. This scenario often happens to be the case more often than not.

So what you want is for a student to tie up a busy CTAF frequency (which is often the same as UNICOM) to get an airport advisory because they can't figure out from the wind and local traffic what the current runway is?

"XYZ traffic, Cessna 12345 entered left downwind for runway 36." That seems pretty self explanatory to me what runway to use.

"XYZ Airport Weather. Wind 360@12..." That seems pretty self explanatory to me, too.
Yeah, the law of primacy is in effect here, but so is common sense. Just because it's the first thing that they've learned that does not mean that it is going to be the only thing that they learn.

I would think that any basic intro to communications at non-towered airports would include the "use common sense" clause. There is no need for an airport advisory, local airport advisory, or whatever the he!! you want to call it. Get the weather yourself, listen to traffic, and use your brain to make a decision.

 

[Flight_Line]

[font=&quot]People who call for an airport advisory ON THE GROUND while staring right at the big day-glow orange windsock. This is especially true if there are 50 planes in the pattern.

The dorky instructor who calls for the above airport advisory (5 times) and when unicom does not answer asks the only other plane around (me) why "everyone" is using (the crosswind runway) when the wind (all 5 kts of it) CLEARLY favors the other runway. It’s a non-towered airport here sparky, use whatever one you want!

People who try to fly MY plane instead of theirs. This means YOU Mr. Centurion guy who entered a wide downwind behind me and just had to check with me if I was going to make the runway since I was so close.

CAP pilots who freak out because they loose sight of me in the pattern and when they finally see me freak out more because I am on base lower than they are in the downwind. New concept here... DECEND to land.

Pilots who try to use an IAP to cover for a right pattern. To the guy in that Bonanza who nearly hit me. The VOR 21 comes in from the other side. Might be time to get those navs checked.

Pilots who fly IFR VFR.

Controllers who are consistently unpleasant.

That's all I got for now.
[/font]

 

[dseagrav]

[font=&quot]Pilots who fly IFR VFR.
[/font]

Does this refer to people who don't scan and spend too much time reading the instruments rather than looking outsite (I have this problem and I am trying to break it) or something else?

 

[Flight_Line]

Does this refer to people who don't scan and spend too much time reading the instruments rather than looking outsite (I have this problem and I am trying to break it) or something else?

No, it refers to the guy who blasts off into the soup VFR.

 

[VOBG Direct]

Taking the Runway items checklist --- Complete.

Then other guy in the cockpit says " Are you ready ?"

 

[DCMartin]

You are missing the point

So what you want is for a student to tie up a busy CTAF frequency (which is often the same as UNICOM) to get an airport advisory because they can't figure out from the wind and local traffic what the current runway is?

"XYZ traffic, Cessna 12345 entered left downwind for runway 36." That seems pretty self explanatory to me what runway to use.

"XYZ Airport Weather. Wind 360@12..." That seems pretty self explanatory to me, too.
Yeah, the law of primacy is in effect here, but so is common sense. Just because it's the first thing that they've learned that does not mean that it is going to be the only thing that they learn.

I would think that any basic intro to communications at non-towered airports would include the "use common sense" clause. There is no need for an airport advisory, local airport advisory, or whatever the he!! you want to call it. Get the weather yourself, listen to traffic, and use your brain to make a decision.

I assume zero flight instructed in Southern Cali or DC area or a busy are like the two.(they are extremely busy especially on the weekend) I have ran into the same problem that was stated. There is nothing wrongwith plugging in CTAF/UNICOM and (even though there are two or three aircraft in the pattern) saying to your student, "you want to practice that call to UNICOM to get an airport advisory." Even though you wouldnt do it in the same situation, its important that your student learn how to do it sometime. You have them try it just so they Know how to do it. Which is exactly what zero stated. You should read more carefully next time.

 

[pilotman2105]

I understand what he said and I disagree with both zero and your comments regarding the matter. If you truly want to follow the situation that you're proposing, do it like this:

If there are aircraft in the pattern, use the runway that they are using OR whatever is called for by the reported weather. THAT is what you are going to do in a realistic situation.

If there are NO aircraft in the pattern, then find the local weather. This can be either your airport advisory or tuning in ASOS and make the determination from that.

Yeah, you want to teach your students, but you want to explain WHY you are using one particular method to determine the active runway. This is opposed to blinding interrupting a busy CTAF/UNICOM frequency to get an airport advisory because you have a student on board. That isn't realistic. Go to an airport where it generally isn't busy to practice the airport advisory thing.

I assume zero flight instructed in Southern Cali or DC area or a busy are like the two.(they are extremely busy especially on the weekend) I have ran into the same problem that was stated. There is nothing wrongwith plugging in CTAF/UNICOM and (even though there are two or three aircraft in the pattern) saying to your student, "you want to practice that call to UNICOM to get an airport advisory." Even though you wouldnt do it in the same situation, its important that your student learn how to do it sometime. You have them try it just so they Know how to do it. Which is exactly what zero stated. You should read more carefully next time.

 

[TonyC]

The last several posts highlight my biggest peeve, and it has to do with instructing.

I hate it when an Instuctor insists that HIS technique is the BEST technique, it's the ONLY technique that anyone should use, and you should treat it as a PROCEDURE. If you plan to please said Instructor and be passed on the ride by said Instructor, you very well better use the Instructor's technique and none other.

It belies a weakness in the character and knowledge of the Instructor, and it does the student a disservice.

(SECOND VERSE: Apply same to Captain / First Officer relationship.)

 

[Alchemy]

Maybe I misunderstand what you're trying to say, but if you're number one at the hold bars waiting for traffic and the guy behind you calls ready to go-- he might get cleared, but in most cases he's not going to be able to go around you to get to the runway. That's a pretty good way to piss off a controller I would imagine. Of course, this is all a moot point if everyone just waited until they were number one before they called ready to depart.

That's exactly what I'm saying.....at my home airport, the taxiways are about 200ft wide at the point where they intersect with the runway. This is plenty of room for airplanes to taxi around each other. If the guy behind you calls in ready because you were waiting for the guy on short final to land, you just got leap frogged. Calling in ready is how you "get in line" so to speak.

 

[apdsm]

Pilot's who talk about flightinfo.com all the time...

 

[zeroline]

Finally someone understands

The last several posts highlight my biggest peeve, and it has to do with instructing.

I hate it when an Instuctor insists that HIS technique is the BEST technique, it's the ONLY technique that anyone should use, and you should treat it as a PROCEDURE. If you plan to please said Instructor and be passed on the ride by said Instructor, you very well better use the Instructor's technique and none other.

It belies a weakness in the character and knowledge of the Instructor, and it does the student a disservice.

(SECOND VERSE: Apply same to Captain / First Officer relationship.)

This was the whole point of my first post "DONT BE SO QUICK TO JUDGE" Just because someone is doing something differently than the way you do it dont assume the person is doing something wrong. You have to be dynamic as a pilot and especially as an instructor. You cant teach every one the same way. I would very much like to take a student to a non-busy non-towered airport and teach them calls but some circumstances dont allow it. This goes for alot of things like for example: wide patterns. Before I was an instructor I used to get so pissed when people flew wide patterns or extended further than I liked. But after instructing for a while you learn why sometimes its necessary to fly an extended pattern.

There are many differnet ways to fly a plane safely and remain within the rules. Everyones got a slightly different techniqe (especially in the part 91 and 135 world) The best pilots are the ones who understand this and can adjust accordingly when needed.

 

[dseagrav]

Pilot's who talk about flightinfo.com all the time...

Is this the wrong place for the obvious Fight Club joke? ^_^

 

[BankAccount=0$]

The last several posts highlight my biggest peeve, and it has to do with instructing.

I hate it when an Instuctor insists that HIS technique is the BEST technique, it's the ONLY technique that anyone should use, and you should treat it as a PROCEDURE. If you plan to please said Instructor and be passed on the ride by said Instructor, you very well better use the Instructor's technique and none other.

It belies a weakness in the character and knowledge of the Instructor, and it does the student a disservice.

(SECOND VERSE: Apply same to Captain / First Officer relationship.)

I always thought the second verse was the same as the first. "I'm Henery the Eighth I am, Henery the Eighth I am, I am. I got married to the widow next door, she's been married seven times before.....etc. etc......"

Sorry for the misguided attempt at some humor, back to the regularly scheduled Pet Peeve disscussion

 

[FSB99]

"Blocked!" "blocked!" "BLOCKED!" ..........blocking each other as you all scream "blocked!"


IAH controllers.. from the ground, to the tower, to approach/departure, to center.
they must not talk to each other. one has you slow to 280 and vector you all over creation. next has you max forward, direct whatever. next asks your speed and where you're going.
On the ground, don't dare miss an instruction.. if you have the nerve to ask them to repeat it, be prepared to be spoken to with disdain and sarcasm. oh.. you also taxi too slow/fast, depending on the hour. you never taxi just right in iah.

 

[pilotman2105]

The last several posts highlight my biggest peeve, and it has to do with instructing.

I hate it when an Instuctor insists that HIS technique is the BEST technique, it's the ONLY technique that anyone should use, and you should treat it as a PROCEDURE. If you plan to please said Instructor and be passed on the ride by said Instructor, you very well better use the Instructor's technique and none other.

It belies a weakness in the character and knowledge of the Instructor, and it does the student a disservice.

(SECOND VERSE: Apply same to Captain / First Officer relationship.)

Students require a set method and concrete procedure to learn anything. If you say "this is the way that I do it, but you can do it how you want," then the student (especially an inexperienced one) will change his/her pattern each time they do a set task.

Pilots are creatures of habit. Experienced pilots may do what they want, how they want, because they more fully understand the multiple facets that must be covered. A student doesn't. Thus, something concrete gives both a more solid basis for understanding on the student's side, as well as a more concrete item to critique/review for the instructor.

Now then, this doesn't necessarily mean that the instructor's ways are correct. If there is another way, the instructor should study it, evaluate its merits, and then make a decision as to whether it is appropriate to include in their teaching practices. This decision may very from instructor to instructor, or student to student.

But we're all in agreement that there are multiple ways to get the same thing accomplished. Regardless, the overall goal is to get it done quickly, safely, and as effeciently as possible.

 

[greenpickle]

Beech drivers

Beech 1900 passengers and their funny funny jokes.

"Oh my God is this small!"
"Look, I have a window seat and an aisle seat."
"Are you old enough to fly this thing?"
"When are they going to let you fly the real planes?"
"Why does the flight attendant ride up front?"
"It says alot about your plane(company) when it is so dirty."(refering to exhaust soot)
"Whats the inflight movie?"

Whatever, how come everyone becomes a comedian on a 1900?

And thank God we fly with the doors shut now but I use to just love the private pilot or wannabe sitting in 1C giving his critique to the people around them. I would just turn around, smile, and close the door.

 

[TonyC]

I always thought the second verse was the same as the first. "I'm Henery the Eighth I am, Henery the Eighth I am, I am. I got married to the widow next door, she's been married seven times before.....etc. etc......"

Sorry for the misguided attempt at some humor, back to the regularly scheduled Pet Peeve disscussion

Funny thing, that song was ringing in the back of my mind even as I typed that.





Humor is a good thing, even in the middle of a good Pet Peeve thread.

 

[Flying Illini]

First off, congrats to DCmartin for having the best avatar I've ever seen!

On to the pet peeve: FBO's who use the airport unicom as their arinc frequency. Do you have any idea how many airports you can hear/reach from 20,000+ feet and 80 miles out on 122.8?! Makes it tough to ensure that you pax have their ride waiting when the freq is congested...and I hate talking on 122.8 because God only knows how many people are hearing you and how much of a freq. congestion problem you're causing. FBO's, get a dedicated arinc freq! Oh yeah, turn up the volume too!

 

[LAXSaabdude]

On to the pet peeve: FBO's who use the airport unicom as their arinc frequency. Do you have any idea how many airports you can hear/reach from 20,000+ feet and 80 miles out on 122.8?! Makes it tough to ensure that you pax have their ride waiting when the freq is congested...and I hate talking on 122.8 because God only knows how many people are hearing you and how much of a freq. congestion problem you're causing. FBO's, get a dedicated arinc freq! Oh yeah, turn up the volume too!

There is an FBO at VNY that has the same ops frequency as Eagle in LAX. Every now and then you'll hear some Gulfstream calling to ask about their transportation. I just talk over 'em!

LAXSaabdude.