Flight Options Vacation Changes

[SilverSurfer]

To late

I've stated this before, but I'll say it again. My interest is actually for my friends at a different fractional where I was affiliated for a short time between layoffs. This board is read by all and is a great example of all the reasons not to bring a union on to the property.

Hey bro its to late. If you were out on the road and talking to some of these left behind friends, be they Flex or Shares, you would know that it way to late. I was talking to a Shares pilot yesterday and they are very close to having the cards they need and your management buddies at Shares keep giving them the motivations to sign them and send them in. Flex has been trying to organize for a while now but their management has been somewhat smarter about things and not exercised any attacks on the pilots. Sooner or later Flex pilots will see the light and will also get on board.

On another note, your constant negative comments about the union at option are also way to late. Management at FLOPS has perpetrated so many attacks on us that there is no way we would ever trust management again. They continue to attack us and our quality of life, lie to us about everything, steal from us and our families, and turn FLOPS into the most undesirable fractional operator to work for.

You and your "management is the answer to all that ails us, unions are evil and any union member is out to kill the company" crap is just that crap. The VP of Ops at FLOPS, the guy that everyone thinks you are, has said more then once that a company gets the union they deserve. Well guess what, he's right and thats exactly what FLOPS and the MOOrons that run it got.

 

[netjetwife]

Actually, this board is full of examples of exactly why underpaid/overworked pilots need a union on property to protect their interests when management seeks to balance the budget on their backs and unilaterally changes (for the worse) the pay and/or working conditions they were hired under. There are also lots of examples of the good that can be accomplished when pilots stand together and work for a contract that gives them fair compensation and work rules that a company is legally required to follow.

How many members of this board would have a house built without a contract to protect their investment? Common sense dictates that building a career is equally important and the investment is even greater. Fractional pilots deserve to have a voice in their career destiny. Best of luck to those at the bargaining table and those collecting cards. NJW

 

[FracMonkey]

b19, BOB, whoever the feck you are....

....is realy immaterial. The quest for a contract anywhere is a quest for a system of checks and balances. Nothing more. Management holds all the cards unless the affected groups have a way to balance their power. You have made your case abundantly clear. It's a case that I reject.

Management's reluctance to sign a contract equates to their reluctance to share power. Since the pilots in our operation are not only pilots, but baggage handlers, customer service representatives, TSA agents and the face of the company why shouldn't they rate industry standard pay?

Oh, and by the way with the looming pilot shortage that appears to be having an effect at FLOPS, why shouldn't we have a contract that attracts and retains the best pilots? Hmmmmmm.......?

 

[skanza]

First of all we all know he is not a pilot as defined from his post regarding one of our fellow pilots. Any pilot with an ounce of decency or civility would not have made a comment about doing someone elses girlfriend because of their schedule. Besides we all know he is anxious to end this union battle so he can go back to those long sunset strolls with his boyfriend down there in Miami on South Beach. Secondly, the only airline I can think of that is non-union is skywest and just ask them how much they love their non-union airline. Good ole' Jerry Atkins giving them a 1 and 1/2 percent pay increase in seven years, dumping that pbs bidding system in their lap, oh yeah, and flying seventy and ninety seat aircraft for fifty seat pay. Unions exist because of the criminal actions of greeedy airline executives. The union is here to stay at flight options. I suggest we ignore this idiot. Do not engage in any of his disruptive conjecture. We need to get rid of the ot thread and approach our bretheren in a more respectful manner. They are trying to divide us and that is exactly what b19 is trying to do here. As much as I am against doing ot, in time the offenders will realize their selfish interests are affecting their well being as well. Now if you will forgive me I have to get some rest. I only had thirty minutes to postflight and do a minimal aircraft postflight inspection. I am sure after ten hours of rest here at the super 8 I will have the keen sense for discovering any discrepancies I might have overlooked last night. Adios

I know you. This won't work. Don't expect a reply, fool.

 

[FR8DOG777]

welcome back

I know you. This won't work. Don't expect a reply, fool.

Crawl back in your hole troll!!!

 

[GerryG]

The stench deepens. GM is out on strike nationwide, baseball can't get steroids out of the game because of the union and the Flight Options pilots are going to play games with the "rules" rather than negotiate in good faith. How many non-union careers and small business are going to take the hit cause of union work actions in the GM strike? How many dealership non-union workers will be affected? Will you support your local union brothers when YOU can't get your car fixed cause there aren't any parts available?

Can you smell it yet?

SMELL THIS BOB!!

Looks like a 6th year Capt. at FLOPS could not go over to NJ and break even with 1st year FO pay. I wonder how many pilots you will have left to abuse come spring?

18 Day Fixed Base Wage Tables: PIC F/O& F/O Greater Than 40K lbs

1 $106,444 .......1 $69,188 $79,073
2 $110,169 .......2 $71,610 $81,840
3 $114,025 .......3 $77,537 $84,704
4 $118,016 .......4 $80,251 $87,669
5 $122,147 .......5 $83,060 $90,738
6 $126,422 .......6 $88,495 $93,913
7 $130,847 .......7 $91,593 $97,200
8 $135,426 .......8 $93,882 $100,602
9 $140,166 .......9 $96,229 $104,123
10 $145,072 ......10 $98,635 $107,768
11 $150,149
12 $155,405
13 $160,844
14 $166,473​

Base pay only.​

 

[fischman]

If that person you call "nobody" doesn't care, that's OK. However, I consider the rest of the readership "somebody" and a very intellegent group of pilots. I'm certain they would prefer not to be insulted by you calling them "nobody".

Sir, nobody cares what your opinion is.

 

[dime line]

Sir, nobody cares what your opinion is.

don't get mad at Bob, he just saw the new payscale and is currently getting his resume ready to send to NJ's, the man needs to pay his bill also.....

 

[FracMonkey]

Since I know you read this website

Mr. Tyler,

Here is the deal. The new NJ Tentative Agreement sounds the death nell for FLOPS in its current form.

I have spoken to many of my friends at FLOPS today and they are all applying to NetJets. A pretty agressive and smart business tactic, if you ask me. Now there is no question that each and every fractional in the industry is now a training ground for NetJets.

It appears that your handlers (MS and SA) are faced with a tough decision. Do you up with the money, settle the contract, watch FLOPS die a slow painful death, or quit your job?

The ball is now firmly in management's court at FLOPS. The survival of the company could depend entirely on you, sir.

Best of luck.

The Monkey

 

[netjetwife]

Monkey, that sums it up. My husband said the same thing to me about the FLOPS situation. I certainly hope that management will wise up. It doesn't have to be this way and NJA is living proof that there is a better way. Motivated workers make great employees. When there is little/no labor strife everyone is able to concentrate on service and profits rise. Burned out, resentful ones are less productive and more prone to illness. It amazes me that such basic concepts are ignored by penny-wise, pound-foolish managers over and over... It also angers me because the pilots and their families usually end up losing income and/or QOL. Hopefully, the NJA TA will bring the fence sitters in your group around and be the wake up call your management needs. Best Wishes to Options pilots and their families! NJW

 

[dime line]

I don't want just a pay raise, I want it in contract form. If they give just a pay raise all of the koolaide drinkers will be in a stronger position to say "look what the company did without the need for a union (contract)" I don't want the drive to die.

 

[Freedom]

Majority of FLOPS pilots not stupid

A pay raise will just perhaps save FLOPS from closing the doors.

It will not cause our pilots to suddenly forget all the attacks we have endured from this management team.

These attacks have not been timid, they have been of a terrorist nature. I will not forget, nor will most of my peers. We will still go after a Contract.

If FLOPS management does not come up with an immediate pay raise to stem the resignations, and prevent their charter costs from going into outer space, then I will start to believe that Raytheon wishes to shut it down.

Its that simple.

Freedom is not Free.

 

[skyismyoffice]

don't get mad at Bob, he just saw the new payscale and is currently getting his resume ready to send to NJ's, the man needs to pay his bill also.....

No scabs welcome at Net Jets!

 

[SilverSurfer]

No scabs welcome at Net Jets!

A lot of FLPOS guys are talking about going to NJ and leaving this sinking ship. Can't say that I blame them. Our management has their head so far up their collective arrogant arsses that the light of reality can't be seen.

The problem for some of these guys is they have not paid dues while at FLOPS and when the NJ Union hiring committee sees this during their interview process they will not make the cut. All things being equal dues paying members will be selected over those that have not. I don't think these pilots are exactly viewed as SCABS but some of the same connotations apply to them.

Bottom line, if you have any interest in going to NJ and you want your best shot at making the cut, get right with the Union now.

 

[TurboHonda]

A lot of FLPOS guys are talking about going to NJ and leaving this sinking ship. Can't say that I blame them. Our management has their head so far up their collective arrogant arsses that the light of reality can't be seen.

The problem for some of these guys is they have not paid dues while at FLOPS and when the NJ Union hiring committee sees this during their interview process they will not make the cut. All things being equal dues paying members will be selected over those that have not. I don't think these pilots are exactly viewed as SCABS but some of the same connotations apply to them.

Bottom line, if you have any interest in going to NJ and you want your best shot at making the cut, get right with the Union now.

Surfer, you're being too kind. Now they know what you know. I'd be all for letting them find out the hard way, by going through the whole application and interview process, only to get the rejection letter.

 

[netjetwife]

I like the portable billboard! Very effective example of your dues being used to promote your cause. Those not pulling their weight by chipping in their share are hurting the effort. When it comes to contract battles it's easy to see that it takes money to make money. The more you stand your ground, the more the others will get with the program I think. Letting others do the ground work seems to be a common personality trait... Hang in there!

 

[SilverSurfer]

Surfer, you're being too kind. Now they know what you know. I'd be all for letting them find out the hard way, by going through the whole application and interview process, only to get the rejection letter.

Well maybe I should have the same view, but if our remaining koolaid drinkers understand this and we are able to get a few more in good standing, it helps us all out. Besides, if they were rejected they would never know it was for not being a member in good standing.

 

[Hobbes]

do the damn math

I know some captains I fly with at Flops that have been there 8 years and are going to try to go to NJ. They will be getting a raise if they start on the SIC flex schedule. How do you like that? I know for a fact that MANY Flops pilots are trying to punch out to NJ.

The management at Flops appears to be predatory but stupid. Akin to the jackal that sees a mouse on the other side of the road and races out to get it, only to be hit by a truck (whose horn was blowing too!)

 

[SilverSurfer]

I know some captains I fly with at Flops that have been there 8 years and are going to try to go to NJ. They will be getting a raise if they start on the SIC flex schedule. How do you like that? I know for a fact that MANY Flops pilots are trying to punch out to NJ.

The management at Flops appears to be predatory but stupid. Akin to the jackal that sees a mouse on the other side of the road and races out to get it, only to be hit by a truck (whose horn was blowing too!)

Can you blame those that want to leave this train wreck. Our CEO and his side kick have all but ruined this company. Neither one of them have even the most rudimentary understanding of this business and want to apply the same failed ideas and mistakes he made before being fired from the sh!tbag commuters here. The pilots have tried to tell them, the owners have tried to tell them and continue to do so by leaving in droves that waht they are doing is wrong. Before long we will pass the point of no return and FLOPS as a fractional operator will be a thing of the past.

We had no presence at NBAA, nothing other the Schreeinga, Sanjay and Tyler walking around pressing the flesh. Our union had a much larger and more visible presence then our company had. What does that tell you. The largest event in corporate aviation and FLOPS management thinks they are so good at what they do that they can virtually ignore it. This misplaced arrogance and stupidity is the root of most of the ridiculous moves we have seen lately. Things like hiring a garage door salesman as our VP of sales and marketing, like the comical marketing materials and slogans we saw announced with our "re-branding".

If all these moorons are doing wasn't destroying the company,it would be hilarious. uke:

 

[400pilot]

like the comical marketing materials and slogans

There is a word for the new advertising campaign. Stupid. Is this the best our company can do? What's worse, they're proud of it.