Flight Options Non-MIGS

[GhettoBeechjet]

If you look at the new pay scale, i would say the 6 year beechjet FO bears the financial burden of things done to benefit the 10 year plus captains. The new hires, if opts ever hires again will be the ones to pay for the benefits of the contract. I hope the union will look out for the entire Flops pilot group next time. As far as the non migs they are within their right under the contract. If they didn't want non migs, they should have made Flops a closed shop.

No contract including the one under which I work at SWA is perfect. I also hope that the next contract is better than the current one. I hope this not only at Options and SWA but across the industry.

Ohio is a right to work state. A closed shop is not permitted under federal law. A Union shop is not permitted in a right to work state. Flight Options is an agency shop.

 

[wacoflyr]

Flight Options is not a closed shop. It is an agency shop.

My mistake. As for rest, I guess we know where each other stands.

 

[dime line]

Good luck to anyone on the list that is trying to go to Southwest. It won't happen on my watch!

I've heard this list has made its way to Delta's hiring committee as well, and, just so happens a guy on list, is in the pool at Delta.

 

[1folinepilot]

I've heard this list has made its way to Delta's hiring committee as well, and, just so happens a guy on list, is in the pool at Delta.

Dime, You are a piece of sh!t for doing that to someone! The aviation community is a small one and your actions over this trivial gray area will be remembered if you blocked his attempts at employment.

Did you stop to think that perhaps the reason he was leaving Flops was to get away from the HARASSMENT and BULLSH!T you and your small group of buddies spread around?

 

[Pervis]

.Did you stop to think that perhaps the reason he was leaving Flops was to get away from the HARASSMENT and BULLSH!T you and your small group of buddies spread around?

And you think he's going to avoid union protocal at Delta? ROE in dealing with scabs goes way back before FLOPS or any other Frac ever existed. And where does Dime say he provided the list to Delta's hiring committee? Since you're so good at leaping to conclusions, I'd have to say your reaction smells like that of a scab. What list are you on?

 

[dime line]

Dime, You are a piece of sh!t for doing that to someone! The aviation community is a small one and your actions over this trivial gray area will be remembered if you blocked his attempts at employment.

Did you stop to think that perhaps the reason he was leaving Flops was to get away from the HARASSMENT and BULLSH!T you and your small group of buddies spread around?

I never said i sent the list to Delta, learn to read. But I do think the Delta poolie is a hypocrite for not paying his dues here at FLOPS, yet enjoying the benefits of the Delta union contract, so no I dont have a problem with the list going there or any other company for that fact. Those pilots on the list CHOOSE the path that their on

 

[1folinepilot]

the two of you should learn the definition of what a scab is. Looking at the list you published, there is only one scab on that list and he is enjoying virtual bid pay while flying in the small cabin.

 

[dime line]

the two of you should learn the definition of what a scab is. Looking at the list you published, there is only one scab on that list and he is enjoying virtual bid pay while flying in the small cabin.

I never once called any of them scabs

 

[GhettoBeechjet]

Dime, You are a piece of sh!t for doing that to someone! The aviation community is a small one and your actions over this trivial gray area will be remembered if you blocked his attempts at employment.

Did you stop to think that perhaps the reason he was leaving Flops was to get away from the HARASSMENT and BULLSH!T you and your small group of buddies spread around?

Delta pilots are UNION PILOTS. If the individual in question has chosen not to be a UNION PILOT he should not seek employment in a unionized pilot group. He is either A.) anti union or B.) self serving and doesn't want to pay his share to become a MIG. In either case you reap what you sow and the ALPA pilots on the hiring commitee at Delta need to know what they are getting.

Paying what you owe is not a gray area and is not trivial.

 

[dime line]

In either case you reap what you sow and the ALPA pilots on the hiring commitee at Delta need to know what they are getting.

Well said

 

[fracjack]

Delta pilots are UNION PILOTS. If the individual in question has chosen not to be a UNION PILOT he should not seek employment in a unionized pilot group. He is either A.) anti union or B.) self serving and doesn't want to pay his share to become a MIG. In either case you reap what you sow and the ALPA pilots on the hiring commitee at Delta need to know what they are getting.

Paying what you owe is not a gray area and is not trivial.

What is owed is service fees for not belonging,that is contractual. You forgot C....is not selfserving but does not agree with union bargaining process and bylaw changes. WTF is a SWA newbie f/o doing on this forum? Get a freakin life.

 

[GhettoBeechjet]

What is owed is service fees for not belonging,that is contractual. You forgot C....is not selfserving but does not agree with union bargaining process and bylaw changes. .

Sir what is owed is dues from day one. Thats what the majority of the pilots knowingly voted for when they voted in the IBT. Just like taxes you don't get to only pay when you agree with everything. If your town put a levy on the ballot and it passed you would still owe the taxes even if you voted no.

The real issue here is that the IBT can't force the pilots on the list to pay what they owe. Just because the IBT can't enforce the debt at this time doesn't mean the the money is not owed. What the IBT can and is doing is expose the individuals for who and what they are and subject them to the judgement and scrutiny of their peers. If the poeple on the list can't handle that they need to pay what they owe.

If C... Doesn't agree with the union bargaining process he shouldn't seek work at a unionized carrier like DAL. If it were really a matter of principal he would seek employment at a non union carrier. He can't have it both ways.

 

[1folinepilot]

Sir what is owed is dues from day one. Thats what the majority of the pilots knowingly voted for when they voted in the IBT. Just like taxes you don't get to only pay when you agree with everything. If your town put a levy on the ballot and it passed you would still owe the taxes even if you voted no.

The real issue here is that the IBT can't force the pilots on the list to pay what they owe. Just because the IBT can't enforce the debt at this time doesn't mean the the money is not owed. What the IBT can and is doing is expose the individuals for who and what they are and subject them to the judgement and scrutiny of their peers. If the poeple on the list can't handle that they need to pay what they owe.

If C... Doesn't agree with the union bargaining process he shouldn't seek work at a unionized carrier like DAL. If it were really a matter of principal he would seek employment at a non union carrier. He can't have it both ways.

How selective is your memory? When the majority of the pilots voted in the IBT for representation they were promised by Praetorian and his MEC that they would not owe any dues until the first contract was voted on and ratified. They were told that the IBT would fund the drive and that there was a war chest of funds from the Net Jet's pilots when they left the IBT. What happened was a later vote from the majority of the IBT1108 pilots which included the majority group of the Net Jets pilots to amend the bylaws to make a qualification to vote, one needed to pay dues from day one, not just from contract ratification. Most of the Flight Options pilots didn't even receive ballots in a timely fashion to vote or even receive ballots at all so the Flight Option pilots effectively had no say in that flawed decision to amend the bylaws on the dues issue.

Once the ball is in play, don't change the rules of the game to suit your own outcome.

 

[GhettoBeechjet]

How selective is your memory? When the majority of the pilots voted in the IBT for representation they were promised by Praetorian and his MEC that they would not owe any dues until the first contract was voted on and ratified. They were told that the IBT would fund the drive and that there was a war chest of funds from the Net Jet's pilots when they left the IBT. What happened was a later vote from the majority of the IBT1108 pilots which included the majority group of the Net Jets pilots to amend the bylaws to make a qualification to vote, one needed to pay dues from day one, not just from contract ratification. Most of the Flight Options pilots didn't even receive ballots in a timely fashion to vote or even receive ballots at all so the Flight Option pilots effectively had no say in that flawed decision to amend the bylaws on the dues issue.

Once the ball is in play, don't change the rules of the game to suit your own outcome.

My memory is very good and not selective. Thank you for your concern. To refresh your memory the 1108 e board made the dues announcement prior to the election. I remember well because I seriously considered it when it came time to vote. They then found out that there was a problem with that after the election and had to ammend the by laws. So the Flight Options Pilots did in fact know we would have to pay dues before the election. We as a group voted in the 1108 knowing that that was the case. Quit trying to dodge the issue here. These guys owe the money. They need to pay up or deal with the consequences.

At the time of the Options vote there was no organized movement for the Netjets Pilots to leave the IBT. That came more than a year later. Ref the link to the AIN article below. 1108 was voted in by Options in 2006. Netjets Pilots left the IBT in 2008.

http://www.ainonline.com/ain-and-ai...&tx_ttnews[story_pointer]=5&tx_ttnews[mode]=1

 

[fracjack]

My memory is very good and not selective. Thank you for your concern. To refresh your memory the 1108 e board made the dues announcement prior to the election. I remember well because I seriously considered it when it came time to vote. They then found out that there was a problem with that after the election and had to ammend the by laws. So the Flight Options Pilots did in fact know we would have to pay dues before the election. We as a group voted in the 1108 knowing that that was the case. Quit trying to dodge the issue here. These guys owe the money. They need to pay up or deal with the consequences.

At the time of the Options vote there was no organized movement for the Netjets Pilots to leave the IBT. That came more than a year later. Ref the link to the AIN article below. 1108 was voted in by Options in 2006. Netjets Pilots left the IBT in 2008.

http://www.ainonline.com/ain-and-ai...&tx_ttnews[story_pointer]=5&tx_ttnews[mode]=1

WRONG BUCKO.. union koolaid drinkers voluntarily paid without asking. The vote to unionize specifically said no dues until a CBA was approved. Incidentally the vote was quickly rushed before the company could divulge their latest salary increase(reportedly 30% across the board) of which they immediately recinded any possible offer of a pay increase.

Ponder this... since someone compiled a list of 66 non-migs excluding mgtmt pilots of maybe 10 or so would show the 76 out of 300 are not very happy,that's 25% !! Not to include Migs who are not happy but don't wanna rock the leaky boat and you have ineffective leadership,hard feeling amongst the troops and a ton of grievances to eventually fight since many will slowly become aware of the CBA specifics that the company WILL push. Good thing the union has all that war chest money from NetJets.

So tell me again how that industry leading contract is working for ya? The fighting is now between the crews out looking at uniforms to see if they can spot those proud union ID's and ostracize the others who probably don't give a crap. The true mature professional educated crews will not let personal differences in status interfere. Principles and integrity can be displayed from migs and non migs. Paying contractual service fees for employment is a far cry from being treated as SCABS. Follow the money to the problems,it goes both ways.