FlexJet / Flight Options / SkyJet

[dime line]

It is obvious you do not work for Flexjet

your right, we all work for Ken

 

[dime line]

http://www.flightoptions.com/fleet/challenger-300.html

10 suitcases + 6 sets of golf clubs + 5 pairs of skies??? Hope the pilots pack lite...

Need to put U-haul on the side of that plane.

 

[TWA 2 ASA FO]

KR is a Micro manager and NOTHING is approved unless he says so. He still has to approve all upgrades and check airmen, PSM Appointments. Middle managers cannot make final decision without his ok! Please pass the popcorn!

If KR has to approve upgrades, then what us the point of your seniority list and union?

Has KR done out if seniority upgrades ever?

 

[TWA 2 ASA FO]

I'm just a FLOPs guy, in good standing, and REALLY like the idea of the 300's coming our way! I wish you FLEX guys the best, but ya'll should think about a CBA (Collective Bargaining Agreement). I think you'll be surprised at how clever they (our Management team) will be to erode your work rules/MELs/duty times. I wouldn't post this had I not seen it. Did I tell you I'm sooo ready to see a REAL 300, that is NOT a Phenom
Good luck ya'll.

The 300s are coming to the Flight Options store front to be flown by Flexjet pilots.

Not sure how you are wishing us the best while drooling over taking our airplanes.

 

[chief9404]

Has KR done out if seniority upgrades ever?

Yes he has!

 

[TWA 2 ASA FO]

Yes he has!

Were these the famous SFO crews we hear the legends about?

 

[chief9404]

Were these the famous SFO crews we hear the legends about?

Not sure about that, but I do recall a family friends son who worked part time for Corp Wings left to go to college. When he finished he was hired as a pilot and given a back dated hire date so he would receive a low seniority number.

There was another friend given a Falcon capt position. There were a few that started out as Challenger Capts as well. If you were a FOK you were taken care of. Go read his book. He only likes to take care of a core group (20%) of pilots. The hell with everyone else.

 

[OldCrow]

The 300s are coming to the Flight Options store front to be flown by Flexjet pilots.

Not sure how you are wishing us the best while drooling over taking our airplanes.

WOW! You are an angry little dude. It was my understanding that you/FLEX were getting new 350s, so it was a win-win kinda thing in my eyes.
I really do wish ya'll the best, and I'll leave it at that.

 

[Photoflight]

WOW! You are an angry little dude. It was my understanding that you/FLEX were getting new 350s, so it was a win-win kinda thing in my eyes.
I really do wish ya'll the best, and I'll leave it at that.

The way I read it, a flight options pilots will not fly a challenger 300.

The older challenger 300s will be offered at the flight options service level but flown by Flexjet pilots. The new 350s will be operated by Flexjet pilots as well and offered under the Flexjet service level.

We've been told we will be flying both FO and Flex trips an the difference, for us, will mainly be the name on the trip sheet.


As far as the union is concerned, the previous post is correct. Your not gonna scare the guys into joining with what ifs.

 

[The Architect]

Guess Who Said This?

Thoughts on seniority integration.

"As the new policy directly affects our pilots, it was important for them to formulate, vote on and ultimately make the final decision on how seniority rankings were going to be established following the combination of Flight Options and Raytheon Travel Air. Management does not live in the seniority world and it was important for pilots to construct and control their seniority destiny."​

Guess who said this?​

 

[The Architect]

Not Possible.

The way I read it, a flight options pilots will not fly a challenger 300.

The older challenger 300s will be offered at the flight options service level but flown by Flexjet pilots. The new 350s will be operated by Flexjet pilots as well and offered under the Flexjet service level.

We've been told we will be flying both FO and Flex trips an the difference, for us, will mainly be the name on the trip sheet.


As far as the union is concerned, the previous post is correct. Your not gonna scare the guys into joining with what ifs.

Sometimes what you've "been told" is not always right. Better yet, not even possible. So, were your lied to? Or misinformed? Or is that the same thing?

Why?

It appears that if Flight Options sells the share or jetcard, then Flight Options must perform the flying unless another agreement is reached. Sold by "Flight Options," flown by "Flight Options Pilots."


Flight Options CBA:

"1.2 Scope of the Agreement
1.2(a) Except as otherwise provided in this Section, all present and future revenue flying performed in and for the service of the Company, its Affiliates, or the Company?s Parent, including present and future flying performed on behalf of the Company, its Affiliates, or Parent pursuant to any agreement or arrangement to [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]which the Company, any of its Affiliates, or Parent holds a majority interest, shall be performed by Pilots named on the Flight Options Pilots Seniority List in accordance with the terms and conditions of this Agreement and any other applicable agreement between the Company and the International Brotherhood of Teamsters, Airline Division." [/FONT][/FONT]

 

[dime line]

Sometimes what you've "been told" is not always right. Better yet, not even possible. So, were your lied to? Or misinformed? Or is that the same thing?

Why?

It appears that if Flight Options sells the share or jetcard, then Flight Options must perform the flying unless another agreement is reached. Sold by "Flight Options," flown by "Flight Options Pilots."


Flight Options CBA:

"1.2 Scope of the Agreement
1.2(a) Except as otherwise provided in this Section, all present and future revenue flying performed in and for the service of the Company, its Affiliates, or the Company?s Parent, including present and future flying performed on behalf of the Company, its Affiliates, or Parent pursuant to any agreement or arrangement to [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]which the Company, any of its Affiliates, or Parent holds a majority interest, shall be performed by Pilots named on the Flight Options Pilots Seniority List in accordance with the terms and conditions of this Agreement and any other applicable agreement between the Company and the International Brotherhood of Teamsters, Airline Division." [/FONT][/FONT]

And that means after the single carrier goes, were all Flight Options pilots. or what ever the name will be, but we will be one pilot group.

You guys are fighting over the scraps

 

[albatros101]

Flight Options CBA:

"1.2 Scope of the Agreement
1.2(a) Except as otherwise provided in this Section, all present and future revenue flying performed in and for the service of the Company, its Affiliates, or the Company?s Parent, including present and future flying performed on behalf of the Company, its Affiliates, or Parent pursuant to any agreement or arrangement to [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]which the Company, any of its Affiliates, or Parent holds a majority interest, shall be performed by Pilots named on the Flight Options Pilots Seniority List in accordance with the terms and conditions of this Agreement and any other applicable agreement between the Company and the International Brotherhood of Teamsters, Airline Division." [/FONT][/FONT]

KR can violate scope and tell the teamsters to sue him. Then IBT will go to court KR will drag it out and out....... Then say sorry and comply with the CBA, It's been done before,

In 2008, Mesa Air Group, the parent company of Freedom Airlines, entered litigation about contractual obligations with Delta Air Lines. Delta attempted to terminate the ERJ-145 In 2008, a federal judge blocked Delta from terminating Freedom's regional flying contract, but it forced Mesa to file for bankruptcy.

Freedom won the case, they were on the right side of the law and the judge agreed. He ruled in their favor, but it was to late. Delta planed it that way they lost the case , but won the war Freedom with all its pilots and other crew were gone.

The old saying " the one with the gold makes the rules" is true whether we like it or not.

 

[albatros101]

PS. 300 flying will be by Flex crew's operated by Jet Solutions LLC

 

[The Architect]

Close, but no Prize.

PS. 300 flying will be by Flex crew's operated by Jet Solutions LLC

Your informational research with the Mesa debacle should be noted. However, is not the same situation. Closer research of that litigation compared to this situation will indicate that significant difference arise.

Close, but no prize.

The significance is in the scope language of Flight Options CBA. The parties (holdings and parents) are not publically denying the application of the scope portion of the Flight Options CBA. Why? They can't.

So, read carefully. You need not be an attorney and this is not a "gray" area.

"Except as otherwise provided in this Section, all present and future revenue flying performed in and for the service of the Company, its Affiliates, or the Company's Parent, including present and future flying performed on behalf of the Company, its Affiliates, or Parent pursuant to any agreement or arrangement to [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]which the Company, any of its Affiliates, or Parent holds a majority interest, shall be performed by Pilots named on the Flight Options Pilots Seniority List in accordance with the terms and conditions of this Agreement and any other applicable agreement between the Company and the International Brotherhood of Teamsters, Airline Division." [/FONT][/FONT]

Again, Flight Options advertises the sale of fractions, membership and jetcard (service) for the Challenger 300 (check their website). The flying performed (persons employed as pilots flying aircraft) on behalf of the Company (Flight Options), any of its Affiliates, or PARENT (DAC and ALL Holding Companies)...SHALL be performed by pilots named on the Flight Options Pilot Seniority List.

One can make the argument that Jet Solutions is doing the work with Flexjet pilots. Again. Close, but no prize!

Read the language.

On a side note. Notice that "the Challenger 300 will be available beginning Fall 2014."

Now, the Flexjet Pilot group may in fact crew the Challenger 300's in Fall 2014. However, it won't occur, not even begin, without fence agreements negotiated between the parites.