FDJ2, Someone is gonna work all weekend...

[JoeMerchant]

7) Prepare career expectations argument....checked...

8) Prepare argument of why the other airline needs you more than you need them.....checked....

 

[bleagle]

FDJ2,

When Delta taxis into the terminal....

a) Does Delta pull into the gate? or

b) Does the GATE GET DELTA?

 

[JAM-BRO]

The FAA inspections started on Wednesday. You are saying that RA and EB waited till Friday afternoon, minutes after NWA makes a merger announcement, to cancel their highly publized media events due to cancellations of 3% of DALs flights? Half of those pax were rebooked on your own flights and the rest on other airlines. I bet that there is no chaos at any of your hubs. There is not a single airline that has 100% load factor. Not even 90%. Space was found for all those pax. FO SHO!!!!

Denial is not a river in the Middle East...

Anyways, thanks for giving our EMT so much UNDESERVED credit. Friday's announcement has Dal and NWA written all over it.

All our airplanes are up and running, that's true. However, many passengers were stranded. Load factors are high and crews may not be in place. The company asked and the union has allowed temporary contractual relief through the 31st to get everything running smoothly again.

I'm not sure if it would be wise for the CEO and CFO to be flying around the world on publicity flights when passengers may still be stranded and employees are working overtime this weekend.

I see this overture from NWA management as just another trial baloon, similar to NWALPA's last week.

We'll see what happens.

 

[FDJ2]

The FAA inspections started on Wednesday. You are saying that RA and EB waited till Friday afternoon, minutes after NWA makes a merger announcement, to cancel their highly publized media events due to cancellations of 3% of DALs flights?

Did NWA make a merger announcement? I must have missed it. Could you provide the press release.

There are a host of operational issues that linger for many days after over 100 aircraft are suddenly grounded. Senior management asked for and received temporary contractual relief on certain scheduling issues until the 31st to deal with this issue.


Half of those pax were rebooked on your own flights and the rest on other airlines. I bet that there is no chaos at any of your hubs. There is not a single airline that has 100% load factor. Not even 90%. Space was found for all those pax. FO SHO!!!!

Denial is not a river in the Middle East...

Anyways, thanks for giving our EMT so much UNDESERVED credit. Friday's announcement has Dal and NWA written all over it.

Hey chicken little, relax. Floating an idea in the media in hopes of spurring is no big deal. We all know NWA is trying to sell themselves, I'm sure it will happen, but I have my doubts that it will happen with DAL.

 

[JAM-BRO]

chicken little, BUHUHAAA!!! No name calling please. It belittles YOU....

Open your eyes bud... You are ignoring the elephant in the room. Think what you want... You might not want it personally but that really doesn't matter. The deal is done, regardless of promises made or a pilot group's desires.

Let's see what happens next week. Oh yeah!!! FAA fine negotiations. Riiiight..........

Hey chicken little, relax. Floating an idea in the media in hopes of spurring is no big deal. We all know NWA is trying to sell themselves, I'm sure it will happen, but I have my doubts that it will happen with DAL.

 

[FDJ2]

Open your eyes bud... You are ignoring the elephant in the room. Think what you want... You might not want it personally but that really doesn't matter. The deal is done, regardless of promises made or a pilot group's desires.

Let's see what happens next week. Oh yeah!!! FAA fine negotiations. Riiiight..........

Fair enough. Let's see what happens.

BTW, didn't you say the merger was announced on Friday? Could you provide a link to the merger announcement. Thanks.

 

[Stifler's Mom]

As far as the stranded passengers go, ASA filled in with extra ships and segments to help relieve some of the pressure.

 

[JoeMerchant]

As far as the stranded passengers go, ASA filled in with extra ships and segments to help relieve some of the pressure.

.....yes we did....Isn't it funny how popular we become when we are needed by the mainline.....

 

[Stifler's Mom]

.....yes we did....Isn't it funny how popular we become when we are needed by the mainline.....

Much like taking in the furloughs, it was just the right thing to do. Business sense aside.

Maybe General Lee will go easy on the ASA bashing for a month or so as a result.

 

[General Lee]

Much like taking in the furloughs, it was just the right thing to do. Business sense aside.

Maybe General Lee will go easy on the ASA bashing for a month or so as a result.

When Joe Merchant was hired at ASA, his career expectations at the time were to someday fly the Dash-7. Since then, a lot has changed, thanks to some shortsightedness from ALPA (to allow unlimited 50s and 70s), and then thanks to a BK judge for the 76 seaters. Now his 50s will start to go away thanks to higher gas (yes, I know you just got 4 more for FLA---but high gas will take them from Comair and others first). He likes to think he knew he would get larger planes from the beginning, when in reality he was thinking of larger props at the time. He may get his wish, but it is unlikely he will ever see anything larger than a 76 seater at ASA.

As far as the pilots at ASA, I continue to thank them for helping our furloughed pilots after 9-11. Now if they could just climb out of the bottom of the rankings (yeah, even with Delta rampers in ATL), it would be nice.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[~~~^~~~]

General:

Joe got hired back before I did and there were 105 seat jets on the property. The Delta MEC actually clamped down some on CY96 scope when ASA was purchased and ASA's routes became Delta's. Every scope liberalization since then was negotiated, and mebership ratified, by the Delta pilots. No Judge was involved.

ASA should have been merged like any acquired airline. Since that did not happen we have to deal with a bastardization of who's flying is who's. ALPA (we) failed to do the right thing. Economically, Delta does own the flying. The question still unresolved - "is it right to buy and airline, strip it's code, then outsource it?" Frank Lorenzo would see no problem with that and did just that through TIA. ALPA then turned around and had cake and ice cream with the Continental scabs while welcoming Continental in with open arms and press releases.

Joe's peeing in the wind at this point, but it does not detract from the fact that from an alter ego perspective, the guy is correct. Increasingly it is a distinction without a difference. Delta Management will do what they want to do and we can only hope that the Delta MEC will give a little crap about the Delta brand and erosion of Delta's narrow body flying. Thus far, I have seen no indication that scope is on the radar of the Delta MEC in the NWA discussions.

The idea that fuel prices will fix scope is completely erroneous. Joe's airplane, as well as the jet he will bid when the ATR goes away, is actually superior to NWA's and DAL's DC9/MD fleet and in some instances is better than the 737 on a CASM basis. ALPA's EF&A department knows this and has published their findings - again, I do not know why scope is not an issue....

 

[General Lee]

General:

Joe got hired back before I did and there were 105 seat jets on the property. The Delta MEC actually clamped down some on CY96 scope when ASA was purchased and ASA's routes became Delta's. Every scope liberalization since then was negotiated, and mebership ratified, by the Delta pilots. No Judge was involved.

ASA should have been merged like any acquired airline. Since that did not happen we have to deal with a bastardization of who's flying is who's. ALPA (we) failed to do the right thing. Economically, Delta does own the flying. The question still unresolved - "is it right to buy and airline, strip it's code, then outsource it?" Frank Lorenzo would see no problem with that and did just that through TIA. ALPA then turned around and had cake and ice cream with the Continental scabs while welcoming Continental in with open arms and press releases.

Joe's peeing in the wind at this point, but it does not detract from the fact that from an alter ego perspective, the guy is correct. Increasingly it is a distinction without a difference. Delta Management will do what they want to do and we can only hope that the Delta MEC will give a little crap about the Delta brand and erosion of Delta's narrow body flying. Thus far, I have seen no indication that scope is on the radar of the Delta MEC in the NWA discussions.

The idea that fuel prices will fix scope is completely erroneous. Joe's airplane, as well as the jet he will bid when the ATR goes away, is actually superior to NWA's and DAL's DC9/MD fleet and in some instances is better than the 737 on a CASM basis. ALPA's EF&A department knows this and has published their findings - again, I do not know why scope is not an issue....

Fins,

I just don't think we offered to management the right to go to 76 seats from 70 seats. I have a feeling the judge in the backround had something to do with it.

As far as props go, I bet the Dash-8-400 would be a good tool on certain routes, with a very low casm and lower fuel burn. Colgan, Lynx, and Porter are the latest to use them and I bet they will be successful. We'll see if the AT7s are replaced with them, and I think Joe would love it, as it would remind him of the Dash 7 days. With high oil, props aren't just for boats. But, there is a limit for everything, and even most passengers get nervous when entering a prop plane. Trust me, I saw it plenty on the Brasilia and the DO-228 back at MDW. I thought DAL management wanted to maybe keep the DC9s a bit longer for a "100 seater?" Too bad it burns fuel like a 185 seater (757). We shall see.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[~~~^~~~]

General:

Delta operated Folker 27's when they bought NorthEast. I will not be happy until all Delta flying, is done by Delta pilots.

I agree that the pressures on the Delta MEC were enormous. However, instead of taking a "bargaining credit" for the outsourcing, they could have fought to get the jets on the property, giving the furloughed guys jobs and you an upgrade if you choosed. A decision was made, under pressure, but still no Judge ordered the scope relaxed further.

 

[General Lee]

General:

Delta operated Folker 27's when they bought NorthEast. I will not be happy until all Delta flying, is done by Delta pilots.

I agree that the pressures on the Delta MEC were enormous. However, instead of taking a "bargaining credit" for the outsourcing, they could have fought to get the jets on the property, giving the furloughed guys jobs and you an upgrade if you choosed. A decision was made, under pressure, but still no Judge ordered the scope relaxed further.

I don't think being in BK allows too much "fighting" for things. It is more like "let's not lose as much." Could we have spoken up a bit when they came to scope? Probably. They actually wanted more seats available to DCI, and we kept it as low as we could. The process was painful for everyone, except the lawyers and judge.

We also had L100s (Hercs) flying cargo in the early 1970s. I wish we would have kept that cargo operation too, it could have turned into FEDEX....?


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[JoeMerchant]

General:

Delta operated Folker 27's when they bought NorthEast. I will not be happy until all Delta flying, is done by Delta pilots.

I agree that the pressures on the Delta MEC were enormous. However, instead of taking a "bargaining credit" for the outsourcing, they could have fought to get the jets on the property, giving the furloughed guys jobs and you an upgrade if you choosed. A decision was made, under pressure, but still no Judge ordered the scope relaxed further.

Fins I am with you in concept.....but the devil is in the details....what happens to those ALPA members who make their livelyhood on this outsourced flying.....How does ALPA deal with representing all of us fairly at this point.....

Tired of peeing in the wind......