Don't Become An Airline Pilot

[N6069L]

My Retort

Fellow Aviators,

I agree that $80k and flying a 757 and 767 sounds like it's great, AND BELIEVE ME IT IS and truly rewarding and I do consider myself very lucky to be in this position especially after having paid my dues as a CFI and as regional pilot for 6 years and then again my first couple of years at the major. What some of you may not know, is that if you are based in the North East of the USA, $80k is not nearly enough money to live in a decent area in a decent home, (please note I said decent, not luxury) Forget about putting money aside in a 401k, and forget about saving for a child’s education, (and I am sure most of you know how expensive that is). NOW I know we can always commute, trust me I know that this is an option but I prefer to just go home about 30 mins away, and not have to play the standby game and stress out while I just flew back from FCO and am very tired. What a chimera, to be able to live decently at your base! Commuting is very tough and hard on you. For those who continue to think its so much money check out some of the home prices, state income and real estate taxes in the NY Metropolitan Area and you will be shocked. PLEASE fellow aviators, I am not doing this for the love of money, if that were the case I would be with some Wall Street Firm earning the salaries that are required to live DECENTLY here in the tri-state area. Once again I am stressing DECENT and not requesting luxury. I also would like to once again reiterate that I love flying airplanes and don't prefer another profession, but I do think the salaries need to be addressed since many pilots are unable to afford to live in a DECENT area near his/her base so that he/she won't be tired and fall asleep while crossing the pond just because he/she has been hanging around the airport all day because he/she had to catch the 6:43 am flt from MCO because all the later flights were booked. Dear aviators please do realize that we are very underpaid and sometimes miserably treated by our leaders. Now I am not trying to be rude, but if I were to bet, most of you who I think I am acting childish and avariciously, probably are not pilots for AMR, UAL, CAL, NWA etc.
Once again, I want to stress that I am not seeking luxury, I want decency and respect, and most importantly I do not want to be in a fatigued state while flying passengers. They deserve a pilot who does not have any financial worries and not one who has been commuting all day.

 

[Publishers]

While I appreciate your comments, everything begins and ends with "YOU"/ It is your definition of "decent", it your desire to live in a certain place in a certain way, a certain style. Obviously the company should have asked you where to fly and where to base people. I know that during the interview you mentioned to them all of these issues so they would understand your needs.

 

[N6069L]

Further info

First of all, I never intended to upset anyone here but simply state some facts of what you will be getting yourself into if you want to fly for a major US carrier. All I am trying to say is that this profession has become all the things I previously mentioned. You will see this when you fly for a major. To give you an example, I just finished having some snacks and drinks in Paris in the hotel crew room (which is really nice by the way) and there were two NWA pilots and 1 UAL pilot. We initally discussed general things, scub diving, kids, how nice Paris is, etc. But, of course shop talk is inevitable. Let's just say that I am not that far off course with my previous posts...ONCE again, we want DECENY AND RESPECT. I will admit that my inital post may have been very harsh and crude, and for this I appologize, if some of you were offended. What we need to do as pilots is to become aware that we deserve what is fair, NOT MORE and DEFINITELY NOT LESS.

 

[Mickey]

I made more my sixth year at a regional. I don't have sjs and refuse to take a pay cut to start commuting to a "major" in an expensive city. There are a lot of smaller airlines and corporate flight departments that pay 90-100k which is darn good in the smaller communities that these companies are in. Of course you don't fly the heavy iron, the QOL as a whole, I feel is higher. Flying can be a great career if you research and make your sound decisions based on economics and not sjs. It's amazing that so many pilots talk about QOL but then don't act accordingly to attain it. Maybe if pilots stopped flocking to these "majors" the pay would go up.

Good luck.

 

[pilotyip]

Stop it!

I made more my sixth year at a regional. I don't have sjs and refuse to take a pay cut to start commuting to a "major" in an expensive city. There are a lot of smaller airlines and corporate flight departments that pay 90-100k which is darn good in the smaller communities that these companies are in. Of course you don't fly the heavy iron, the QOL as a whole, I feel is higher. Flying can be a great career if you research and make your sound decisions based on economics and not sjs. It's amazing that so many pilots talk about QOL but then don't act accordingly to attain it. Maybe if pilots stopped flocking to these "majors" the pay would go up.

Good luck.

This is a pilot site, stop dealing in reality.

 

[Midnight Flyer]

First of all, I never intended to upset anyone here but simply state some facts of what you will be getting yourself into if you want to fly for a major US carrier. All I am trying to say is that this profession has become all the things I previously mentioned. You will see this when you fly for a major. To give you an example, I just finished having some snacks and drinks in Paris in the hotel crew room (which is really nice by the way) and there were two NWA pilots and 1 UAL pilot. We initally discussed general things, scub diving, kids, how nice Paris is, etc. But, of course shop talk is inevitable. Let's just say that I am not that far off course with my previous posts...ONCE again, we want DECENY AND RESPECT. I will admit that my inital post may have been very harsh and crude, and for this I appologize, if some of you were offended. What we need to do as pilots is to become aware that we deserve what is fair, NOT MORE and DEFINITELY NOT LESS.

I know what you're talking about. It's messed up, I agree.

Some pilots for some legacy airlines in the 80's/90's were making in the 300's.

It's painfully obvious that those days are over and more than likely, we probably won't ever see that kind of money again.

Not becoming a pilot because you'll only earn up to $80,000/yr is a poor reason to not enter into this profession.

Like someone else stated, $80,000/yr is in the top percentiles of wage-earners. I personally am not going leave aviation just because I can't earn over $80,000/yr.

 

[Snapshot]

I AM POOR AND IN DEBT DUE TO THE LOW SALARIES. I have been flying for a major for almost 3 years and was at a regional airline for 6 years prior. I HAVE NEVER MADE MORE THAN $80000 in one year.

Boo ********************ing Hoo, ******************************.

No, dickbag, if you are in poor and in debt with an $80,000 salary (on year 3!), it is not due to low salaries, it is due to your poor spending/saving/money management habits. YOU ARE THE PROBLEM, not your 80,000 paycheck! That is a lot of money to be making having only worked regional/third year major. YOU are a remarkable waste of carbon if you are that deep in debt with that kind of money. There are not words to sufficiently describe what a FOOL/whining little bitch you are. There are hundreds of pilots out there with a decent head on their shoulders that deserve your job infinitely more than you do.

 

[Snapshot]

Just got past my rage to read the further posts....

I want decency and respect

Then stop whining, Puta.

(BTW, I own a house and have a VERY Decent life in one of the top 5 cost of living areas in the country on far less than 80K)

 

[N6069L]

Snapshot

Have you ever heard of such a thing as professionalism. I know this is just a post but please...I wrote this post without using any derogatory language. I wrote this post because I was curious what the feedback would be and, I even offered my apologies to anyone who may have been offended. Now, instead of calling me names why don't you tell me, or us how you do it. Maybe a perfunctory financial plan of sorts on how to save for yourself, save for a child's college, put money in a 401k, (since pensions are gone) and what type of a loan you have for a house that costs on average 400k, and let's not forget the 10k yearly Real Estate taxes that are associated with it. I know I would and am pretty sure others would appreciated this more than childish name calling. Please let us know? Thank you.

 

[Publishers]

When I was with a company that had some let's say higher risk missions than others, people used to ask, "what do you pay these guys to do this?"/ The answer was the same as the guys who do the lesser risk missions. "Why then do they do it?" Simple, they like the challenge and the adrenalin rush. QOL can only be seen from your perspective. A Gulfstream captain friend of mine has a new pick up and a bass boat out back. His QOL bowl would run over if he were paid more. That bowl would empty quickly if he had to get into a monkey suit and actually talk to passengers.

 

[CrimsonEclipse]

Boo ********************ing Hoo, ******************************.

No, dickbag, if you are in poor and in debt with an $80,000 salary (on year 3!), it is not due to low salaries, it is due to your poor spending/saving/money management habits. YOU ARE THE PROBLEM, not your 80,000 paycheck! That is a lot of money to be making having only worked regional/third year major. YOU are a remarkable waste of carbon if you are that deep in debt with that kind of money. There are not words to sufficiently describe what a FOOL/whining little bitch you are. There are hundreds of pilots out there with a decent head on their shoulders that deserve your job infinitely more than you do.

Did you just call him a condom?:laugh:

CE

 

[BOYCAPTAIN]

Yes we all love to fly airplanes there is no questions about it, but let me tell you from a 757 FO’s perspective for a major airline. I AM POOR AND IN DEBT DUE TO THE LOW SALARIES. I have been flying for a major for almost 3 years and was at a regional airline for 6 years prior. I HAVE NEVER MADE MORE THAN $80000 in one year. And what's even worse is that working for an airline (believe me ANY AIRLINE) you are surrounded by very much negativity that you will also become very negative yourself. I've tried everything to try to stay positive but this has become impossible. If you consider this career, please do your research thoroughly and ask airline pilots about what they REALLY think of their job and do take their answers into consideration. Watch this you tube video and you will be humiliated even if you are not a pilot!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RayMaswju1A

All i can say is make smart decisions and research the companies u want to work for....i had a job with UAL and FDX in 95...my research led me to FDX based on the outlook of the cargo industry and the history of FDX....my friends made their decisions based on flight attendants, hats and double breasted jackets....i am 38 years old and have been at FDX for over 13 years....i am sitting in my house in longboat key regretting going back to work in about 3 weeks....i could not imagine doing anything else....be smart with your money, stay married or single and good luck...i love this career choice!

That being said the pax carriers have been screwed after 911 and it is a disgrace what has happened to their income, retirements and work rules....i can't imagine the frustration and lifestyle change these guys have been going through...i have many friends on the pax side....i hope things turn around for them and yes $80,000 sucks for operating a 757!!!

 

[Publishers]

boycaptain -- obviously you made the correct decision for you. It was one you could have made even earlier for FDX had the product dominance and the yields to support the quality operation unlike a number of other freight companies. Even today, it remains one of a kind. Still, remember that product that faxing documents that Fred Smith thought was great. If you had left another company to be part of that, you would have made a big mistake. It si OK to look back but it serves no purpose to stare.

 

[BOYCAPTAIN]

boycaptain -- obviously you made the correct decision for you. It was one you could have made even earlier for FDX had the product dominance and the yields to support the quality operation unlike a number of other freight companies. Even today, it remains one of a kind. Still, remember that product that faxing documents that Fred Smith thought was great. If you had left another company to be part of that, you would have made a big mistake. It si OK to look back but it serves no purpose to stare.

There are still guys here that were flying when the ZAPMAIL debacle occurred....not a bad decision at all...all i was saying is do research on where u want to work...if i could not get a job with FDX or UPS these days i probably would STARING at NETJETS..seems like a stable thriving career over there...

 

[pilotyip]

tell me

There are still guys here that were flying when the ZAPMAIL debacle occurred....not a bad decision at all...all i was saying is do research on where u want to work...if i could not get a job with FDX or UPS these days i probably would STARING at NETJETS..seems like a stable thriving career over there...

Tell me do you feel getting hired at FedEx at age 25, was an example of your skill and desire, or luck and timing? If you feel it is skill and desire, why was your skill or desire at age 25 superior to 10,000 other pilots looking for jobs? How many pilots will ever even have a chance to even apply at FedEx? BTw You seem to enjoy your job and that makes it a great job.