Does JetBlue have career FO's?

[Guitar rocker]

We have been using PDC for well over 15 years at ORD. At 8 years ago the 727's all had the newer touch screen ACARS so that means the S/O was the person getting the clearance from the box and not a radio. So as they say on Mythbusters.....Busted!

Nope, it was FO...he couldnt do it. Period.

 

[Guitar rocker]

[
I really wouldnt say that UAL has the most experienced pilots out there based on the above.

Please tell me your kidding? You actually think people believe your jumpseat "stories' and it some how validates your thesis above?[/quote]

You can believe it or not, makes zero difference to me.

Tell me there koo koo, what other major US airline had 250TT required time on their app and hired a lot of just recip types? Why is it that so many other airlines required 1000 PIC turbine time?

Fact is, like I said, ofcourse you guys have plenty of experienced guys....throw in some of the college and low time wonders in that total, and now you dont have "the most experienced" guys/gals out there. Simple as that. I do admire your attempts to back up the inexperienced you have....but it doesnt work. Try again.

 

[FDJ2]

Tell me there koo koo, what other major US airline had 250TT required time on their app and hired a lot of just recip types? .

You seem to be an expert on UAL hiring, could you please tell us what the average age and experience was of a UAL new hire? Pick whatever year you have the data on that. Also how many 250TT pilots did UAL hire in the 1990s and how many total pilots did UAL hire during that time frame? How many pilots are on the UAL senioroty list, how many are white males, African Americans, Hispanic or women?

 

[Blue Dude]

We have been using PDC for well over 15 years at ORD. At 8 years ago the 727's all had the newer touch screen ACARS so that means the S/O was the person getting the clearance from the box and not a radio. So as they say on Mythbusters.....Busted!

Well, not to defend Guitar, because I don't know what he did or did not see. But he did say ORF to ORD, so it's quite possible that 8 yrs ago you couldn't pick up a PDC in ORF (not ORD). There's still a number of airports where that's still the case and you have to do it the old fashioned way. So, not busted.

 

[MRYFLYER]

Well, not to defend Guitar, because I don't know what he did or did not see. But he did say ORF to ORD, so it's quite possible that 8 yrs ago you couldn't pick up a PDC in ORF (not ORD). There's still a number of airports where that's still the case and you have to do it the old fashioned way. So, not busted.

I read his post as ORD ORF. In any event I highly doubt his J/S version. However, I do have a question for him. With such an event occuring prior to pushback would it not have been proper for him to remove himself from such a dangerous flight? Also, it sounds as if GT has since this experience set foot onboard a UAL flight. Appears he is taking his life in his hands by doing so according to his version of the facts.

We all have people with accents. I have heard "Comb-Air" just recently, various versions of english and some really Pi$$ Poor southern "Annnnglish" by a LCC pilot in the past couple of weeks.

Even with the controversial hiring that now has most of those employees with 15 years seniority, UAL has been fortunate to not have had a hull loss from a crew issue in many many years. Have there been near misses? Sure. But of the other carriers in our peer group we have excelled in saves versus hull loss. This is a stat that does not come easily when flying to diverse sections of the world with human factors playing a large role in long haul flying and the accident rates.

I hope GT does not have to endanger himself in the future with a seat of the pants flight on the good ol' U.

 

[Guitar rocker]

You seem to be an expert on UAL hiring, could you please tell us what the average age and experience was of a UAL new hire? Pick whatever year you have the data on that. Also how many 250TT pilots did UAL hire in the 1990s and how many total pilots did UAL hire during that time frame? How many pilots are on the UAL senioroty list, how many are white males, African Americans, Hispanic or women?

No, no expert on your hiring at all. It doesnt matter if someone was African American or a woman that got hired with little time...it's just the fact that it happened and your airline allowed it to happen. Dont question me about the 250TT....that was YOUR deal, not mine.

As for how to break down your seniority list......you have it, why dont you look and tell us? All I can tell you is that everytime I reluctantly have to airline on UAL, I see plenty of those that were "more qualified" running around the terminals at ORD/DEN and some of your other destinations as well.

 

[Guitar rocker]

I read his post as ORD ORF. In any event I highly doubt his J/S version. However, I do have a question for him. With such an event occuring prior to pushback would it not have been proper for him to remove himself from such a dangerous flight? Also, it sounds as if GT has since this experience set foot onboard a UAL flight. Appears he is taking his life in his hands by doing so according to his version of the facts.

We all have people with accents. I have heard "Comb-Air" just recently, various versions of english and some really Pi$$ Poor southern "Annnnglish" by a LCC pilot in the past couple of weeks.

Even with the controversial hiring that now has most of those employees with 15 years seniority, UAL has been fortunate to not have had a hull loss from a crew issue in many many years. Have there been near misses? Sure. But of the other carriers in our peer group we have excelled in saves versus hull loss. This is a stat that does not come easily when flying to diverse sections of the world with human factors playing a large role in long haul flying and the accident rates.

I hope GT does not have to endanger himself in the future with a seat of the pants flight on the good ol' U.

It's not that I feel unsafe at all. But from a professional standpoint, one does have to wonder when we all hear poor english over the PA and over your ATC channel....I think there are some occasions when it might be best that your ATC channel is turned off as in the above case.

Remember, I wouldnt consider it dangerous if someone doesnt know how to pick up an IFR clearance from ORF - ORD (just to clarify for those who cant read it correctly) but at that level, wouldnt yah think that this would be a no-brainer? I mean, maybe it isnt, I dont know how your GOM reads. I'm sure that he's a pro at it by now.

MrFLYER, I wish that I would have recorded that event just for you and I would have proudly posted it right here.

Like I said, I am not bagging on the majority of people at UAL.....just the minority (no pun intended) and what happened there at Martin Luther King BLVD (where yah all did your hiring) and where so many good people who paid their dues got turned down to make way for the VERY less qualified....

 

[FDJ2]

No, no expert on your hiring at all. It doesnt matter if someone was African American or a woman that got hired with little time...it's just the fact that it happened and your airline allowed it to happen. Dont question me about the 250TT....that was YOUR deal, not mine.

Sorry Guitar Rocker, but I don't work at UAL, I was just questioning your knowledge of UAL hiring, since you seem to be so opinionated on the subject. Apparently you know very little about hiring at UAL, but you do like to shoot from the hip and opine without any real information.

 

[Guitar rocker]

Sorry Guitar Rocker, but I don't work at UAL, I was just questioning your knowledge of UAL hiring, since you seem to be so opinionated on the subject. Apparently you know very little about hiring at UAL, but you do like to shoot from the hip and opine without any real information.

I simply know what the application called for. I know some folks who got hired at UAL with little time and likewise, know some others with plenty of time who got turned down.....as we probably all do. I would really like to know how an interviewer could justify their choice of candidate though....one with little time over so many with experience. If you cant see that, then you must be missing something up there.

 

[dgs]

Shall we change the title of this thread to "United hiring practices?" It doesn't have much to do with JetBlue at all.

 

[FDJ2]

I would really like to know how an interviewer could justify their choice of candidate though....one with little time over so many with experience. If you cant see that, then you must be missing something up there.

Character, personality, knowledge, presentation, among other things are all part of the interview process, not just numbers on a resume. Experience isn't the only determining factor on getting the job. It would be quite easy to justify giving an applicant with less experience the job if that applicant was a better fit for the company and performed better in the interview and met the minimum requirements for the job, particularly since once the applicant gets the job he/she still has to successfully complete the training program.

There are plenty of highly experienced pilots who belong nowhere near a jet and there are plenty of less experienced pilots who could not only pass a checkride, but would make excellent captains one day.

 

[Guitar rocker]

Character, personality, knowledge, presentation, among other things are all part of the interview process, not just numbers on a resume. Experience isn't the only determining factor on getting the job. It would be quite easy to justify giving an applicant with less experience the job if that applicant was a better fit for the company and performed better in the interview and met the minimum requirements for the job, particularly since once the applicant gets the job he/she still has to successfully complete the training program.

There are plenty of highly experienced pilots who belong nowhere near a jet and there are plenty of less experienced pilots who could not only pass a checkride, but would make excellent captains one day.

To an extent, I agree with what you said.

Remember all the "tell me about a time when..." questions that UAL had? Those types of questions were really aimed at a crew concept sort of answer and how you dealt with problems and with the input of others before making a decision. What was your worst emergency was a common question.....someone flying an RJ for example who had an emergency could talk about the complexity of the stuation and how he and the co-pilot dealt with the given circumstances. On the other hand, I cant help but wonder for someone who only had single engine recip time and just added a multi rating....how would they answer such a question? Perhaps a vacuum failure in VFR conditions or a rough running magneto maybe? Sure, it's all relative to the experience of an individual, but someone with little experience has a completely different answer than someone who is well seasoned and can share an experience that required another pilot and a flight attendant or two.

 

[Marko Ramius]

I don't think you do....

I simply know what the application called for.

A minor point really, but since you've seen to have appointed yourself as the know-it-all on this one, the app min was 350 hours not 250. Also, I believe that NW, AA, and TWA all either have or had some sort of internship program. You may now return to your regularly scheduled flightinfo merry go-round.

 

[Guitar rocker]

A minor point really, but since you've seen to have appointed yourself as the know-it-all on this one, the app min was 350 hours not 250. Also, I believe that NW, AA, and TWA all either have or had some sort of internship program. You may now return to your regularly scheduled flightinfo merry go-round.

Sorry to burst you bubble there, but it started out at 250TT and remained so until they decided to make it a bit more competetive and make it 350TT. If you had been around the block, you would have known that for some time.

You "believe" that the other airlines above had an internship? Believe? IS that all yah got? Where are your facts? Have or had? Which is it for you?

 

[MCDU]

Look on the UAL seniorty list and look at some of the pilots born in the late 60's and hired late 80's early 90's. We are talking- born 1968 and hired in 1990 Age 22-. I could start posting names. But I could start listing senioity Numbers so you can look them up.
They had to change min. time to 1500 because IRO's needed an ATP and many new hires back then did not meet that requirement.
This type of hiring was forced on United due to lack of diversity in our pilot group by the courts. Our hiring changed in the late 90's when Nancy Stuke left.

Peace
Marty

 

[MRYFLYER]

I

MrFLYER, I wish that I would have recorded that event just for you and I would have proudly posted it right here.

Like I said, I am not bagging on the majority of people at UAL.....just the minority (no pun intended) and what happened there at Martin Luther King BLVD (where yah all did your hiring) and where so many good people who paid their dues got turned down to make way for the VERY less qualified....

Here is the million dollar question GT. Did you interview at UAL? This whole thing is sounding a bit like sour grapes. We have all met pilots from another carrier that we have thought, "what were they thinking". In your case people may even be saying that about you at your present job. I suppose you fly along telling others in your crew about your first hand knowledge of all things UAL and how YOU should have been hired. Perhaps you failed the personality portion of the interview, knowledge or could not do public math.

You don't like the name of the street the training center is located on? Take that up with the City of Denver. While you are at it find a city that does not have an MLK blvd.

Get over your rejection. How about the other companies that turned you down? What were the problems with them? Could not have been you.

 

[Rekks Inbound]

While I don't agree with everything GT has said regarding UAL's hiring, he is right on a few accounts:

1-The app. mins were 250hrs TT with Comm/Inst/MEL. I know, 'cause I put in my original app. as soon as I made the mins. Didn't think I would get interviewed at the time, but I wanted a record of trying for when I was more competetive.

2-Updated every 6 months like clockwork. Again to show interest.

3-Fast-forward 10 years. Never hear a peep from UAL, still updating every 6 months, girlfriend at the time with half my time sends in 1 app, gets called 4 months later.(story ends well, I did marry her, and she did not get hired by UAL. She probably would still be furloughed right now).

4- in all this time, I NEVER even got a postcard saying 'thanks but no thanks'.

Overall, it just seems on the outside like something was just not right with UAL's hiring practices. But what do I know?

Peace.

Rekks

 

[Bosley]

Who the hell is Bosley?

I'm your worst nightmare punk! But I can see in regular fashion you got yourself banned again! Glad to see the mods are doing their work!
Thanks mods, this POS needed to go!

 

[dojetdriver]

Character, personality, knowledge, presentation, among other things are all part of the interview process, not just numbers on a resume. Experience isn't the only determining factor on getting the job. It would be quite easy to justify giving an applicant with less experience the job if that applicant was a better fit for the company and performed better in the interview and met the minimum requirements for the job, particularly since once the applicant gets the job he/she still has to successfully complete the training program.

There are plenty of highly experienced pilots who belong nowhere near a jet and there are plenty of less experienced pilots who could not only pass a checkride, but would make excellent captains one day.

By that ratioinale, how did United decide who they would call? They (Mrs. Stuke) claimed to have the most un-biased method for selecting who to interview. Fill out the scantron, fill out the app, mail it in. The only thing on the scantron is SSN and and flight times, everything else is on the the app, race, sex, ect. The scantron goes one way, the app goes another, at least according to them. The app is never even looked at until the computer spits out the SSN of the person's scantron it has selected, supposedly.

When deciding who to select for interview, go to the computer with the scantron info for the most "qualified" people to call. If UAL (and Mrs. Stuke) wanted to make a claim that they interviewed/hired only people with the best experience, there is no way in hell that ALOT of people would have even ever been called just to interview.

No where on the scantron did it have a bubble to fill out for character, knowledge, presentation, attitude, ect. And since the scantron was how they picked candidates, how did somebody with alot less experience get called while people with thousands of hours PIC, multiple type ratings, check airman expericence, never heard the phone ring?

With over 10,000 apps on file, I seriously doubt that they would have had to start lowering their competitve hours requirement just to find somebody with the right attitude.

Now I agree, attitude and personality go along way in the cockpit. I just don't believe they picked canidates solely on experience level.

 

[FDJ2]

No where on the scantron did it have a bubble to fill out for character, knowledge, presentation, attitude, ect.

We were discussing the interview, not the scantron.