Delta TA on SCOPE

[SIG600]

Rather than restore, this is working from the "new standard" (low bar).

Not even close to what your predecessors negotiated 12 years ago.

 

[Hamfighter]

There is who reason to allow DCI more large planes. I understand that it is a net reduction, but you are still giving away MORE LARGE PLANES.
And, what are we doing with all the money we are "saving" by giving away our flying? We're sure not paying mainline.

 

[Hamfighter]

How about we allow unlimited 76-seat planes...flown by DELTA pilots. Not enough DELTA pilots to fly hundreds of LARGE RJs? Perhaps we could hire hundreds of DCI pilots.

For once, quit diluting and DISOLVING Delta Air Lines.



(I'm going to, stick this in its own thread.)

 

[n757st]

You realize if you buy us ( JetBlue), you get 190ish mainline jets added and now gain a bunch of Rjs in the process... Oh, and no new pilots.

 

[PCL_128]

Don't you have a mainline pay rate for 76 seaters? Why set a rate if you give away the flying? Why can't the replacement aircraft flying be done by mainline pilots?

Because it's not economically feasible. Doing so would place Delta at an extreme competitive disadvantage against the other carriers who can outsource that flying at a much lower cost. Remember, it's not just the pilots. Even if the pilots agreed to do it at regional rates, they still have the FAs, rampers, mechanics, customer service agents, etc. Paying mainline benefits, wages, and work rules to all of those people to handle the 76-seat operation while all of their competitors are outsourcing that same flying for a much lower cost is not a recipe for profitability.

 

[Diesel-9]

More concessions to a concessionary contract. Many of the things missing in this contract were still in the NWA contract AFTER CH-11 and the wizards in Hooterville elected not to take them. "Everything we do and have is better!" Yea, about 25% worth. Another decade lost just trying to get back what we had in the early 90's. The "Moak" mentality, O'Malley and all the "Old Delta Kool-Aide Klub" need to go fast. They're killing us with their loyalty, to Management! DPA is NOW an option!!!!! Competition is good...

 

[BID]

Can you just picture all those 90 seat jets flying around! (configured to 76 seats) wow!

It's no wonder our CEO at United likes this TA.

 

[amcnd]

FYI Currently you have outsourced:

348 50 Seaters
102 65-69 Seaters
153 76 Seaters
Total: 603 Aircraft / 35862 seats

Proposed outsourcing:
125 "70 seaters" (using 67 as an average again = 8750 seats)
223 76 seaters (16948 seats)
Total: 348 Aircraft / 25698 seats

Total seats go down by about 28%. But, when was the last time you saw a 50 seater running DTW-IAH, SLC-LAX, LGA-ORD, JFK-ORD, or MSP-YVR?

I think if you looked at the average miles flown by the 900/175 you'd see that the seat mile reduction is probably much less than 28%.

Your numbers don't have any 50 seaters??? Im sure some will stay around.. Routes like MSP-RST, SLC-SGU. Ect.. Pluss all the "pro-rate" markets... The way i look at it.. There will be more "pro-rate" crj200 flying. And atleast 50-100 will stay around for awhile...

 

[Crash Pad]

Because it's not economically feasible. Doing so would place Delta at an extreme competitive disadvantage against the other carriers who can outsource that flying at a much lower cost. Remember, it's not just the pilots. Even if the pilots agreed to do it at regional rates, they still have the FAs, rampers, mechanics, customer service agents, etc. Paying mainline benefits, wages, and work rules to all of those people to handle the 76-seat operation while all of their competitors are outsourcing that same flying for a much lower cost is not a recipe for profitability.

This dip$$/t sold scope for nothing. Riddle me this smart guy. How does SWA compete with no RJs? Thank god they bought us or we would be selling the 717 to Pinnacle so we could compete.

Your argument is that it is cheaper to put 76 seats in a 90 seater, then pay someone at a profit to fly them.

Which makes more sense than putting 90 seats in a 90 seater and flying it yourself. Maybe Delta is buying leverage on the cheap.

 

[AirMike]

It all sounds good until the next cyclical downturn. Cue Delta bankruptcy and the limit on 76 seaters goes away. Then the majority of Delta's mainline narrowbodys get parked in the desert and the bottom of the seniority list goes to fly at DCI as a first year FO.

Naw, that could never happen..... (cough, UAL, cough). That scope section is a non-starter. If Delta votes yes on that, they will be the catalyst for the destruction of mainline domestic flying.