DALPA Rep Says no go to merger....

[jetflier]

" It ain't over till the fat lady sings "

The DAL/NWA merger will happen if the executives want it to happen.

If the pilot groups do not have a deal at that time, then there would be prolonged negotiations.

I do not believe that the investment bankers or executives would allow the pilot employee group to dictate how the airline is run.

I do not believe that the executives and investment bankers will cancel the merger because of the pilots inability to reach a deal.

 

[Fly4hire]

NWALPA brought a one trick poney to the SLI negotiations and then scratched their heads and wondered why the results weren't different this time.

DALPA opened with a fair integration methodolgy for all, with the intention of avoiding the quibbling and posturing that predictably leads to arbitration. The one trick pony committee did what they have consistently done for 2 decades. They postured for the best deal imagineable. The end result was predictable but regrettable. At least we tried.

Funny, what we are hearing is almost diametrically opposed to what you are hearing. (and I don't think anyone here really has the straight skinny)

It is rumored that the DALPA SLI proposal was a single take it or leave it offer from which they never moved (which is not a negotiation).

The contractual portion was nice, yet the most accommodating MEC in recent NWA history saw to unanimously reject your SLI. Hmmmm.

Doesn't add up.

 

[spinproof]

A pox on both your houses. .......

 

[~~~^~~~]

It is rumored that the DALPA SLI proposal was a single take it or leave it offer from which they never moved (which is not a negotiation).

Doesn't add up.

Yes, it does add up because this was business, not section 6 negotiations.

FDJ2 explains it well:

DALPA created the opportunity and created the the prerequisite that for any merger to succeed pilots must play a role from the inception and our issues must be dealt with up front.

It takes a different approach, unfortunately not everyone involved in the process got it. NWALPA brought a one trick poney to the SLI negotiations and then scratched their heads and wondered why the results weren't different this time.​

Again, this was an offer. Your Representatives communicated a refusal of that offer. Offers are considered withdrawn if not accepted.

If the offeree rejects the offer, the offer has been destroyed and cannot be accepted at a future time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Offer_and_acceptance

Mr. Anderson has said repeatedly that Delta will not enter a deal which does not protect the seniority of Delta's employees.

An offer was made and while there might have been some tiny amount of wiggle room, you were to recieve something for something. A better contract and a fair seniority list integration at a better company for your agreement to transition peacefully and productively.

On several levels the response to the offer was more than a simple refusal, it was an attack against the basic principle of what the agreement sought to achieve - labor peace resulting in greater productivity than has been the case in earlier mergers.

Delta's culture is intolerant of bad attitudes. Maybe it was a cultural thing? For whatever reason, they walked. My bleacher seat evaluation is simply a best guess with all the known facts.

 

[EdTeachLives!]

Could not have been explained better.

Ed

 

[Redmeat]

Mr. Anderson has said repeatedly that Delta will not enter a deal which does not protect the seniority of Delta's employees.

.

And Mr. Bush says repeatedly that there is no recession.

It's called rhetoric. A very common phenomenon among high ranking officials in business or government.

 

[Occam's Razor]

The word out of the most recently held LEC meeting has this deal as officially coded and pronouced dead.

I read on this very forum that your leadership was reasonable and accurate.

Scratch "accurate".

Up next - "reasonable"

 

[Diesel-9]

Lots of Kool-Aide on the table and they are drinking it.

 

[FDJ2]

It is rumored that the DALPA SLI proposal was a single take it or leave it offer from which they never moved (which is not a negotiation).

It wasn't an opening proposal in the traditional sense. I've characterized our as an opener at the 48 yard line that moved to the 50. Not much wiggle room and that was intentional. No time to quibble.

The NWA merger committee had a different approach, one geared towards posturing for arbitration. Was any one really surprised by that.

I've consistently stated that there was very little wiggle room in our position, others here on FI have retorted well you move some and then we'll move some, that's how we get it done.

Wrong. That posturing approach from the beginning, in order to get the best deal we can get, led to the ultimate outcome.

We all have a rare opportunity and it has potentially been squandered.

So we each go our own way, at least for the time being.

 

[FDJ2]

Nevermind. It's been said before, no need to beat a dead horse.l

 

[Fly4hire]

Yes, it does add up because this was business, not section 6 negotiations.

FDJ2 explains it well:

Again, this was an offer. Your Representatives communicated a refusal of that offer. Offers are considered withdrawn if not accepted.

Mr. Anderson has said repeatedly that Delta will not enter a deal which does not protect the seniority of Delta's employees.

An offer was made and while there might have been some tiny amount of wiggle room, you were to receive something for something. A better contract and a fair seniority list integration at a better company for your agreement to transition peacefully and productively.

On several levels the response to the offer was more than a simple refusal, it was an attack against the basic principle of what the agreement sought to achieve - labor peace resulting in greater productivity than has been the case in earlier mergers.
​

Your arrogance is appalling, exceeded only by your ignorance - and this from a NH who was one of the numb-nuts involved in the RJDC.

I think someone said that this combination has (had) the potential to be a world beating competitor.

Amazing that it will go down the drain due to the hubris and narcissism of the DAL MEC.....​

 

[Gunfighter]

... At least we tried.

And perhaps that is all the merger talks were supposed to accomplish. Placate the investors so we can get back to running the company.

When asked if Delta had a "Plan B" ready if the Northwest deal fails, Bastian said, "It's not a Plan B, it's a Plan A -- that's our standalone option."
​

Perhaps this is management's desired outcome. Delta didn't want a merger with US Air and the entire company, including the pilots rallied behind the effort to "Keep Delta My Delta". Once again the pilots have helped keep Delta a stand alone airline. Hopefully this is the best resolution for all involved.

 

[brainhurts]

Here's just a guess: Both sides in their neutral corners reflecting. A new round will pop up egged on by management. Both sides have showed their starting proposals. Its just good negotating. They will be back. There is too much money on the table. Both sides will agree that the junior guys need to be skrewed more equally. Then a deal can be done.

 

[Fly4hire]

Both sides will agree that the junior guys need to be skrewed more equally. Then a deal can be done.

Most likely scenario......

 

[Occam's Razor]

Here's just a guess: Both sides in their neutral corners reflecting. A new round will pop up egged on by management. Both sides have showed their starting proposals. Its just good negotating. They will be back. There is too much money on the table. Both sides will agree that the junior guys need to be skrewed more equally. Then a deal can be done.

Correct.
Correct.
Correct.
Not really.
Correct.
Correct.
In principle...correct.
Correct.

 

[Heavy Set]

My feeling is that the NWA pilot group has skrewed the pooch for themselves going forward. Not only will the Delta group not be interested in a deal, but no other airline pilot group (i.e., CAL) will be interested in talking to them. You set a bad precedent with overly aggressive demands - that reputation follows you. There aren't many good merger partners out there - only a select few unless you want to consider dancing with United.

That's too bad because with oil prices climbing, a strong combination between airlines might be the only ticket to survival... The economic situation could get much worse. Time will tell.

 

[FDJ2]

Your arrogance is appalling, exceeded only by your ignorance - and this from a NH who was one of the numb-nuts involved in the RJDC.

Personal insults normally are attributable to a lack of an argument.

Don't worry, everything will be o.k.

Feel better now?

 

[FDJ2]

And perhaps that is all the merger talks were supposed to accomplish. Placate the investors so we can get back to running the company.

That's quite possible.

Maybe the thought was if they could pull it off seamlessly they were ready to go for it. If the hang up was the pilots inability to play nice, then there is a scape goat to placate the investors.

We'll see how this all plays out.

 

[FDJ2]

Both sides have showed their starting proposals.

The basis of the miscalculation is unearthed. It's not a starting position. Think of it as an option to be explored. If you prefer your stand alone option go for it. No hard feelings.

If you think that was an opening wish list from where we can begin to negotiate towards the middle from your wish list, you are sadly mistaken.

 

[Fly4hire]

Personal insults normally are attributable to a lack of an argument.

Arguing a counterpoint here is like discussing alternative faiths with Islamic fundamentalists. Good thing it will be decided by more reasoned voices on either side...