Dal ae

[ACL65PILOT]

Agreed, Hockey. The simple fact that they are having a hard time running a summer sked is great. That means that furloughs just would not make a bid of sense. Now that could change, but for now they see growth.

 

[av8tor76]

i kinda agree with twobits..we won't hire till senior guys start fading ..no furloughs.

 

[twobits]

ACL65PILOT, I admire your optimism. BTW, the JAL deal is bad for Delta pilots. This would allow them to fly all routes out of Tokyo with JAL - not DAL pilots. Therefore, all Far east flights will be JAL, except ATL-NRT and DTW-HKG IMHO.

 

[ACL65PILOT]

ACL65PILOT, I admire your optimism. BTW, the JAL deal is bad for Delta pilots. This would allow them to fly all routes out of Tokyo with JAL - not DAL pilots. Therefore, all Far east flights will be JAL, except ATL-NRT and DTW-HKG IMHO.

I will state that you are wrong on both accounts. Unless our union gives away our NRT slots they are contractual. I do not see our union doing that. We will get most of the NRT America, and South America routes, AF-KLM will do most but not all of Europe, and we will both do some of the North South like we do now.

I know it is hard to see but a deal with JAL and a JAL that is shrinking their international footprint, is one that we WANT a deal with. I know why? Well, we get their premium international traffic on our coded flights. That is worth billions in revenue for DAL in the AF deal and will be worth billions in the JAL deal. I get that we need to convert that for you and I the pilots in to green in our wallets. Simply put, a deal like this is good for our cash flow and revenue stream as a company, and therefore good for us. Long term here. In effect slower growth that is sustainable versus rapid short term grown is what we will see. I know you want quick growth but if we are going to do that and not take JAL in to the alliance, then guess what it will not last and we will hire then furlough. Simple truths.

As for hiring, wrong again. I will use the submissive, and probably because nothing is ever set in stone, but there are jets coming that are not staffed and we do not have the staffing for. They will require new hires to staff. Add the jets in the desert that will be brought back starting late this year, and we will need bodies from here on out. Three months from now this will be a lot clearer to everyone.

 

[twobits]

Maybe you are right, who knows. One thing is for sure, pilot's don't know! Management does, and they have a plan they are not sharing with us (for good reason - don't want to show their hand). How many mergers have we seen in the last 50 years.... don't answer that, it's impossible. How many mergers have happened in the last 50 years where any hiring happened in the successive 3 years? I don't know the answer, but it probably gives a good indication as to what we can expect at Delta. Just because the company is making more money, does not mean they are going to hand it out to it's employees willingly, that is what the contract is for. However, right you are that it is easier to get a better contract when DL is making money.

New airplanes are coming, and old airplanes are leaving. What does that net? I don't know that either.... the -9's will be gone sooner than later. The new airplanes are Big RJ's, flown by TBD - but DAL MEC better be ready for whipsaw between DAL and Regionals. The aircraft in the desert have new paint jobs on them, but that doesn't mean they are coming out anytime soon..... 767's and 757's are getting very old and tired, but are still good aircraft.

Routes that Delta and JAL fly that overlap can be eliminated by codesharing. For example, pull out your two route maps. NRT to these cities will be codeshare cities with JAL - HKG, SIN, BKK, SGN, MNL, TPE, SFO, JFK, CHI, PVG, PEK. The Korean flights to Narita will be codeshare with KE. DTW, ATL, SLC and LAX will likely stay Delta. HNL and GUM will be up for grabs between the two; probably still going to JAL. Say it ain't so? well, it might be. How much confidence do you have in your contract to save these jobs and routes? What about in the negotiating leverage DAL MEC has? Right now, the company is stragegically placing itself where it wants, and is the time for the MEC to step up and ensure DAL jobs are not lost (i.e. furlough).

 

[Ridgeback]

Reading these post there are always refrences to BIG RJ's being flown by TBD, get ready for the whipsaw. I thought the line had been drawn, no more 76 seat jets at Mesaba, COmpass, ect. Also didn't a crj900/190 and 195 pay scale just get put inplace at DELTA. It would seem to me that mgt has nothing to offer that would convince mailine guys to let those 76-100 seat jets go anywhere other than DELTA??

 

[twobits]

valid point Ridgeback. Hopefully, there will be no snafu's getting these aircraft on property when the time nears (as the -9's exit the fleet)! Work needs to be done on this payscale, as previously mentioned; but those are still jobs that will keep people working in tougher times - not today, because Delta management has been more optimistic than ever lately; and rightly so.

 

[ACL65PILOT]

Look at the Western Merger. DAL hired. Pan Am they furloughed.

This is just based on what I am seeing, and I will give you that what I am seeing is a lot different that many.

As for the 100 seat jet. It will be at mainline. If not the wrong ppl are doing the work.

There are airplanes and they are calling them growth jets.

Just give it a few months.

 

[twobits]

ACL65PILOT,

Ron Allen is gone. NWA management is here. Remember what they did to the NWA mechanics? I understand that when you drink too much Kool-aid, sometimes you get a sugar high and get excited. If you are telling your buddies at regional's that there will be a job at Delta for them, then I'd probably start setting their expectations lower. Chances are, AA will hire before Delta (assuming only 75% of AA/TWA furloughees take their jobs back). History shows there is always a cycle, and that cycle is wierd. Delta hires a lot of guys, and then furloughs a bunch. look at it yourself. It is probably going to be a few years before any hiring, just lay that line down and if it's sooner, then great!

to be clear: THERE IS NO SHORTAGE OF AIRLINE PILOTS. Do not create an artificial void. Supply/demand - management understands this in all aspects of their business, and right now they know there will not be a supply problem on the pilot side for a long time = bad for us. Don't make the chasm any bigger.

"No man, XXXXX isn't going to hire for 5 years, maybe longer"

is a good way to start negotiating your next contract!

 

[ACL65PILOT]

This is not Kool-Aid. Just stating what I am seeing. You points are good, just not where the ones that have their hands on the wheels see things going.

Trust me I can be a glass half full type of guy, but it generally does not good.