Continental loses captain over colleague's alcohol allegation

[bizicmo]

The pilot didn't show up to work "drunk".

If you show up to work and you fail a breath alcohol test. What does that make you if your not drunk?

 

[bizicmo]

I'm sure it doesn't make you sober.

 

[PurpleInMEM]

I agree with your course of action, however i think its sad that you are busting on the whistleblower. What ever happened to personal responsibility and not going to work drunk. If you risk others lives by being drunk on the job, you desreve to lose your job.

Me thinks you takes this JOB and yourself a bit too seriously.

I was waiting for a sanctimonious comment from the peanut gallery and it sure didn't take too long.

The rat that dropped the dime deserves a bullet or at a minimum, a lifetime of harassment.

I am NOT my brother's keeper.

Welcome to the Nanny State, it will only get worse.

 

[jws717]

Me thinks you takes this JOB and yourself a bit too seriously.

I was waiting for a sanctimonious comment from the peanut gallery and it sure didn't take too long.

The rat that dropped the dime deserves a bullet or at a minimum, a lifetime of harassment.

I am NOT my brother's keeper.

Welcome to the Nanny State, it will only get worse.

You may not think you are your brothers keeper, but when the feds bust the guy next to you for drinking, you'r also busted. Drinking and flying is just stupid and you are if you think its acceptable. I have no pitty for the guy who got busted, its his fault. too bad! As a side note the proper response when someone smells like alcohol is to question them first and strongly suggest that they call in sick. I am sure that this is what happend but, the capt pobably had an attitude like yours and told the other guy to F off.

 

[JP4user]

I would rather be an idiot than a spineless ninny that has to run to mommy (management) rather than confront this individual like a man. do you also call your buddy in the chief pilots office if somebody does not show at exactly the correct time?
I made no comment about this pilot showing up drunk, I assumed most people would not need a comment about how wrong that is. So I aplogize to you that I did not realize not every one gets it. So for the less than swift out there lets clairfy this SHOWING UP DRUNK IS WRONG AND SHOULD NEVER BE TOLERATED. That being said my post was about how it was handled, and how it should have been handled. Shouldnt this guy be given the opportunity to get help? The guy that called management, this kind of "man" is the exact sort of person the SCAB management at CAL wants. They want pilots who will not stand up to anyone (especially at contract time).

Whatever. Not sure what you are trying to accomplish about you scab mantra and some idiot that ruins his career. Perhaps if you didn't post while drinking your message may come across better.

Who knows what type of employee reported it. In my opinion it doesn't matter. You drink, you lose your job.

 

[big_al]

so is this another example of the pro-union brotherhood I keep hearing about?

 

[OrionFE]

Complex inflight emergency? You mean like stalling C5's for no reason at all, like the military does with 8 sober flight crewmembers.

You're new to this aviation thing, are'nt you? You might want to back up a bit from all those paints you're using to paint your pretty little pictures. Hey, you remember the NWA crash in Detroit years ago......probably not!

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Me thinks you takes this JOB and yourself a bit too seriously.

I was waiting for a sanctimonious comment from the peanut gallery and it sure didn't take too long.

The rat that dropped the dime deserves a bullet or at a minimum, a lifetime of harassment.

I am NOT my brother's keeper.

Welcome to the Nanny State, it will only get worse.

I'd think a MIL guy and an Air Line guy would understand brother's keeper better than anyone. Worst than the liberals are the Law of the Jungle types that are ready to pound their chest and scoff at thier "brothers" for not having the strength to keep up. Problem is there is always someone better, faster and stronger....do you really want to compete with that guy? Cause he will scoff at you when you can't keep up.

Real men and women are holistic

The real issue isn't a pilot showing up to fly drunk. With 100,000 Air Line Pilots in the US, there will always be pecentages of pilots who are alcoholics, diabetic, cancerous, bi-polar, etc.

The issue is how professional Air Line Pilots respond to our brothers and sisters indescretions. We all make mistakes, what we do afterwards defines who we are. But just as important is how we treat our fellow pilots when they make mistakes. Treating your fellow pilot with repsect, empathy and assistance doesn't condone thier faults. Rather it is the progessive win/win path.

 

[bizicmo]

I think the issue IS pilot's showing up drunk. If they didn't show up drunk and put their fellow employees in crappy positions this wouldn't be an issue.

 

[Alamanach]

I would rather be an idiot than a spineless ninny that has to run to mommy (management) rather than confront this individual like a man...

For all we know, that confrontation may have already taken place. I think we would all hope that it did; it'd be a shame to see a guy lose his job, possibly ruin his career, over a one-time lapse in judgement. Some judicious forgiveness keeps the world going round.

But at the same time, if the pilot in question really is a hopeless screw-up (and this is possible too), then any one of us probably would have blown the whistle on him. There are some people who shouldn't be flying airliners.

We don't have enough information to say whether this colleague did the right thing; it could go either way. Some of you guys on this thread are really tearing into each other, and I don't know why.

 

[FR8mastr]

For all we know, that confrontation may have already taken place. I think we would all hope that it did; it'd be a shame to see a guy lose his job, possibly ruin his career, over a one-time lapse in judgement. Some judicious forgiveness keeps the world going round.

But at the same time, if the pilot in question really is a hopeless screw-up (and this is possible too), then any one of us probably would have blown the whistle on him. There are some people who shouldn't be flying airliners.

We don't have enough information to say whether this colleague did the right thing; it could go either way. Some of you guys on this thread are really tearing into each other, and I don't know why.

I agree if that confrontation did take place, then to heck with him.

 

[FN FAL]

If you show up to work and you fail a breath alcohol test. What does that make you if your not drunk?

"Your" drunk.

Read the regulation that was violated and tell me whether or not the word drunk is in the regulation.

 

[FN FAL]

You're new to this aviation thing, are'nt you? You might want to back up a bit from all those paints you're using to paint your pretty little pictures. Hey, you remember the NWA crash in Detroit years ago......probably not!

I was digging airplanes out of the ocean when you were still pooping yellow...and it is aren't.

 

[OrionFE]

I was digging airplanes out of the ocean when you were still pooping yellow...and it is aren't.

Right on! Sounds like fun.

 

[bizicmo]

"Your" drunk.

Read the regulation that was violated and tell me whether or not the word drunk is in the regulation.

From the story you posted it reads, "A breath alcohol test was administered and the pilot, tested positive above the legal limit for pilots."

By testing above the legal limit that legally makes him drunk.

Drunk has many definitions one being, "Excessive or habitual indulgence in alcoholic liquor." Dictionary.com

If one test above the legal limits that could be labeled, excessive indulgence in alcoholic liquor.

 

[siucavflight]

Nice job by the FO or whomever. I guess trying to get the guy to call in sick and following up with pro standards would have been too much work.

I guess that not drinking before your flight and not showing up to work above the legal limit would have been too much to ask from the guy. I dont feel bad for him one bit.









i

 

[kingsize]

Wow, you guys jump to conclusions fast. Obviously, it's a very emotional topic. We've all made mistakes, and all of us have known people who are quick to tattle, and others who would stand by their "colleagues" or "friends" no matter what.

I have learned the hard way---a couple of times. I am that good guy, and have taken some serious hits by taking blame for others, or covering up for them. Some of those people could not care less about what I did, and are thankful only for themselves, that they got off the hook.

I ask you to consider a question I have been asking of myself more and more since being involved in situations such as this:
What kind of person would put *ME* into such an awkward, career-threatening, credibility-threatening situation?

I don't put others in such positions. I take responsibility for my actions, and would never put someone else's career on the line by trying to cover my own ass. So why should I take that risk for someone else that completely disregards the possible ramifications to me? He better have a VERY good reason for it, or do exactly what I tell him to do to save his career, or be my mom. Most likely he is not my mom, and does not have a good reason for putting my career at risk. That leaves only one option: him doing EXACTLY what I say. If I tell him to go home, he better go home, and not fight me on it, or come up with some other scheme to save his butt.

It’s the Golden Rule. It goes both ways, and this has to be weighed in choosing what you do. This stuff is gut-wrenching to me, when I get put into messed up situations (by other people mind you, not of my own errant behavior) like this.

So let’s find out some more info before jumping all over the “colleague” who told.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Kingsize-

Take it a step further. When you suspect your fellow pilot of doing something dangerous (say drinking) to himself, the pilot group or the profession, you pull him aside and say. I strongly suggests you call in sick. Other wise I take the step of safety. The choice is yours. Then in three days I'll contact the HIMS Chairman and follow up that you've already contacted him. If you haven't contact him I'll call the chief pilot. Again the choice is yours.

A little dramtic and cheesy, but you give the guy plenty of time to make his own choices, while at the same time you aren't covering up is poor behavior.

A once and in a career event....

 

[FN FAL]

From the story you posted it reads, "A breath alcohol test was administered and the pilot, tested positive above the legal limit for pilots."

By testing above the legal limit that legally makes him drunk.

Drunk has many definitions one being, "Excessive or habitual indulgence in alcoholic liquor." Dictionary.com

If one test above the legal limits that could be labeled, excessive indulgence in alcoholic liquor.

Nope, nope and nope. You couldn't find the word "drunk" in any regulation regarding this incident, could you?

 

[ACT700]

With the current state of the industry, the Feds need to consider raising the limit, anyway!!!