Compass to Seperate from DAL MEC

[koepp]

LOA 2006-10 might have been negotiated in 2006, but we had not seen anything in writing until July of 2007. Yes we were given a brief update on contract negotiations up to July of 2007 but we did not see details until it was signed and printed. As for your comment about the flow, Compass was not created based on flow it was created base on providing jobs to the NWA furloughed pilots.

I too started at Compass prior to the CPZ ALPA contract signing. Before making the decision to leave my job as a Captain at Trans States, I read up on the flow. NWA LOAs 2006-10 and 14 are in the NWA ALPA contract, not the Compass contract, and were available to read since late 2006. The section about the flow up/dn in our contract is based on those LOAs. You're right that Compass was created to provide jobs to current and future furloughed NWA pilots which is what I meant by "flow".

 

[Full of LUV]

So that's your aspirations.....

Whats the difference between RAH, Mesa and Colgan etc....that fly for more than one airline.

So that's your goal? To be like RAH, Mesa, or Colgan......

God help us, I was hoping that GEN X or GEN Y would see how they are being played, but apparently I've got to re-establish my expectations for the pilot profession.

IFLYIMC: What is your personal career goal as a pilot? (besides being IMC)

 

[atpcliff]

Hi!

THis seems shortsighted to me. It seems the opposite of scope...it seems that DAL wants Compass separate, and then they lose jobs to a separate entity and DAL mgmt gets to play DAL pilots off against another lower-paying company that is flying DAL pax.

To me, the next logical step would be to spin off the DC-9/MD-80/MD-90 guys into a separate MEC and separate airline also.

Why is this a good idea for DAL/Compass pilots? It seems like it is worse for both.

cliff
NBO

 

[andyd]

It is a bad idea for both. I does make sense on the representational side of the issue., the same mec representing mainline and regional who have competing interests. However, I think that this opens the door and paves the way for CPS to get spun off. You are correct that the DAL pilot contract provides for the flow, however should cps be spun off that could easily be amended by LOA...especially given the track record on scope that the current MEC has under Moak. This first step makes the other steps easier and more likely. If you are not in favor of the flow and are at Cps currently then you have the option of "opting" out and choosing the Cps career path, keeping your seniority/seat and your job in the event of a flow down. I believe that this option is available to 10% of the Cps list, what's wrong with letting the other 90% flow up when thier time comes? NOTHING.

 

[samballs]

Don't even use DAL pilots, scope, and common sense in the same sentence

 

[samballs]

It is a bad idea for both. I does make sense on the representational side of the issue., the same mec representing mainline and regional who have competing interests. However, I think that this opens the door and paves the way for CPS to get spun off. You are correct that the DAL pilot contract provides for the flow, however should cps be spun off that could easily be amended by LOA...especially given the track record on scope that the current MEC has under Moak. This first step makes the other steps easier and more likely. If you are not in favor of the flow and are at Cps currently then you have the option of "opting" out and choosing the Cps career path, keeping your seniority/seat and your job in the event of a flow down. I believe that this option is available to 10% of the Cps list, what's wrong with letting the other 90% flow up when thier time comes? NOTHING.

You must not talk to DL pilots much. they will tell you that you don't become a DL pilot, you're born a DL pilot, this after the 10 minute speech about how they just had the hardest final of all time even though its 10 miles, clear, and no wind, the real reaon though is they were turned for final inside of 80 miles

 

[GogglesPisano]

How about an in-house union that represents the interests of 12,000 Delta pilots without the conflict of interest associated with representing mainline and regional pilots.

 

[Ridgeback]

This is yet another step into merging Compass with Mesaba...those who have been following the small details see how these are all adding up. Before you respond with a "no Way" please do some research and your homework...Soon the Compass pilots will be represented by the Mesaba Mec! First under the cover as a trasitional MEC, then...

 

[andyd]

This is yet another step into merging Compass with Mesaba...those who have been following the small details see how these are all adding up. Before you respond with a "no Way" please do some research and your homework...Soon the Compass pilots will be represented by the Mesaba Mec! First under the cover as a trasitional MEC, then...

That is probably the most realistic scenario likely and if so would screw the CPS guys that went to CPS in the first place with the sole intention to flow up to DAL. Now under even the most generous SLI with Mesaba would have several hundred more guys in the flow waiting for the DAL seat above them...and the flow that Mesaba has pales in comparison to the one that CPS currently has. For the current CPS Captain that would have flowed up in the next 18-24 months (realistically)...it would be well over a 10 year wait if that were to happen.

 

[NEWSOUTH]

LOA 2006-10 might have been negotiated in 2006, but we had not seen anything in writing until July of 2007. Yes we were given a brief update on contract negotiations up to July of 2007 but we did not see details until it was signed and printed. As for your comment about the flow, Compass was not created based on flow it was created base on providing jobs to the NWA furloughed pilots.

I thought CPS was formed to provide a C scale to mainline pilots. You don't furlough and then create an airline to put said forloughed pilots. You transfer your mainline pilots to a lower wage company via pink slip. Anyway, I know you "think your flying shoul be mainline too". But, what a mistake to lose the flow. What do you have besides that? Ego? Regional career? If this thing goes the way of Mesaba, then that will be a long ten years at a regional (almost Mainline Regional). Delta has you all's number and they are dialing it collect.

 

[PCL_128]

Keep in mind that this isn't final until the governing bodies at the national level approve it. It's entirely possible that the Executive Council will look at the split vote and decide that this isn't a good idea.

Where does the CPZ coordinator stand on this issue?

 

[flap operator]

How do you figure the flow at XJ "pales" in comparison to the flow at CP? I'd much rather have protections for a flowback when times are bad and have them metered. If it means only haveing a trickle up (9) then so be it. The flow rate that CP currently has of 25 or whatever is non sustainable and would be completely devastating if there were to be a flowback.

Fine... give up your flow. More slots for the XJ guys when things start turning around. I hope that attitude is a minority attitude! Ask the 12 XJ guys that got to flow how they like it? If it isn't hurting you, why get rid of it?

As for a merger between Compass and Mesaba... well... that would be rather entertaining.

Having your own MEC will finally allow you proper representation. Yea, 'cause the NW/DL pilots were really looking out for your best interests... especially giving you a non voting "representative" position. Now you'll have your own MEC and finally be just like the rest of the DCI grunts. And having the attitude that you couldn't represent yourselves because there is nobody good enough is defeatest and really sad. Take care of your own problems like the rest of us! There's got to be at least 10 guys there willing to stand up for your group right?

 

[callowayhd]

so who is gonna guess on how the lists will be intergrated when it comes time to deal with that, will we have former 175 captains as sabb captains, or 175 fos as 340 fos? 9 fos who will be 175 captains?

 

[G2T]

so who is gonna guess on how the lists will be intergrated when it comes time to deal with that, will we have former 175 captains as sabb captains, or 175 fos as 340 fos? 9 fos who will be 175 captains?

That seems to be getting a little ahead of things, doesn't it?

 

[callowayhd]

not if "its a done deal" according to someones brothers sisters cousins uncle's step son who blew a former LCA at compass while in highschool said so!

 

[rumrunner300]

Double edged sword

Ending the flow would, in the long run, be detrimental to the interests of the CPZ guys if, and only if, recall rights attach even if you get a job elsewhere and would still be eligible for return to your previous status. In the short term, I am of the opinion that eventually DAL will have to furlough some bodies and 350 bodies is a relatively small number, but enough to displace EVERY pilot at Compass.

Retirements will resume before the economy, and more importantly, the consumer regain the confidence to return the industry to good times. The question is whether DAL can eat the costs of carrying extra people until late 2013.

Let's not forget the possibility that this industry, and tangentially, this JOB (you will notice I will never use the word career in connection with piloting ever again) simply will never be the same. The public has determined that air travel is no different than any other utility and should always be affordable.

The public will always tell you that you should be well paid, but backpedal like a mutherfocker when you add the caveat that it would double airfares.

REALITY CHECK:::!!!!! Those so inclined, please insert head in sand at this time.

Flying is the best job in the world in my opinion. If you want to undertake the challenge for the love of it, do so. Just be damn sure you have suitable backup income/options and never expect to make great money for the rest of your career.

runnin' like a mofo.

 

[SpauldingSmails]

Keep in mind that this isn't final until the governing bodies at the national level approve it. It's entirely possible that the Executive Council will look at the split vote and decide that this isn't a good idea.

Where does the CPZ coordinator stand on this issue?

The CPZ coordinator is a strong advocate for remaining within DAL MEC, he's giving a presentation to the Ex. Council at the request of the MEC to state his view point.

 

[samballs]

Keep in mind that this isn't final until the governing bodies at the national level approve it. It's entirely possible that the Executive Council will look at the split vote and decide that this isn't a good idea.

Where does the CPZ coordinator stand on this issue?

Prater will be feeding his face with a jelly donut and coffee, trying to figure out how to get more money for the MECS to eat. This is small stuff compared to the MECS food bills

 

[DoinTime]

Keep in mind that this isn't final until the governing bodies at the national level approve it. It's entirely possible that the Executive Council will look at the split vote and decide that this isn't a good idea.

Where does the CPZ coordinator stand on this issue?

Its not up to the Council to decide if this is a good idea. The only thing the EC will do is look at the feasibility/reasonability of the request. Even with the split vote, the resolution more than meets these benchmarks.

 

[PCL_128]

Its not up to the Council to decide if this is a good idea. The only thing the EC will do is look at the feasibility/reasonability of the request. Even with the split vote, the resolution more than meets these benchmarks.

The Bylaws aren't exactly clear on this, as far as I can tell. However, I would say that "feasibility" is in question, as the Association is having financial problems. Creating a new MEC for no reasonable purpose that will surely suck up OCF money and not be able to support itself, while meanwhile the DAL MEC has millions of dollars sitting in their SMRA doing nothing but buying extravagant furniture to inflate the Chairman's ego, make this a highly unreasonable request, in my opinion.