Comair and Expressjet Pilots Hate RAH?

[wmuflyguy]

Is Panda Express still there by the old ACA crew room...........

I misses me some Panda Express

Still there serving up "orange flavored chicken"

 

[Indy319FA]

Unless we find other work for the 69, we're on the slow road to closing the doors. CAL is just gonna keep decreasing our amount of flying. What I don't understand is why some of you guys are happy about seeing a regional with a good contract going down drain. Are you guys really that shortsighted

No joy here. I just went through this with ACA/Indy and I do not wish that experience on anyone. I'd love to see you guys strike out on your own and make it, but the odds are against it. Unfortunately it appears that anytime a regional gets a decent contract with decent pay, they will be undercut by another company with cut rate wages. This cycle will continue to repeat itself until it is fixed by putting all of this flying back to mainline where it belongs, or some of these companies make successful ventures on their own.

 

[Indy319FA]

I just hope that you all will put some real effort into bettering your next contract, specifically your 70 seat rates.

I hope we negotiate better contracts for both the pilots and FAs. Unfortunately if present trends continue, we will then lose all of our work to somebody else.........

 

[Fly2Scuba]

No comparison

It's a bad comparison to make when you group together the better times of the late 90s with what's going on now. None of the majors had furloughs back in the day and the concept of "regionals" flying mainline routes was in it's infancy. Now, the cards are on the table and you can't be so naive to pretend the "regionals" are just a stepping stone to a better job at a so called major when you are already flying mainline size aircraft for inadequate pay and BENEFITS. I have no hard feelings towards the Chataqua pilots who aren't happy with the state of their larger aircraft pay/benefits nd the degredation of the airline pilot profession. The other yahoos on here are another story; the unethical short-sighted slimeballs happy to upgrade as fast as possible without doing their part to ensure long-hall intergrity of the profession.

 

[007]

It's a bad comparison to make when you group together the better times of the late 90s with what's going on now. None of the majors had furloughs back in the day and the concept of "regionals" flying mainline routes was in it's infancy. Now, the cards are on the table and you can't be so naive to pretend the "regionals" are just a stepping stone to a better job at a so called major when you are already flying mainline size aircraft for inadequate pay and BENEFITS. I have no hard feelings towards the Chataqua pilots who aren't happy with the state of their larger aircraft pay/benefits nd the degredation of the airline pilot profession. The other yahoos on here are another story; the unethical short-sighted slimeballs happy to upgrade as fast as possible without doing their part to ensure long-hall intergrity of the profession.

Excellent, Smithers.

 

[Booker]

two subs from Quiznos then proceed to sit down at gate A6 untuck his shirt and eat not one but both of them

Well, what kind of length are we talking about here? I mean, two smalls are a little different than two larges. Whatever; I just call ahead to Subway and have a party sub waiting for me, and my Van Heusen Circus Tent precludes the pesky need to un-tuck.

Carry on.

 

[SBD]

We all need to get in a cage and just go at each other. The last regional standing wins. That would probably solve the problem there. All this talk about less pay v.s. stealing flying v.s 90 seat a/c for 50 seat pay will continue until who knows when. Everyone has an idea of what to do but until we all can get on the same page it will never happen. Comair against RAH who is against XJT who is against Mesa doesn't mean crap. Who is against these greedy management bastards?

 

[BlueCanoe]

Nope, for the same reason that I don't expect for you to refuse to fly a 170 route for UAL, its not a reasonable request. I just hope that you all will put some real effort into bettering your next contract, specifically your 70 seat rates.

I'm sorry you're stupid. I know you've been at XJT for, like, 8 mos. or something (start studying, that first recurrent is coming up!!), and you have the entire industry figured out. I'd like to help you a bit since you obviously know nothing about CHQ. I know I'm wasting my breath because, like most mouthy F/O's on this board, any discussion that varies from your line of thought will glance of your cerebrum. This contract we have as of today, had certain goals, in this order: 1) Non-concessionary (accomplished, first post-9/11 and first one after Mesa's "contract", which was an improvement for THEM) 2) ONE-LIST scope (very costly for the stuff idiots badger us about, accomplished. And we all know NO contract is worth anything if you can be whipsawed) 3) 50 seat pay (brought up to industry standard)

Now we all know that there are things that need improved. There's no arguing that. Our contract opens in OCT 07. Here's the goals: Maintaining SCOPE, E-Jet Pay (170/175/190/195)- which will be tough because most of us on the US175 will be making more than LCC pilots on the 190, and of course upgrading benefits and what not.

If I seem patronizing, it's because I am. Mouthy idiots like yourself are like the local drunks. Just running your mouths like you are a frickin' walking encyclopedia, without having any knowledge to back up your statements. Do some research, and quit parroting what others say. You should just put quotes around everything you write, because it's already been said in another thread. The interesting thing is, I keep reading this drivel and actually think I might get through to people. I can't believe I'm an optomist (is this an oxymoronic statement?)

I'm glad you have a hard-on cause you work for XJET. It's great to take pride in your work and the company that feeds your family. Just do yourself a favor, walk a mile in someone else's shoes. You guys aren't losing any airplanes from all the information available. Who cares what the outside is painted like? The inside will still be that blueish-grey that our Brazillianaires paint the cockpit. All you should care about is your paycheck doesn't bounce, you still have a job and you are not losing any planes.

 

[BoilerUP]

in the interest of accuracy

E-Jet Pay (170/175/190/195)- which will be tough because most of us on the US175 will be making more than LCC pilots on the 190

This is not a flame...but how can you honestly make that statement?

10 year CA at LCC (tops) is around $95 and RAH is $88.37 at year 10 starting October of this year. 6th year CA at LCC is around $88 and RAH is $78.22. FO hourly rates aren't even close. RAH 175 CA pay doesn't go over $95/hr until year 13, and there are fewer than 25 people on the RAH seniority list with 12 years or more longevity.

First year FO pay at LCC is around $41 while RAH is $22.50 and year three is around $46 vs. $34.

 

[OldManPilot]

I seem to remember a time 3-4 yrs ago when XJT did not exist and Continental Express was a wholly owned subsidiary constructed out of 3 commuters that worked for CAL. They formed us in their image. S/it, even our profiles are the same.

So when you say we didn't get screwed by CAL so they could fund their pensions while we go down the drain, think again.

Unless we find other work for the 69, we're on the slow road to closing the doors. CAL is just gonna keep decreasing our amount of flying. What I don't understand is why some of you guys are happy about seeing a regional with a good contract going down drain. Are you guys really that shortsighted.

As a CHQ Captain I take no joy in seeing another airline lose pilots or flying however, it will be and always has been a business driven by costs. CHQ has a business model that allows it to operate at a lower cost, thus we are able to bid for flying at a lower rate in some cases.

Just take a look at the industry. Southwest is growing due to their cost structure and business model. They are able to deliver the same product at a lower price. CHQ has built their flying in the exact same manor. I hope you are not naive enough to think that this business plan and cost structure is solely driven by Pilot pay rate. CHQ has and continues to look for better ways to save money yet not jeapordize its safety. This has given us a small head start in what is now happening in the regional side as well as mainline companies.

I can certainly understand your anger over the loss of flying, yet to bury your head in the sand and just lay blame on others for your losses is both foolish and naive.

There are many ways that we need to continue to improve, both corporate wise and Pilot wise. We will soon be entering negotiations to do just that. We will continue to better our C.B.A in an effort to improve quality of life and compensation.

My best wishes go forward to all my fellow regional pilots. In the tough environment that we currently all see ourselves in I hope we can work together to strengthen what seems to be a growing trend, continued growth on the regional size aircraft . We cannot control what is given to us for flying; however, we can control the way we treat each other and how we work together to close the gap between ourselves and mainline pilots in both pay and quality of life issues.

Showing hatred does nothing but weaken our regional airline industry. It shows immaturity and weakness. Try to rise above this thinking. As I have stated before, if you must be angry at anyone for the reduction in mainline flying, get angry and who caused it, mainline pilots.

 

[BlueCanoe]

This is not a flame...but how can you honestly make that statement?

10 year CA at LCC (tops) is around $95 and RAH is $88.37 at year 10 starting October of this year. 6th year CA at LCC is around $88 and RAH is $78.22. FO hourly rates aren't even close. RAH 175 CA pay doesn't go over $95/hr until year 13, and there are fewer than 25 people on the RAH seniority list with 12 years or more longevity.

First year FO pay at LCC is around $41 while RAH is $22.50 and year three is around $46 vs. $34.

I should have been more specific. F/O's its no contest. By the time the '07 payraise kicks in OCT 07, in a straight seniority bid, about 70% of the captains would hold about 90/hr. Most of us get 1100 to 1200 hours of paycredit a year (being lazy and flying your line). With a 92 hr/mo pay cap at US that means a LCC CA hitting the cap each month makes 104880, and we'd make 103500 based on 1150 hours of pay. I know in your eyes we're not even in the ballpark even though we have 14 seats less. We're going to have a handful of guys at 119/hr in OCT 07 by the time the new contract is signed, 70% of the captains in a straight bid will be at 101/hr. At the current pay rates that equals the bottom end at 116150 and top end 136850. Hopefully, the F/O pay will get fixed in the next contract.

Take it however you want.

 

[BoilerUP]

I should have been more specific. F/O's its no contest. By the time the '07 payraise kicks in OCT 07, in a straight seniority bid, about 70% of the captains would hold about 90/hr. Most of us get 1100 to 1200 hours of paycredit a year (being lazy and flying your line). With a 92 hr/mo pay cap at US that means a LCC CA hitting the cap each month makes 104880, and we'd make 103500 based on 1150 hours of pay. I know in your eyes we're not even in the ballpark even though we have 14 seats less. We're going to have a handful of guys at 119/hr in OCT 07 by the time the new contract is signed, 70% of the captains in a straight bid will be at 101/hr. At the current pay rates that equals the bottom end at 116150 and top end 136850. Hopefully, the F/O pay will get fixed in the next contract.

Take it however you want.

Like I said I wasn't trying to flame, just trying to understand if you were serious or being facious. I was not aware of the pay cap at LCC or that most RAH pilots credit 1100+ hours per year.

Oct. 07 isn't too far off...good luck in negotiations!

 

[TEXAN AVIATOR]

The first time I'm at the urinal next to a CHQ guy in IAH I'll "miss" onto his payless shoes.

 

[BlueCanoe]

The first time I'm at the urinal next to a CHQ guy in IAH I'll "miss" onto his payless shoes.

What do you care? You haven't lost anything. You still have 274 airplanes and they will be flying. No furloughs have been announced, nor rumored. In fact, they are still hiring (this is from activity in Good Eats and IAH HI pool.).
Your QOL and job expectations haven't been changed. If your MGT can't find work for the airplanes, then you can be mad at them.

Good luck on your career.

 

[The Drizzle]

The first time I'm at the urinal next to a CHQ guy in IAH I'll "miss" onto his payless shoes.

is it hard to aim when it is that small?

 

[007]

As a CHQ Captain I take no joy in seeing another airline lose pilots or flying however, it will be and always has been a business driven by costs. CHQ has a business model that allows it to operate at a lower cost, thus we are able to bid for flying at a lower rate in some cases.

Just take a look at the industry. Southwest is growing due to their cost structure and business model. They are able to deliver the same product at a lower price. CHQ has built their flying in the exact same manor. I hope you are not naive enough to think that this business plan and cost structure is solely driven by Pilot pay rate. CHQ has and continues to look for better ways to save money yet not jeapordize its safety. This has given us a small head start in what is now happening in the regional side as well as mainline companies.

I can certainly understand your anger over the loss of flying, yet to bury your head in the sand and just lay blame on others for your losses is both foolish and naive.

There are many ways that we need to continue to improve, both corporate wise and Pilot wise. We will soon be entering negotiations to do just that. We will continue to better our C.B.A in an effort to improve quality of life and compensation.

My best wishes go forward to all my fellow regional pilots. In the tough environment that we currently all see ourselves in I hope we can work together to strengthen what seems to be a growing trend, continued growth on the regional size aircraft . We cannot control what is given to us for flying; however, we can control the way we treat each other and how we work together to close the gap between ourselves and mainline pilots in both pay and quality of life issues.

Showing hatred does nothing but weaken our regional airline industry. It shows immaturity and weakness. Try to rise above this thinking. As I have stated before, if you must be angry at anyone for the reduction in mainline flying, get angry and who caused it, mainline pilots.

Sorry, I should have clarified that this post was not meant as CHQ vs XJT, but rather for all the guys up here saying that XJT is too expensive and deserves to lose flying. If it was capacity going back to mainline, GREAT. But it's not, it's just that CAL is done with us, they have made all the money they made of us. That's all I meant to say.

 

[wings421]

The first time I'm at the urinal next to a CHQ guy in IAH I'll "miss" onto his payless shoes.

Come on now, they're Shoe Sensations. Second, if its my shoes you "miss" on, you'll be shining them back up with your tongue!

 

[OldManPilot]

Uhh Sigh....

like talking to a bunch of 1st graders...

 

[Capt.PoopyPants]

This is not a flame...but how can you honestly make that statement?

10 year CA at LCC (tops) is around $95 and RAH is $88.37 at year 10 starting October of this year. 6th year CA at LCC is around $88 and RAH is $78.22. FO hourly rates aren't even close. RAH 175 CA pay doesn't go over $95/hr until year 13, and there are fewer than 25 people on the RAH seniority list with 12 years or more longevity.

First year FO pay at LCC is around $41 while RAH is $22.50 and year three is around $46 vs. $34.

There's an easy answer to that, FO's at RAH are regularly overlooked. There pretty much considered useless by some. Why Pay what you don't need.

 

[humblepilot9]

Would all you guys listen to yourselves complain. Life is too short for this. You know, while you complain and cut others down, there are people being killed at war for your freedom. I don't think many of you realize just how blessed you are.

 

[buyagoat]

the pilots of any carrier are not to blame, its the upper management that ruins the whole industry, and the unions have not been there for us like they should be

 

[SkyBoy1981]

I'm sorry you're stupid. I know you've been at XJT for, like, 8 mos. or something.

OMG Closer to like, 2 years or something....like, for sure

Regardless of the rambling nonsense in your previous post, your 70 seat rates still suck. That is the only thing I stated in my post and I still stand by that statement. Once again, I hope you all are able to improve on them in your next contract. Good luck.

 

[relief tube]

When you lose flying to a group with better pay, you can't be completely that pissed, so take away Comair from this arguement. As for Coex, I heard it's 44 planes, not 69, and pay-wise:

1st 4 years
CHQ FO- 22/30/34/35
Coex - 22/33/35/37

5 more years CA and then MAX
CHQ - 64/66/68/71/73 Max 95
Coex - 66/68/69/72/74 Max 92

Coex pay is better, but not by as much as some of the previous posts are trying to sound like. The only comfort is that Coex is still hiring, so the people hired the rest of the year at least know what they're getting themselves into.

Just an unbiased .02

 

[BlueCanoe]

OMG Closer to like, 2 years or something....like, for sure

So I take this to mean that you had almost no idea what life at XJET was prior this contract. You weren't there when people were EARNING the contract YOU are enjoying. I'm sure you know nothing about my company nor the state of the industry when our contract was signed. All I want you to do is to realize what is out in the world beyond your 2 years of dragging around at XJET. When our 170 payscales were signed, there were no orders, nor, more importantly, NO airplanes on property. We looked at the payscales as a dangling carrot.

I can't help you if you don't want to pull your head out and breathe fresh air. Go on back to telling the rest of us how it is, we obviously should be greatful to have someone with your knowledge and foresight for pointing out our errors and deficiencies. We would have never known.....

 

[SkyBoy1981]

So I take this to mean that you had almost no idea what life at XJET was prior this contract. You weren't there when people were EARNING the contract YOU are enjoying. I'm sure you know nothing about my company nor the state of the industry when our contract was signed. All I want you to do is to realize what is out in the world beyond your 2 years of dragging around at XJET. When our 170 payscales were signed, there were no orders, nor, more importantly, NO airplanes on property. We looked at the payscales as a dangling carrot.

I can't help you if you don't want to pull your head out and breathe fresh air. Go on back to telling the rest of us how it is, we obviously should be greatful to have someone with your knowledge and foresight for pointing out our errors and deficiencies. We would have never known.....

That is all fine and well. My intentions were not to bash your pilot group. You are the one that felt the need to bring things to the immature level of attempting to insult me. In any case, I wish you all the best of luck with your next contract.

 

[BlueCanoe]

That is all fine and well. My intentions were not to bash your pilot group. You are the one that felt the need to bring things to the immature level of attempting to insult me. In any case, I wish you all the best of luck with your next contract.

SkyBoy1981 clips from this thread:

Am I particularly fond of the way that their company survives by undercutting and potentially taking jobs away from other pilots? Nope.

I don't work for a company that is flying mini 737's around on former legacy routes for a legacy carrier that has pilots on furlough though. That would be you.

As I said before, my concern is with pilots losing their jobs at the benefit of another pilot group with a less valuable contract, not just pilot groups losing flying or growth potential.

I'm talking about people losing jobs. CAL pilots may have lost growth potential over our flying, but they haven't lost their jobs over it.

I just hope that you all will put some real effort into bettering your next contract, specifically your 70 seat rates.

You're right. Nothing you said could be taken as a "bash" towards our pilot group. Maybe I just don't like you, I don't know....Perhaps its just the overall air of superiority you take towards us in passive-agressive backhanded complements. It could be the insulting insinuation that we don't know where our faults are. Maybe you just don't know what you're talking about....

All I'm saying is LEARN something on the topic before you run your yap. I think it's great about your contract, all the people there before you that made your lifestyle possible. Between Horizon and XJET contracts we have a new industry standard to reach towards. We have some significant issues to deal with, which I have stated earlier.

 

[blott]

I was going to suggest someone e-mail skyboy's parents and send them a link for software that allows them to monitor their kid's internet use. But, after seeing how most of skyboy's posts have been edited, I guess they already have it installed...

 

[600rvr]

"Don't hate the player hate the game" amen Sled

 

[SkyBoy1981]

You guys are down to just making immature insults now. I stand by everything that I said above.

What exactly do you want for me to do? Do you want me to be a fan of your company knowing that it would gladly underbid for the rest of the COEX flying if it had the opportunity and leave me without a job? I'm sorry, but I can't do that. I have nothing against your pilot group. I always treat CHQ guys with respect when I run into them on the road. That doesn't change the way I feel about the way their company does business though.

I don't hate the players....but I'm not exactly a fan of their team...thats all.

 

[BlueCanoe]

You guys are down to just making immature insults now. I stand by everything that I said above.

..uh no...pointing out that you have no reading comprehension or you are only able to parrot what has been posted on here repeatedly and often is not an immature insult.

The fact that you come bash our company, then say you didn't is an insult. It's just obvious you have no idea what you are talking about when it comes to my company. I get annoyed when you self-anointed prophets of the industry step up to the pulpit and talk about topics on which you have no clue. So you know like 4 things about my company. Big deal. I don't know anything about XJT, except they have a buncha planes, were Britt at one time, and were owned by CAL until like 3 years ago. I've been in this industry longer than you've been flying airplanes, and I don't know jack about your company. You've been in the industry 2 years by your admission, and I can guarantee you don't know everything about your company, let alone mine.

I know the type of cat you are. If we flew a trip together, all you'd talk about is how you should be on that 75 at CAL, what type of motors it has, and how your uncle will get you hired just as soon as you get your 1000 PIC. Meanwhile, I'll have had to jump your ass becasue you've missed radio calls, standard callouts and you're unable to make crossing restrictions since this industry is "just a place for me to stay until CAL calls". I've seen it before, and I'll see it again.