CitationAir How Much Longer

[BentOver]

Words from the CEO's mouth. This was in the making for sometime. Union had nothing to do with it. They are working with the union now to come up with a package for the furlough guys. 30 planes gone by years end. At least 100 furloughed and who know how many down grades. I thought this was a CA thread and not a NJ bitch thread.

Sorry about the news.. Sucks big time.....

What are they planning on doing with the 30 a/c? I thought I read somewhere that Cessna wouldn't want to saturate the market with used planes at the moment (maybe aviation weekly or some similar website?).

Assuming you'll have 50+/- a/c... What do you all staff at?

Does it sound like that is all you'll lose or is the plan to keep shrinking beyond the end of the year? Some survey I read said you all had 50 a/c worth of fractional owners?

Wish there was some silver lining. Job market continues to be very tough with few acceptable options for many. Hopefully the airlines will atleast ramp up hiring next year or so.

Finally, if they had been planning it for awhile now, why recall the entirelist of furloughees? I really hope nobody left a decent job to come back... That is just a ********************ty thing for management to do. I may have had to go postal on someone.

 

[OPECJet]

Words from the CEO's mouth. This was in the making for sometime. Union had nothing to do with it. They are working with the union now to come up with a package for the furlough guys. 30 planes gone by years end. At least 100 furloughed and who know how many down grades. I thought this was a CA thread and not a NJ bitch thread.

Hope the unemployment time is short lived guys! I wish we were in a position to pick you guys up.

 

[BentOver]

Right as usual. Bill, the CEO, made it very clear that the goings on were business related and have nothing whatever to do with the union. Happy, or do you still think it's because of the union!? What do you think his response will be, Bentover?

He'll still find a way to blame it on the Union drive or the CBA... Not even realizing there is no CBA yet....People like him are impossible to rationalize with.

 

[CE750Driver]

I am telling the union fans that there is a significant number who don't support them and their attitude. Reality is sometimes unpleasant I guess. I know only 4 or 5 pilots in the G4 and G5 fleets who support the union, although I am sure there are quite a few more, since the gold tie guys and gals have crossed over. Speaking of dividing, have you seen what CE750 and Imacdog have posted about me? I think I have kept a civil tone. Black and white? I have said the union at NJA is better than I have seen elsewhere so far, and am hoping Luthi departs the leadership position soon, for the sake of all of us.

Waaaaaa! With your posts about scabbing, and not bidding airplanes because you couldnt stand to fly with NJA pilots. You make me sick. You are less than a man, and now you are crying like a school girl because you have made enemies. Bite me.

You reap what you sow.

 

[Crash Pad]

I bet someone outside the states picks these aircraft up. CJ3s have held a high resale value over the past few years and are built like toyotas compared to other 500 series. Cessna will make a helluva deal to send them to Asia or South America to make a presence if they get the chance.

 

[G4dude]

Waaaaaa! With your posts about scabbing, and not bidding airplanes because you couldnt stand to fly with NJA pilots. You make me sick. You are less than a man, and now you are crying like a school girl because you have made enemies. Bite me.

You reap what you sow.

Thanks. You verify everything I say every time you post.

 

[G4dude]

He'll still find a way to blame it on the Union drive or the CBA... Not even realizing there is no CBA yet....People like him are impossible to rationalize with.

It might not be the union, actually. I just thought it was quite coincidental, but I am not informed of the inner workings of CA.

 

[imacdog]

dog how G4 doesn't see it that way?

Was that English, YIP?

 

[imacdog]

Anyone else tearing up as we watch these guys ride into the sunset? See 'ya, boys.

If I kept getting proven wrong all the time then I probably would want to leave too!

 

[G4dude]

Waaaaaa! With your posts about scabbing, and not bidding airplanes because you couldnt stand to fly with NJA pilots. You make me sick. You are less than a man, and now you are crying like a school girl because you have made enemies. Bite me.

You reap what you sow.

I haven't made enemies, except on this site. The enemies I have here make me proud to have them as "enemies." They are irrational, emotional, and venal. They assume because I disagree with them about how to go about employee relations, that means I don't care about pilots. I just love good conversation and trying to figure stuff out, that's all. By the way, the folks I fly with at NJA are great. My main joy at NJA is the people I get to work with and travel with and have dinner with and converse with. We talk about movies and current events and food and the union lunatics and the imminent collapse of the Euro and books and music and Luthi's latest antics and our investments and all sorts of good stuff. And sometimes college basketball.

 

[XTW]

On a conference call last evening, the CEO stated that this had nothing at all to do with the union being on the property and in fact, he expects the negotiating team to work out some type of furlough agreement. IMO, this has come from a lot further up the food chain.


XTW

 

[pilotyip]

I haven't made enemies, except on this site. The enemies I have here make me proud to have them as "enemies." They are irrational, emotional, and venal. They assume because I disagree with them about how to go about employee relations, that means I don't care about pilots. I just love good conversation and trying to figure stuff out, that's all. By the way, the folks I fly with at NJA are great. My main joy at NJA is the people I get to work with and travel with and have dinner with and converse with. We talk about movies and current events and food and the union lunatics and the imminent collapse of the Euro and books and music and Luthi's latest antics and our investments and all sorts of good stuff. And sometimes college basketball.

And I commend you; you have never reverted to the famous FI name calling, you have been respectful in your posts. Unlike the standard response for many on FI who disagree with you. But it is easy to revert to name calling when you hide behind a screen name.

Your posts always have that touch of reality which brings up those inconvienet truths that many elect to ignore. Keep up the good work.

 

[gunfyter]

What are they planning on doing with the 30 a/c? .

Where all airplanes eventually go ... EJM.

 

[NachoMamma]

And I commend you; you have never reverted to the famous FI name calling, you have been respectful in your posts. Unlike the standard response for many on FI who disagree with you. But it is easy to revert to name calling when you hide behind a screen name.

And proudly so, Praetorian. I think you union goons are morons.

If you freaking morons ever strike NJA, I will definitely scab. So will almost all my colleagues at the former NJI

Cognative decline...so sad :laugh:

 

[NachoMamma]

Was that English, YIP?

Go easy on the old timer...he's just a little past his prime.

 

[imacdog]

Cognative decline...so sad :laugh:

No way, YIP was proven wrong yet again? Maybe he should stick to flying car parts around.

 

[G4dude]

Cognative decline...so sad :laugh:[/QUOTE

YIP is on the money, as always.

 

[G4dude]

Cognative decline...so sad :laugh:

I have to admit, I got a little HOT with those posts. Sorry. Unions scare me to death, after the job history I have endured.

 

[7on7Off]

Seriously, can we have one thread on here that sticks to the topic? Remove all the NJA comments and this turns into a one page thread. You guys want to union bash and hate each other start a different thread!

 

[imacdog]

Seriously, can we have one thread on here that sticks to the topic? Remove all the NJA comments and this turns into a one page thread. You guys want to union bash and hate each other start a different thread!

There are CitationAir pilots taking the opportunity to union bash here as well. Of course, their statements were made out of emotion and not fact.

 

[G4dude]

There are CitationAir pilots taking the opportunity to union bash here as well. Of course, their statements were made out of emotion and not fact.

Most of this thread is rightly about what the union vote probably did to CA. NJA is not being discussed here.

 

[dime line]

Most of this thread is rightly about what the union vote probably did to CA. NJA is not being discussed here.

And there lies the problem, you have no clue what impact the union vote had on CS.

 

[PCL_128]

And I commend you

There is nothing at all to be commended about a person who says he wants to scab.

 

[rigger]

Right as usual. Bill, the CEO, made it very clear that the goings on were business related and have nothing whatever to do with the union. Happy, or do you still think it's because of the union!? What do you think his response will be, Bentover?

I am sure you and others believe bill when he says this has been in the works...hogwash, the senior managers in the company were called into a meeting an hour before the 1st announcement to be told about the items that were in the works for a long time.....come on people stop being stupid....being dumb about business is one thing were pilots but loosing all common sense is...well stupid! If Bill tells you the truth he looks like a fool, he was as blindsided as the line pilots...he would not have taken charge of a sinking ship.....that would be stupid and Shultz is not stupid!

Common sense guys, not matter what you FEEL....The Union did not cause this it was just one more item in the chain that helped.....and after the meeting last evening anyone of the 16 by march gonna pay dues? Any of the 100 by the end of the year wanna waste 800 to 1000 bucks? You will get no return on this at all. I hate to be the bearer of bad news but this time there will be no coming back to CA this is the end if your off property......again common sense!

 

[jonjuan]

No way, YIP was proven wrong yet again? Maybe he should stick to flying car parts around.

From someone who thinks he's better because he flies wealthy people around (who think nothing of him).

 

[imacdog]

News flash, I'm furloughed and don't fly wealthy people around. The people I do fly though, are quite happy and appreciative for what I'm doing.

But let's look at why flying wealthy/famous people around (again, something I no longer do) requires a higher degree of professionalism and safety than flying car parts. If one of the fracs dorks a plane with a celebrity onboard, the entire country will find out. The backlash against the company could be big enough to cripple it permanently. What happens when a cargo plane goes down? Maybe some coverage at the location of the crash, and maybe some coverage at the hometown of the company. The rest of the world never finds out and doesn't care, and the cargo company will continue to get business as long as they are the lowest bidder. It may be a cold way to look at things, but that's how they are.

 

[Waldom]

"But let's look at why flying wealthy/famous people around (again, something I no longer do) requires a higher degree of professionalism and safety than flying car parts."

Interesting attitude.

Seems to me that there should be no difference in the level of professionalism with which you approach your flying regardless of what is in the cabin.

Do you actually relax your standards if there are not "wealthy/famous" people" in the back?

 

[BentOver]

"But let's look at why flying wealthy/famous people around (again, something I no longer do) requires a higher degree of professionalism and safety than flying car parts."

Interesting attitude.

Seems to me that there should be no difference in the level of professionalism with which you approach your flying regardless of what is in the cabin.

Do you actually relax your standards if there are not "wealthy/famous" people" in the back?

From strickly a stick and rudder perspective, yes flying wealthy people (or any people for that matter) trains one to fly "better" than flying boxes....If you have experience flying people, especially wealthy, you know not to bank 45 degrees to final, not to descend at 4000 ft/m.. Not to slam on the brakes and TR's...

We have people at our place with only BE99 cargo time... Our non pilot co-workers can tell the difference of experience.

Nothing against only having box flying experience, but I think flying peole trains you to be smoother. (Not a better pilot operational/standard wise)

 

[AftCG182]

From strickly a stick and rudder perspective, yes flying wealthy people (or any people for that matter) trains one to fly "better" than flying boxes....If you have experience flying people, especially wealthy, you know not to bank 45 degrees to final, not to descend at 4000 ft/m.. Not to slam on the brakes and TR's...

We have people at our place with only BE99 cargo time... Our non pilot co-workers can tell the difference of experience.

Nothing against only having box flying experience, but I think flying peole trains you to be smoother. (Not a better pilot operational/standard wise)

However, far and away, the best pilots are those who've cut their teeth at the hands of the Mighty Beech 1900(C or D). The FMS can be figured out sooner or later, but the Beech'll teach you how to fly. imp:

 

[CA1900]

However, far and away, the best pilots are those who've cut their teeth at the hands of the Mighty Beech 1900(C or D). The FMS can be figured out sooner or later, but the Beech'll teach you how to fly. imp:

I agree completely!