Can anyone understand "problems" with NWA's seniority list?

[~~~^~~~]

There is some discontinuity here,

Also you know the scope language and you continue to ignore it, why?

OK Poster #1 was trying to whip up hysteria that Delta will have surplus positions due to reduced North Atlantic flying. I pointed out that we are moving pilots into the international category, there is no surplus.

Poster #2 was arguing against the flow back. What did I miss in pointing out the applicable scope that was carried forward from NWA and Delta's Section 1?

I do not expect the flow back to happen. I'm not saying it is not there.

 

[Superpilot92]

I love DC9's. As General has alluded to, there seems to be another, better, reason for the DC9's from the desert rumor. It is a way to introduce a cheap competitor into negotiations for other airplanes in the 100 to 150 seat market.

Maybe, maybe not but either argument is just as much "FACT" as the other. The RD side is quick to discount the fact that the -9s could be coming back to replace regional feed. It is just funny how any discussion that hints at the DC9s bringing more to the table gets some of you guys up in arms. More jobs at mainline is a good thing, right? :beer:

 

[Superpilot92]

OK Poster #1 was trying to whip up hysteria that Delta will have surplus positions due to reduced North Atlantic flying. I pointed out that we are moving pilots into the international category, there is no surplus.

Poster #2 was arguing against the flow back. What did I miss in pointing out the applicable scope that was carried forward from NWA and Delta's Section 1?

I do not expect the flow back to happen. I'm not saying it is not there.

I was just pointing out that it appeared that you were trying to portray the new CVG stuff as a total increase in positions. Also you keep trying to portray that the DC9s are getting replaced completely by RJs when in fact it is more likely now that we at mainline will be taking back flying soon.

is it Dec. 8th yet? :beer:

 

[~~~^~~~]

Super, didn't you write:

The kicker is it would be a significant move by mgmt to furlough because they will have to do it in seniority order and absorb the significant cost associated with all of the training events that would occur at all levels of both lists.

There are a number of factors that all point to No furloughs occurring. If further capacity cuts happen then we likely wont see any hiring next year and the increased staffing needs will be a wash.

If so, we are just echo'ing each other.

The numbers don't tell me that the DC9 is Lazarus. Unlike his miracle of being raised from the dead, Lazarus did not need a new paint job, interior and a C Check. He also did not eat more than anyone else.

We need to knock it off, the South Americans are getting worried about their spare parts supply. But if it really came back, I'd bid the left seat and be very happy about it. I don't mind good crow with a little BBQ sauce.

 

[Cobraair75drvr]

As you can see from my ramblings, both private and public i ain't to quick.. Could you make your last sentance below mo clear???

I love DC9's. As General has alluded to, there seems to be another, better, reason for the DC9's from the desert rumor. It is a way to introduce a cheap competitor into negotiations for other airplanes in the 100 to 150 seat market.

 

[Superpilot92]

Super, didn't you write:
If so, we are just echo'ing each other.

The numbers don't tell me that the DC9 is Lazarus. Unlike his miracle of being raised from the dead, Lazarus did not need a new paint job, interior and a C Check. He also did not eat more than anyone else.

We need to knock it off, the South Americans are getting worried about their spare parts supply. But if it really came back, I'd bid the left seat and be very happy about it. I don't mind good crow with a little BBQ sauce.

We are in agreement that we likely wont see any backwards movement. But that has nothing to do with the discussion above does it? I was just pointing out that the DC9s DO have a purpose and can be very beneficial to the new DAL in "getting out of the RJ business", another DAL mgmt Honcho quote. Hopefully you will be having some Crow with BBQ sauce Might i suggest a good beer to wash it down with :beer:

 

[~~~^~~~]

As you can see from my ramblings, both private and public i ain't to quick.. Could you make your last sentance below mo clear???

Various rumors are going around about negotiations with Boeing & various MD90 operators around the World to obtain anything from a handful of 717's to a bunch of MD90's. Also rumors about the GTF version of an A320, 737's, and Bombardier's new C Series. Anyone who's talking doesn't know and people that know aren't talking.

The theory is that a used DC9 with zero acquisition cost can be used as a competitor to negotiate a lower capital expenditure on new equipment.

It could be. Someone else opined that the Company has it's hands full getting the current fleet under a SOC. Who knows?

 

[ACL65PILOT]

AWST talked about a re-engine mod to the 320, but they were skeptical about it. They did not want to impact the Next Gen model that will be coming out in about 2018.

 

[~~~^~~~]

The DC9s DO have a purpose and can be very beneficial to the new DAL in "getting out of the RJ business."

I am not sure Delta can get out of the RJ Business. Most of the F4D contracts have a fairly long duration and Mesa's case may be an indicator of what is necessary to break the contracts. Skywest is sitting on a Billion in cash - insolvency isn't an issue to break that contract.

Mesaba and Compass are still getting airplanes and there are around 10 still to be awarded large RJ's that the Company appears to be wanting to use for negotiations. ASA pilots report Delta offered SkyWest a lose two 50's, get a 900 deal that the Company passed on to avoid furloughs.

No doubt Delta would like to have fewer 50's, but it will be hard to pull them out of servce without parking Delta's own airplanes at Comair.

Mr. Bastian knows what pleases a mainline crowd. How many times have we heard about RJ reductions, but yet, how many new airplanes do you see out there?

I'd like to see Delta just buy the right sized airplane for the right routes and use a common list to fly them. To that point, I'd like to see Delta get in the RJ business and get away from outsourcing.

 

[ACL65PILOT]

Don't we all FIN, but as they say, "Reality is a ....."


Fact is that I think that a lot of the words that are being spoken and talk that that is being offered up if for a bigger game. One that does not consider pilots and their careers. It is one that concerns money, profitability, and survivability.

I flew on a 170 yesterday, and I have to say. It is much nicer than an 88. Heck it was more comfortable that a 757. It has large windows and more room for the economy passenger. That is what we are competing against.
I agree, those jets need to be flown by mainline pilots. But, how do we get there.