CAL dropping Colgan?

[30West]

I would think the Captain she last flew with would beg to differ.
While he was pitching up into the stall she retracted the flaps, by definition doing the wrong thing uncommanded makes her an incompetent, and by that virtue, well unsafe. If you dont have the skills to recognize that, well....
BTW after I made my first dollar flying as a commercial pilot I never paid another penny for anything related to operating an aircraft, except for a Jepp subscription(NOS was supplied), airlane rentals, or training. I got my ATP at upgrade.
PBR

While this F/O was no Scott Crossfield, didn't they both go out doing something stupid, and unintentional? I'm sure he didn't set out that day intending to fall out of a thunderhead in a thousand pieces.
Does that mean that he was also, using your own template above, incompetent and unsafe? Is that what the epilogue to his life should read?

 

[ratherbeflyen]

I'd put more salt on the rumor of colgan in houston than colgan being cut. At this point anyway.

 

[motch]

Unfortunately, Colgan is going nowhere..
(At least for 2 years)

And I do not mean that in a negative way towards Colgan crews. My first ever solo student is a Captain there (Q400) and I do not wish to see him or any one else loose their jobs.

But CAL currently has 147 pilots on Furlough and that should not happen without our regionals also furloughing or downsizing. I would like to see a clause that -
a) Puts furloughed mainline pilots in the Left seat of ANY commuter that grows while mainline furloughs.
b) Stops all growth at the commuter the second that mainline furloughs.

Don't get me wrong, I also think that the commuters should get preferrential hiring at their associated mainline carrier. One hand has to and should wash the other~

motch

 

[HOMER D POE]

in a perfect systenm, like minor league baseball, a commuter captain would be captive to their major and wait for the "callup" to the big leagues.

as for the PM , it is understood why you would want to defend her if you knew her, but in the moments short as they were, she failed to monitor (she was the last line of defense)(that other precious pair of eyes) and she raised the flaps without a call to do so at the most inappropiate time . may she rest in peace. we can only learn from her and marvin's shortcomings. regrettably this can do nothing to console the families who lost loved ones that thought they were buying a CAL product. if they knew then what we know now, they would have never set foot on the ramp. ..in a million years. as they say, would you let this guy fly your family?

 

[nerjdriver]

and what is the body count over at eagle, asa, comair and expressjet? are they also unsafe?

This is like those SAT/ACT questions we all took when you have a group of words and you have to find which one doesn't belong..

A) ExpressJet
B) Comair
C) ASA
D) Eagle
E) Colgan

so...high lord of pointless airline comparisons....which one doesn't fit?

 

[eyeamthechosen1]

I could see them dropping Gulfsream but who knows

 

[PBRstreetgang]

While this F/O was no Scott Crossfield, didn't they both go out doing something stupid, and unintentional? I'm sure he didn't set out that day intending to fall out of a thunderhead in a thousand pieces.
Does that mean that he was also, using your own template above, incompetent and unsafe? Is that what the epilogue to his life should read?

Well,
While I knew Scott Crossfield, his situation was slightly different, he had only himself on board and had a long and distinguished career as a test pilot. There was a question as to whether or not he was having a medical issue and thus was unable to save himself . This F/O couldn't even do the right thing when it was needed most, a simple "check your airspeed" would have saved the day. She should have kept the coffee shop job, at least she might have been qualified for that. As far as Scotts epilogue, his career speaks for it's self and at least he died doing what he had spent the last 50 years doing so well, and did I mention he was SOLO, no one else was hurt.
PBR

 

[Browntothebone]

Unfortunately, Colgan is going nowhere..
(At least for 2 years)

And I do not mean that in a negative way towards Colgan crews. My first ever solo student is a Captain there (Q400) and I do not wish to see him or any one else loose their jobs.

But CAL currently has 147 pilots on Furlough and that should not happen without our regionals also furloughing or downsizing. I would like to see a clause that -
a) Puts furloughed mainline pilots in the Left seat of ANY commuter that grows while mainline furloughs.
b) Stops all growth at the commuter the second that mainline furloughs.

Don't get me wrong, I also think that the commuters should get preferrential hiring at their associated mainline carrier. One hand has to and should wash the other~

motch

What about the more qualified military pilots? They should get preference at a major over ANY regional pilot.

 

[Browntothebone]

in a perfect systenm, like minor league baseball, a commuter captain would be captive to their major and wait for the "callup" to the big leagues.

as for the PM , it is understood why you would want to defend her if you knew her, but in the moments short as they were, she failed to monitor (she was the last line of defense)(that other precious pair of eyes) and she raised the flaps without a call to do so at the most inappropiate time . may she rest in peace. we can only learn from her and marvin's shortcomings. regrettably this can do nothing to console the families who lost loved ones that thought they were buying a CAL product. if they knew then what we know now, they would have never set foot on the ramp. ..in a million years. as they say, would you let this guy fly your family?

What if your "big league" major was the Kansas City Royals of the majors?

 

[CptMurf]

This is like those SAT/ACT questions we all took when you have a group of words and you have to find which one doesn't belong..

A) ExpressJet
B) Comair
C) ASA
D) Eagle
E) Colgan

so...high lord of pointless airline comparisons....which one doesn't fit?

D) Eagle... they were the only one that didn't have a pay-for-training program in the 90's?

Also XJ is the oldest operating regional (over 60 years) and has had (knock on wood) NO fatalities. Although, they did have a pax stabbed in the leg with a windshield wiper, but I digress.

 

[Snaab]

D) Although, they did have a pax stabbed in the leg with a windshield wiper, but I digress.

Let's hear about it.

 

[CptMurf]

Let's hear about it.

Goose hits FO's windshield wiper.... crew screams
Windshield wiper goes into prop....punctures ice shield and stabs pax... pax screams
FA (in jumpseat with no idea whats going on) gets up after landing sees pax... FA screams

What are the odds????

 

[xjhawk]

colgan crashes a plane they fly for Continental and delta has to pay the Liability? wow

 

[livin'thesim]

What about the more qualified military pilots? They should get preference at a major over ANY regional pilot.

That is so true! A regional pilot with four type ratings and thousands of hours in a 50 or 70 seat jet is clearly inferior to a 2000 hour fighter jock. Why, I bet that regional captain wouldn't even know how to call for pushback in an Airbus.

I've spent far too much time in the sim to fall for that one. The civ/mil debate is over, and has been over for a long time. The answer on who is better turned out to be "depends on the person".

 

[Browntothebone]

That is so true! A regional pilot with four type ratings and thousands of hours in a 50 or 70 seat jet is clearly inferior to a 2000 hour fighter jock. Why, I bet that regional captain wouldn't even know how to call for pushback in an Airbus.

I've spent far too much time in the sim to fall for that one. The civ/mil debate is over, and has been over for a long time. The answer on who is better turned out to be "depends on the person".

All you have to do is tell the military guy how to call for a pushback. Once and it's done. Who would you rather have in an aircraft upset condition, a military pilot who has been through extensive training in acrobatics or your "typical" regional captain (3407dude)?

 

[twott driver]

"acrobatics...." isn't that what they do in the circus? Seems like you may be well acquainted with "acrobatics" in that case, clown.

Yes, I'd definately prefer to have someone well versed in jumping through hoops rather than someone getting the plane greasy side down. How difficult can it be anyway?

 

[livin'thesim]

Sigh.

The sim tells a different story. I always chuckle at people who spend too much energy pointing to their training. Are you saying that had you not received military training, you would not feel qualified to fly a mainline aircraft? So you are not intrinsically capable of developing enough skill without the benefit of military training?

Somehow I doubt that is what you're saying.

Spend enough time training pilots and you learn that civilian/military and even total time and previous experience rarely gives you anything more than a general indication of the skill level of the pilot you will be training.

A high time RJ pilot flying a 70-seat jet is already doing the job that they will do at mainline. The idea that an F-16 pilot will somehow transition to an Airbus in a superior way than an regional jet captain (all other things being equal) is really silly. It's so silly that some people will actually believe it.

And regarding your upset scenario, if someone lets the airplane get into that situation, I guess I really wonder about their skills anyway. I will say that if I was flying along in an airliner and another airliner wanted to engage in aerial combat, I would gladly hand the controls over to the ex-mil guy.

But like I said, the argument is over and the answer is "it depends on the pilot".

Feel free to try and litigate a closed case, the industry has already shown that it does not matter to them.

 

[climbhappy]

anyone cared to check loads from from 5 months ago vs today? do people care now?...

 

[Data]

Who would you rather have in an aircraft upset condition, a military pilot who has been through extensive training in acrobatics or your "typical" regional captain (3407dude)?

Hmmmm.....

"Acrobatics involves difficult feats of balance, agility and motor coordination. Nearly any performance or sport which involves full-body activity-- especially in short, highly controlled bursts of activity-- can be considered acrobatics. Typical examples are, first and foremost, all the subdivisions of gymnastics and trapeze work, but specialized activities like ballet and diving could also be included. In a narrow sense, the term "acrobatics" refers to "acrobatic gymnastics," a specialized subdivision of gymnastics."


I'll take the military pilot that specializes in trapeze work and ballet...

 

[yoborracho]

ethical?

how about you guys not flying for MIDWEST pilots at 50% rates.

and expressjet and every other carrier chicktaqua has cherrypicked.