Bombardier to sell 120 planes to NETJETS???

[bluepost]

That is a big slap in the face from you guys to Gulfstream. I agree that Gulfstream makes a way better product, but I can't see how Gulfstream would not give a counter offer for the G650 over the Global 7000 and 8000? They may be cheaper, but the operating costs will be higher. You guys have the largest "G" fleet in the world, and to add the G650 would save costs in terms of training and maintenance since you are already set up for it, now to add a whole new fleet to your mix will cost big time. I don't see the logic....

This will eliminate the Falcons and possibly the G200, along with the GIV and G450/550/V. They will be consolidating fleets, which in the long run will save them money.

That being said, I would of rather that we stay with Gulfstream. No matter how good of a car Acura makes, even though it may be better is several key areas, it will never be a Mercedes.

 

[NJA Capt]

Santulli cancelled a bunch of Cessna orders and switched to Raytheon products when cessna started Citation Shares, didn't he?

Not true.

CS was started in 2000. Cessna execs sought Santulli's opinions before starting CS and Santulli "welcomed the competition."

During the early years of CS, NetJets was still ordering Bravos/Encores/XL/Sovereigns. The CJ3/Beechjet debacle was in 2004. NetJets made a $1Billion Cessna order in 2007.

 

[BoilerUP]

Other than having an even more diverse long-haul fleet for a short term, I think this is actually a pretty smart move for both Bombardier & NJA.

I'd bet Bombardier gave a steep discount to NJA to secure a sizable fleet order, and they get a massive operator with substantial financial means to help "break in" their new types once they come online. NJA can absorb new aircraft teething pains/maintenance issues in a way your average 91 operator simply cannot simply due to scale, and Bombardier can work out the kinks before private deliveries really start en masse.

Still very surprising to see NJA move away from Gulfstream, but its becoming increasingly clear with this and the Embraer order that price point relative to performance matters a LOT.

 

[exagony]

Flexjet seems to have lots of managers and no leaders at the helm...

 

[jonjuan]

Not true.

CS was started in 2000. Cessna execs sought Santulli's opinions before starting CS and Santulli "welcomed the competition."

During the early years of CS, NetJets was still ordering Bravos/Encores/XL/Sovereigns. The CJ3/Beechjet debacle was in 2004. NetJets made a $1Billion Cessna order in 2007.

his pride cost him his job and brk millions. He could have bought the challenger 300 and put flexjet out of business. pride got the best of him. he cant be dumb enough to think the beechjet would be better for the customers than the cj3. he figured he would buy a ton of crap for cheap and the owners or pilots wouldnt care. pride cost employees jobs as well.

 

[jonjuan]

Flexjet seems to have lots of managers and no leaders at the helm...

interesting how a big bank account translates to "better management." remember, if nja was not backed by buffet and its cheap money, they would be out of business (buffett or sokol recently said this). the big bank account also translates to more government subsidies.

 

[Pervis]

Not true.

CS was started in 2000. Cessna execs sought Santulli's opinions before starting CS and Santulli "welcomed the competition."

During the early years of CS, NetJets was still ordering Bravos/Encores/XL/Sovereigns. The CJ3/Beechjet debacle was in 2004. NetJets made a $1Billion Cessna order in 2007.

The tipping point was when CS introduced the CE680. Prior to that Cessna promised RTS they wouldn't compete directly, and keep it in their short range nitch. Anyone who has any experience around him knows this triggered a typical "Italian" reaction. Unfortunately, decisions based almost purely on emotion typically backfire.

 

[ArtVandalay]

Here's how it went down:

Sokol: We really prefer Gulfstreams sorry.
Pierre: Ok, how about this: we sell you 120 of these things and we'll throw in Flexjet for free??

 

[exagony]

interesting how a big bank account translates to "better management." remember, if nja was not backed by buffet and its cheap money, they would be out of business (buffett or sokol recently said this). the big bank account also translates to more government subsidies.

Well they (NJ) are selling airplanes/shares and Flexjet isn't... if you refuse to offer the product, you can't sell it can you?

 

[jtf]

They announced a specially designed crew rest area on the Globals- maybe they included a seat for a full time mechanic. I believe that the Gulfstreams are more reliable and the reliability issues may cost us some owners. At the same time, there aren't any other fractional options for large cabin aircraft so the vast majority of owners who need it are going to have to make the change unless they can afford to lease or own a Gulfstream outright (I do foresee a hunk of the Gulfstreams going over to EJM with current owners, but how big that hunk is can't really be foreseen now).

As far as the Globals replacing the Falcon and G-200, I don't see it. The Global 5000, even after a deep discount, has to be more than 5 million more than the 2000LX and I'm sure it's operating costs are also significantly more. NJA has around 40 2000 classics and EZ that are very well loved by the customers with the huge cabin and flight attendant service and I just can't imagine NJA "saving money" with consolidation if you lose a big hunk of customers because you didn't give them a reasonable option to be consolidated into. Maybe Flex will eat up those customers and get a bunch more 605s. I guess we will have to wait for the dust to settle before we see where this is all really heading.

I also don't see this as a nail in the coffin for Flex. No way will NJA be taking on all the smaller airframes and customers. This just precludes Flex from getting their foot in the door for large cabins. Flex will continue on doing what they do and this order in no way will be hammering them out of business.