Best crosswind technique for light aircraft???

[Fearless Tower]

Do you mean fighter ? I'd like to know which ones use this on a normal basis.

He's probably talking about the B-52....no nose gear and the mains all pivot. In the BUFF you can land in a crab with zero side load on the gear.

 

[bubbers44]

Learn in a taildragger then you will never ever land in a crab again. #3 works from everything from a J3 cub to a B767 every time. Ground looping is kind of fun but very expensive.

 

[RefugePilot]

I think the question is as much as, how do you teach crosswind, as what technique do you use.

The feel and technique for crosswind landings takes a while to develop. I have very little faith in a student to kick out the crab and transition into the slip at the last moment, so I do not teach it, and have to be very carefull not to do it when a student is in the planew with me. So I have the student start the transition to a slip at 100 feet AGL. Once they show they have got it they can start the side slip lower and lower. I like to see the transition to start no later than the roundout. That way I can help out with the controls or initiate a go-around if the slip does not look to be working out.

As far as teaching how to control the slip, let your instructor take the throttle and give enough power to keep you in ground effect. You can float the entire length of the runway adjusting the controls and playing with the slip. As you get good you can take out and add power and bounce the upwind wheel off the runway during the low pass. Then landing in the crosswind becomes easy.

As far as crosswind busting techniques, my favorite is to land the airplane on the runway sideways. If you are in a C152 that stalls at 35KIAS, the wind is blowing 30 across the 150 foot wide runway, well you get the picture. No I have never tried it but would like to.

 

[Fugawe]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fugawe
Best crosswind technique for light aircraft???
1. Slip all the way down final approach and land on the runway.

2. Crab all the way down final, over the runway, and kick rudder at the last second.

3. Crab all the way down final, but then transition to a slip and land upwind main first on the runway.

............4. Land in a crab ........ouch. You do this in fast-mover military types, but it's quite uncomfortable and dangerous in civilian stuff.

Fugawe


Do you mean fighter ? I'd like to know which ones use this on a normal basis.


Any high-swept fighter-type jet lands in a crab (unless things have changed a lot). I flew the F-15, F-16, and T-38.....all touchdown in a crab. Can't remember the max x-wind limits, but 25 knots for the F-15 comes to mind.

It's a helluva jolt, and you wonder if the gear can handle it sometimes, but it is what it is. Upon touchdown, you quickly get the nose straight and maybe a little aileron into the wind if necessary.

Now, you can be a carrier pilot and always land into a direct (or almost direct) hw each time...........

I'm sure some engineers or aero masters will chime in, but here's the simple reason why you land these jets in a crab. The wings are so highly swept that if you attempt to slip on final you can easily blank the downwind wing out with the fuselage -- you'll lose lifties and bad things will happen. There are a couple of other aerodynamic reasons related to sweep, relative wind, and spanwise flow that jog my memory -- but I've long since forgetten the technical jargon. Suffice it to say, you don't screw with the rudder on final. It's a little disconcerting to be staring out the side of the canopy as you touchdown in a big xwind, but you get used to it (kind of).

In the fighter world, you seldom use rudder except in a slow-speed fight to get your nose around either for an aggressive maneuver or a shot. Engine failure on twin engine fighters might be another time, but heck....now they may have a system like the B-777s TAC (thrust asymmetry computer) that puts in rudder automatically for engine failure. (newer or upgraded F-15s, F-18s, F-14s?)

You say you want to know which fighters or fighter-types land like this -- I assume all the high-swept fighters land in a crab -- same aerodynamic profile for the most part. Don't know anything about the F-22, but I imagine it's the same too.

If this has changed I'm sure someone will pipe in. Can't imagine it has. Physics controls it.

Fugawe

 

[Alin10123]

I usually do #3. I will do the crab thing all the way until short final and then i dont even think of it as a slip. I'll think "rudder points the nose down the centerline, and aileron controls drift".

 

[bubbers44]

Teaching crosswind landings is different. I always had them align the longitudinal axis of the plane with the center line and use the side slip to counteract the wind, that way your wheels were rolling with no side load on touchdown and works for any airplane. Landing the MD80 at LAS with a 30 knot crosswind meant having the cockpit over the runway edge lights when the transition to side slip in the flair to land on the center line. No normal airplane should land in a crab. Add 5 or so knots to counteract the loss of lift due to side slip when you flair. B52's probably had compensation for crab landings because they were the fighter pilot drop outs. Maybe it was just all those engines, sorry.

 

[Steve 737]

# 3 works fine in the Airbus.

 

[2Inverted]

Do what works for you and your airplane. But, keep it on the center line and on speed. Do it consistantly and it will become a habit you won't have to analyse everytime you do an approach.

 

[Fugawe]

B52's probably had compensation for crab landings because they were the fighter pilot drop outs. Maybe it was just all those engines, sorry.

Uh-oh.......you're gonna get it now! :smash:


Fugawe

 

[ksu_aviator]

Teaching crosswind landings is different. I always had them align the longitudinal axis of the plane with the center line and use the side slip to counteract the wind, ...

Huh? Let's speak student here. Use the rudder to make the wheels line up with the runway and the ailerons to keep you over the runway. Not that I don't applaud you for knowing all the fancy terms, but you sound like a flipping engineer geek. Students don't speak engineer geek.

 

[Morettis]

The lances we fly have a max demonstrated of 17 knots. Anything under that I usually crab till I'm over the runway about to flair. Over 17 is a slip all the way down to make sure I have rudder athority. When you're landing in a 35Kt direct crosswind, I've found it's best to transition to a full slip, maxing out the rudder & then use ailerons and airspeed to correct for drift. Done it a few times going into PHX. It's a wild ride but it works out well.

 

[~~~^~~~]

I begin my slip over the marker, then on short final I let off of the rudder and use differential thrust combined with aileron trim to grease her on every time. Then I taxi to the gate using only APU thrust.

Ha Ha Ha

On the ATR we pull the flight idle stop and put the upwind engine in beta and set the parking brake.

 

[midlifeflyer]

Huh? Let's speak student here. Use the rudder to make the wheels line up with the runway and the ailerons to keep you over the runway. Not that I don't applaud you for knowing all the fancy terms, but you sound like a flipping engineer geek. Students don't speak engineer geek.

I make it even more personal: "Keep the centerline between you legs with aileron and square to your chest with rudder."