ASA guys, find out the real story

[OCP]

So was this on the 2nd or 3rd? Anyone care to sum it up?

 

[bigshooter107]

Thanks nevets, not being a smart ass at all. It seems the xjet MEC decided to educate their pilot group on the PBS system they think is coming. Problem being is that system is globalized, and the legacy asa MEC voted 9 to 0 against this..Again the legacy asa guys were told the xjet MEC wanted a agreement to keep the contract negotiations on the down low. But for anyone that listened here I think the folks in Houston stepped outside of this.

 

[BigKahuna]

and the legacy asa MEC voted 9 to 0 against this..Again the legacy asa guys were told the xjet MEC wanted a agreement to keep the contract negotiations on the down low.

How does the ASA MEC have a vote in open session about negotiating related topics and keep it on the down low? I'm confused.

 

[Nevets]

Thanks nevets, not being a smart ass at all. It seems the xjet MEC decided to educate their pilot group on the PBS system they think is coming. Problem being is that system is globalized, and the legacy asa MEC voted 9 to 0 against this..Again the legacy asa guys were told the xjet MEC wanted a agreement to keep the contract negotiations on the down low. But for anyone that listened here I think the folks in Houston stepped outside of this.

Ok, maybe I just misinterpreted what was said. If that is the case, then we will just stay separate. Which is probably what the anti-pbs people want anyway. Did you listen in on the call?

 

[Pilot Hopeful]

Problem being is that system is globalized, and the legacy asa MEC voted 9 to 0 against this.

Globalization can be a good thing, as long as it honors seniority. To date, it sounds like most PBS systems with globalization have NOT honored seniority but rather conformed to the needs of the company. I have a hard time thinking that the MEC would propose SmartPref unless the globalization feature honors seniority. The real-time bidding feature sounds like an industry-leading concept.

 

[777forever]

Globalization can be a good thing, as long as it honors seniority. To date, it sounds like most PBS systems with globalization have NOT honored seniority but rather conformed to the needs of the company. I have a hard time thinking that the MEC would propose SmartPref unless the globalization feature honors seniority. The real-time bidding feature sounds like an industry-leading concept.

We just can't say it's globalized with seeing the TA and the work rules that have been implemented. As anti PBS as XJT is I doubt they would go with a poor PBS system. Let's just wait in the TA and the roadshows to see a real comparison to Flica

 

[Pilot Hopeful]

We just can't say it's globalized with seeing the TA and the work rules that have been implemented. As anti PBS as XJT is I doubt they would go with a poor PBS system. Let's just wait in the TA and the roadshows to see a real comparison to Flica

Agree

 

[79%N1]

I'll tell you one thing. Vacation low will be a goner in the new contract. I believe the company will allow it, but if you choose to maximize your days off, you will not get a 75 hr min. Probably something where you get paid what you credit - and no add pay. How does everyone feel about this? From their perspective, you can have the days off, or the pay. Not both.

 

[777forever]

I'll tell you one thing. Vacation low will be a goner in the new contract. I believe the company will allow it, but if you choose to maximize your days off, you will not get a 75 hr min. Probably something where you get paid what you credit - and no add pay. How does everyone feel about this? From their perspective, you can have the days off, or the pay. Not both.

Depends on the overall JCBA package. Has to be some serious improvements elsewhere...

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk

 

[Redan]

I'll tell you one thing. Vacation low will be a goner in the new contract. I believe the company will allow it, but if you choose to maximize your days off, you will not get a 75 hr min. Probably something where you get paid what you credit - and no add pay. How does everyone feel about this? From their perspective, you can have the days off, or the pay. Not both.

Well what I think is: Vacation Low was a feature used to address the pilot group's concerns regarding not being able to maximize vacation under a PBS system. Was crucial to gaining support for the PBS system the company was aggressively pushing for. And they had over a year to analyze the feature. Now following implementation they have decided they don't like it and want to modify. And our elected representatives who were solidly against changing it a matter of months ago, are now singing a different song. Additionally, as we experience the constant exploitation of loopholes company discovers in virtually every aspect of the contract, here's about the only instance I can think of where it actually worked in the pilot group's favor. And we're apparently considering conceding. Killer.

 

[outtahere]

Without vacation low, PBS is doomed at ASA/XJET. That was the only reason it passed the first time here and the only way it stays. The XJET guys have a great vacation system right now and if they try to snatch away any time or money from vacation, they alone will vote it down. I love PBS, simple as that. Its awesome that I can tailor my schedule to my needs for the month, however, vacation low is essential to moving forward.

 

[enuffalready]

Well what I think is: Vacation Low was a feature used to address the pilot group's concerns regarding not being able to maximize vacation under a PBS system. Was crucial to gaining support for the PBS system the company was aggressively pushing for. And they had over a year to analyze the feature. Now following implementation they have decided they don't like it and want to modify. And our elected representatives who were solidly against changing it a matter of months ago, are now singing a different song. Additionally, as we experience the constant exploitation of loopholes company discovers in virtually every aspect of the contract, here's about the only instance I can think of where it actually worked in the pilot group's favor. And we're apparently considering conceding. Killer.

Exactly right... and don't think for a second that wasn't by design by company... they knew it was the ONLY way to get a TA... then as soon as it is implemented they make up some BS about how they didn't know, etc..... come on... they knew EXACTLY what would happen.. priced it in and then once PBS was implemented they cry losses, etc...

and now there is talk of giving it away in addition to this smartpref non sense.. that makes no sense ...... rather than tweak as system that make 98% of the ASA people happy we should trash it for the devil we don't know

 

[Nevets]

and now there is talk of giving it away in addition to this smartpref non sense.. that makes no sense ...... rather than tweak as system that make 98% of the ASA people happy we should trash it for the devil we don't know

This is how many on the ERJ side feel. Tweak the line bidding system that makes 98% of the ERJ side happy instead of trashing it for a devil we don't know. I give credit to the ERJ MEC for being open minded enough to look at PBS and see if there is one out there that could provide at least the same QOL as we have now. It's obvious that they feel smartpref can. Has the CRJ MEC done the same?

 

[Redan]

Another factor for me is our schedules.
As our lines and pairings become more and more
difficult and less predictable while company manipulates
the credit thresholds at will, the vacation low
is about the only thing keeping us sane. Unless you're
on reserve of course.

 

[79%N1]

Agree with all of you (except for maybe Nevets : ))

Also hear the same is true of the erj line bidding. They would want it more like the old ASA system where you can drop touching trips, but not get paid for the lost block - and no add pay. Just fwiw. Not endorsing any system.

 

[gator_hater]

Would it be a huge disadvantage to move the vac low to say 70 hours instead of 65?

 

[asa rat]

I'll tell you one thing. Vacation low will be a goner in the new contract. I believe the company will allow it, but if you choose to maximize your days off, you will not get a 75 hr min. Probably something where you get paid what you credit - and no add pay. How does everyone feel about this? From their perspective, you can have the days off, or the pay. Not both.

Depends on what the company is willing to "give up" in order to get it.
Isn't that what they try to tell us?

 

[ASApuppy]

Why are any of us in the mindset that we need to give something up?

NEWSFLASH! ASA/Expessjet has no resumes on file! Ask the training dept guys who review them if you doubt me. Management is feeling the pressure to make this a more attractive place to work. For the first time, SH is most likely wanting to find ways to actually keep people.

Fix reserve, vacation low stays, expand ease of swaps, wages up. Talk to DAL and UAL on how to pay for it out of their billions in bag money.

No Concessions!

 

[79%N1]

Not disagreeing with you.....but, management seems to be willing to die on that hill, and it looks like they are moving to that pay or days off format in the neg's. Usually, if we do have to give in somewhere, we get better somewhere else.

I do challenge your assertion there are no resumes on file. I see guys interviewing all the time over there. Now, when the reg change takes effect they are going to have trouble finding people then. I believe our regional companies will just be 'right sized' along with the decrease in labor force. Massive 50 seat retirements in the coming years will require far less pilots than there are, even today.

 

[Oakum_Boy]

If a TA is presented and approved with some new globalized PBS with no vacation low option, I'm outta here. 15 years in and they just keep coming for the stuff that makes life almost tolerable. Attrition is only going to increase and no one wants to work for junk stagnant wages after financing an ATP and 1500 hours of instructing.