ASA/expressjet & skywest

[buscap]

Anyone at ASA who thinks PBS is not a concession is fooling themselves. It is however, a smart concession which I voted for. I believe it will give me more schedue flexibility, is a a better way to bid schedules, and it will make the company more competetive. It is a concession in some ways, the biggest being the loss of our ability to maximize vacation and still get paid. We can maximize, but not like their contract.

Express jet has us beat there, and are loathe to give that up. They are married to that one issue on PBS and I can't blame them.

As far as the three-way one list matter, I can't blame them. That language was fought for and written with this very situation in mind. I think it is a shame that we would willingly be used as a way to circumnavigate the contract of another ALPA carrier. We have experienced first hand the whipsaw, albiet mild by some standards, which can be brought to bear.

Being just another disposable lift provider within the DCI portfolio is bad enough. Surely we can all see the advantage of one list within Skyest Inc, thus avoiding just being another disposable lift provider within the Skywest portfolio. And worse yet, post merger we will be a large 50-seat-heavy lift provider in need of fat trimming once the dust settles.

Better to let that fat be trimmed from a single list carrier than just us and Express. It's that simple.

 

[Nevets]

Why didn't it start when you voted in concessions that even you admit didn't make a difference. How exactly do we have the ability in your opinion.



Here is a huge difference between many on your list and many of the senior ASA pilots. We have a much higher percentage of "lifers" as does Skywest. Those of us who are "lifers" won't agree with you here. We already consider ASA a career job, and would like it to grow in size. It is clear by looking at your list, that most took the flowthrough....Not saying that going on is wrong...For many it is the right thing to do IF the opportunity presents itself. However for many at the top at ASA, moving on doesn't make sense. You are going to have understand that if we are going to work together.



I complain about people like you who take unnecessary concessions, then lecture a group who hasn't taken concessions about "bringing down the profession".

I'm glad my parent corporation has 800 MILLION in the bank so that it can be the buyer rather than the buyee....If XJET had been as good a corporation as Skywest Inc. is, we probably wouldn't be debating this...Something to think about.

Our concessions were contingent on all labor groups, employees, and management taking the same pay cut. Like I said, it was a philosophical argument. Some didn't want to take concessions but they were no in the majority or were non union and didn't get a vote. But even despite our concessions our pay rates are still industry leading and therefore many people felt that at least we were not dragging the profession down. I feel we have leverage in jcba. Inc definitely wants this really badly. That is called leverage. As for large RJs I understand your point of view and just disagree but I never said I don't want my company to grow. This is not an ego thing for me, it's about the profession and being treated fairly, equitably, and with respect for our contract and it's covered employees. I don't mind being bought even if we still had $300M in the bank. I'm not against buying of being bought. I'm against blatant disregard for the pilots contract.

 

[mightyM]

Anyone at ASA who thinks PBS is not a concession is fooling themselves. It is however, a smart concession which I voted for. I believe it will give me more schedue flexibility, is a a better way to bid schedules, and it will make the company more competetive. It is a concession in some ways, the biggest being the loss of our ability to maximize vacation and still get paid. We can maximize, but not like their contract.

Express jet has us beat there, and are loathe to give that up. They are married to that one issue on PBS and I can't blame them.

As far as the three-way one list matter, I can't blame them. That language was fought for and written with this very situation in mind. I think it is a shame that we would willingly be used as a way to circumnavigate the contract of another ALPA carrier. We have experienced first hand the whipsaw, albiet mild by some standards, which can be brought to bear.


Being just another disposable lift provider within the DCI portfolio is bad enough. Surely we can all see the advantage of one list within Skyest Inc, thus avoiding just being another disposable lift provider within the Skywest portfolio. And worse yet, post merger we will be a large 50-seat-heavy lift provider in need of fat trimming once the dust settles.

Better to let that fat be trimmed from a single list carrier than just us and Express. It's that simple.

I agree. If the majority of express jet pilots want to uphold their merger policy (which I don't see why they wouldn't ) they have that right. We need to push for a one list between all 3 companies.

Nevets, don't be fooled by some of these senior ASA folks. They're just looking out for themselves.

JA wants this deal, we have to fight for what's right.

 

[79%N1]

Drop the 3 way merger.....It is NOT going to happen. If that is the sticking issue and XJ can uphold it in court if they so choose, the deal is off. That may be the best thing for all parties.

 

[cybourg10]

Drop the 3 way merger.....It is NOT going to happen. If that is the sticking issue and XJ can uphold it in court if they so choose, the deal is off. That may be the best thing for all parties.

Here is how I see it playing out: Of course XJT ALPA is going to get advice from our legal counsel and maybe even take it to arbitration but I doubt that the SkyWest, Inc. lawyers and management went through with this without knowing full well that they got around our scope. The guys that wrote our contract back in 03/04 were very smart guys (most at CAL now) but even the best written contracts tend to have a few loopholes here and there and it wouldn't surprise me that they found one (by making ASA a holding company).

So after the expedited arbitration is over with we can then start to work on our new JCBA and SLI. I think we will have great leverage to improve a lot of things for both groups and improve or get rid of PBS depending on how it works for you guys over the next few months. I personally don't care about joining the three groups as long as we can get some strong language (ironic I know) in section 1 that does not allow Inc to take our planes and even guarantees the ASA side of growth. Down the line if the SkyWest guys want to join the team and vote in ALPA great, but if not then that is their problem. ASA will be more competitive than SKW after this merger anyway and our future looks bright. So in the end I see SKYW flying out west and ASA getting the east side and both companies should have growth opportunities which is what we all really want. So for now we wait and see what route our MEC takes but I hope we don't get too bogged down in this legal battle and miss our opportunity to get a great contract.

 

[Nevets]

I don't know what was said in your MEC meeting, but PBS isn't necessarily a concession. It's a 4% savings to the company, that much I agree. But what if a pilot group was able to shape the PBS language into a way that benefited them while still saving the company money? And what if that same pilot group shared in half of the savings to the company resulting in increased pay, benefits, and work rules? Is that still a concession?

Well, I told you what he said. But you are right. I'm not necesarily against PBS. As long as it pay and qol neutral.

 

[COEX-FO]

Here is how I see it playing out: Of course XJT ALPA is going to get advice from our legal counsel and maybe even take it to arbitration but I doubt that the SkyWest, Inc. lawyers and management went through with this without knowing full well that they got around our scope. The guys that wrote our contract back in 03/04 were very smart guys (most at CAL now) but even the best written contracts tend to have a few loopholes here and there and it wouldn't surprise me that they found one (by making ASA a holding company).

I'm about 101% sure you are absolutely correct in your statement above!

One HUGE difference between this time and 2 years ago is the XJT stock price! Upon this announcement, the stock doubled in value! There is a lot of money at stake here and many will stand to gain millions; and with a very few exceptions none are on either seniority list!

The money will prevail over the arguments of ALPA and the scope language. Just my opinion.

 

[johnpeace]

Why did XJT take concessions?

..or get sold?

 

[Nevets]

Drop the 3 way merger.....It is NOT going to happen. If that is the sticking issue and XJ can uphold it in court if they so choose, the deal is off. That may be the best thing for all parties.

That's ok with me. For me personally after seeing for myself the Inc whipsaw, I rather stay independent of skw than to let this blatant disrespect for our pilots and contract go without trying to uphold it. It's too bad JA is making everyone lawyer up over this.

 

[buscap]

Drop the 3 way merger.....It is NOT going to happen. If that is the sticking issue and XJ can uphold it in court if they so choose, the deal is off. That may be the best thing for all parties.

The three way may very well be dropped, but at what price? Dropping it needs to be properly paid for, or the Express guys have every right to kill this deal and come what may.

It's their contract and choice, not the ASA pilot's. We may just have to get to be a "super regional" the old fashioned way.