Are You An Asa Pilot Or A Ramp Instructor?

[av8tor4239]

Here is the MEMO: PLEASE READ THE WHOLE THING.. YOU WONT BELIEVE WHAT YOU ARE READING...

I HAVE HIGHLIGHTED SOME OF THE POINTS THAT MADE MY JAW DROP... COMMENTS TO FOLLOW...

PEOPLE, PLEASE COMMENT... IF YOU SUPPORT THIS PROGRAM I AM SURE YOU HAVE NOT READ THE WHOLE "JOURNEY TO EXCELLECE"

(i have to edit some of it otherwise it wont fit on one post)

Journey to Excellence​

Journey to Excellence is a new and exciting program that contributes to the continuation of the learning process for our Company’s Airport Operations division’s leaders. During their Journey to Excellence, they are given an opportunity to observe portions of the overall operation outside of their own that directly affect their work group. As a member of management, the observations will give the team member invaluable insight that will enable them to make better decisions for their specific work groups and the ‘know how’ regarding how to best assist you during our daily operation.


While our leaders are encouraged to explore their curiosity during these journeys, each journey has a guided path which includes a ‘Journey Guide’ and set expectations regarding professional courtesy “do’s and do not’s” while visiting.


The Journey Guide contains questions or instructions that the team member will have to complete while at location that will ensure that the team member becomes aware of the position’s functions and their role with this function. These are the type of questions that you can expect:

• Why are pilots so inflexible on pushback phraseology?
• Why is having an operable headset such a big deal for pushback?
• Why do call backs for fuel happen when all they want added is a couple of hundred pounds?
• Why do bag counts and CLRs have to be so exact? What could it possibly hurt to add a few bags after the paperwork is complete?
• What type of impact does parking an aircraft with a Wing Walker using only one wand have on a Pilot?
• Why can we haul more bags to New York than Chattanooga?
• Why does adding a jumpseat rider have such an effect on loading?
• What about hauling eyes, blood, or human organs in small packages in the cockpit?
• What is going on sometimes when there is such a long delay between tow bar disconnect and the signal releasing the crew?
• Why does the CRJ need three pieces of ground equipment when the APU is inoperative?
• Why is the CRJ 200 AC & DC external power, the CRJ 700 AC only, and the ATR both AC & DC?
• What problems are associated with a kinked air hose from a bottle or huffer?
• Why does the CRJ 200 usually park and taxi with the flaps extended?

While visiting you within the flight deck, our leaders are given the following professional courtesy guidelines (“do’s and do not’s”):

• Be professional! Look sharp and act sharp. The level of professionalism you demonstrate is proportional to the way you are viewed and treated by your coworkers. The impression you make reflects upon your entire team.
• If specific dress guidelines exist other than business casual exist, as outlined in SP 210, they will be found in the Journey Passport.
• Arrive on time
• Be courteous and respectful of those whose destination that you are within. Remember, you are a guest.
• Stay aware of your surroundings. The environment that you are visiting may be very different from your own and additional hazards may exist. Always follow the instructions of the individual that you are visiting, for your safety, theirs, and others.
• Always wear hearing protection when you are in a ramp area.
• Journey to the ASA Flight Deck may be done on domestic flights ONLY.
• Journey may only be taken on flights with an available cabin seat.
• During the journey, all crewmembers’ instructions must be followed.
• Stay close to the crew and pay attention to your surroundings.
• When in locations other than for which you have a SIDA badge, or you have no SIDA badge, you may not access AOA without being escorted by an individual who has escorting rights (local team members with the appropriate badges) at that location.
• Exercise patience with your Crew and team members servicing the aircraft. They all have a job to do and time is critical.
• You may be asked to take a seat in the cabin for a short time upon initial entry to the aircraft. The area around the aircraft entry door and galley is very busy and the door way to the flight deck is very confined. It may take the two pilots several minutes and a couple of trips in and out to get their flight kits and before their equipment is situated. The jumpseat where you will sit completely blocks the door to the flight deck. The pilots will need to be in place before you enter the flight deck and the jumpseat set up behind you. While waiting in a cabin seat to enter the flight deck, this is an excellent opportunity to observe our team members perform the numerous operations that few people are aware happen for every flight. Cleaners, caterers, flight attendants stowing supplies and conducting their pre-flight duties, mechanics, fuelers, all with the common goal of getting the flight out on time.
• Follow all requirements given during your “Jumpseat Briefing” that will be given to you by the Captain once you are in the flight deck. The jumpseat briefing is required by the Federal Aviation Regulations and contains some very important information. The major items are listed here

Do complete a thorough jumpseat briefing. This is not your normal jumpseat occupant, not a pilot, or a mechanic, and probably has never seen this before.
If our leader does not follow the professional courtesy guidelines or you have other concerns, please contact (Flight Deck Main POC) at first opportunity.


Additionally, please use the following points as topics to cover or demonstrate to your visitor during their journey with you:

• Remember that this is someone not used to a cockpit and may have little or no flight experience, no knowledge of regulations, cockpit protocol, or any idea of what to expect.
• Be prepared for a case of air sickness, have a bag handy.
• Cover normal cockpit warnings, flashing lights, aural alerts, TCAS, GPWS, radar, etc. Things you are used to may be quite un-nerving for the visitor. Chances are this person has never flown in a cockpit before.
• Point out how limited the view of the ground crew is from the cockpit and just how little of the tug you can see. If possible, if time and circumstances permit between flights with no passengers on board, let the visitor sit in a pilot seat and get a good look from your normal viewpoint.
• Explain pushback procedures and safety issues.
• Fully explain the audio panel and headset. You want them to hear ATC and company. Volume control is important.
• Show them the taxi chart and briefly explain how the flight will get to which runway. Maybe a little on why we single engine taxi. If time permits give an overview of the RNAV procedure and what to expect in terms of seeing other aircraft, parallel departures, and arrival aircraft overhead. Be sure to cover TCAS alerts and that they are normal.
• In cruise, as time permits, give the visitor a tour of your office in operation. Point out the vast amount of data and information available. FMS, radar, TCAS, synoptic pages, FMS capabilities for finding airports, etc.
• Give them an overview of the destination arrival, approach, and any special points on the landing.
• Have them listen to the in-range call and all company communications so they can see both sides of the process. Show the process for calculating a max load and why getting the release with the performance and fuel numbers as soon as possible helps you and saves time for everyone.
• Brief the visitor on the time available at the outstation, a quick lavatory visit before the boarding process. The “walk around”, ATIS, clearance, paperwork, and all the steps that must be completed to get out on time.
• Answer any questions the visitor has and, if you are not sure of the answer, look it up or tell them to call the Main POC, or get a contact number to pass along to the Main POC so that they can get back to them.
• Ask questions about issues you have in your perception of their jobs and other team units. Remember a lot is changing and improvements are under way.

MY COMMENTS ON THE NEXT POST.......

 

[bssthound]

My first basset hound would bark excitedly when he saw a dog on TV. He'd even go around behind the TV to see where the dog went. Other than that, I don't know how much of the show he understood.

 

[wmuflyguy]

Remember that this is someone not used to a cockpit and may have little or no flight experience, no knowledge of regulations, cockpit protocol, or any idea of what to expect.

They don't have any business up there if they don't know "basic protocol".

I once had a Dispatcher on the jumpseat and we were shooting an approach to minimums and about 50 feet above DH, he leans over and sayd "So how high are we above the ground?". I thought the Captain was going to slap him.

The motion sickness thing is priceless.

 

[crjskipper]

already being discussed, or should i say whined about

 

[Papa Woody]

Bad idea.

Very distracting to the crew, and little will be learned by the trainee while they are awed by the whole cockpit environment as non-pilots.

An ill-conceived gimmick.

 

[Papa Woody]

Take a 2-hour delay to go over all the stuff in the memo.

 

[180ToTheMarker]

I can see it now....NTSB probable cause: Flightcrew distracted by chunk-blowing ramper while shoooting approach to mins...

 

[av8tor4239]

As a former Ramper and current pilot, I can say for 100% certainty that there is absolutly no reason in HELL that a ramp supervisor or any ground personel needs be taught as the memo suggest we do:
*RNAV procedure
*parallel departure
*CAS alerts
*FMS
*radar
*synoptic pages
*Arrival procedures
*Approach Procedures

If Mr H wants these people to know how all this "MAGIC" stuff happens, they can sit in on a systems class and then sit in the SIMULATOR with ASA Instructors that are Paid to teach....

IF ASA WANTS TO GIVE ME CURRENT INSTRUCTOR PAY WHICH IS: A 95 HOUR GUARANTEE PLUS PREMIUM AT 70 RATE, THEN AND ONLY THEN WOULD I CONSIDER THIS HORIBLE PROPOSAL.

You have to be kidding me.. our VP of flight ops has written a memo that TELLS me to "be prepared for airsickness and have a bag handy" in case the rameper pukes on you while you are flying a Transport catagory aircraft for a part 121 carrier during a revenue leg with passengers in possible $#!tty weather with god know what else that could happen mechanicaly.... HOLY $#!T Now our VP of flight ops is telling me that I have to be prepared to be puked on by a ramper.......

OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHH

 

[WMUSIGPI]

just make sure you get your out time first so at least you can get paid for playing flight instructor again.

 

[John Pennekamp]

This is an incredibly stupid idea. I have better things to do than play 20 questions with a redcoat on my jumpseat so that she can go write me up for something I didn't do properly when we get back.

I'd also rather NOT have the gate, ramp, and redcoats knowing that much about what we do. They already try to second guess our decisions, and this experience will give them just enough information to be dangerous. Next time you give them a max, it'll be "well, wenn I was on 'yo jumpseat I observed that yous took mo fuel than wuz on yo release. Why caint yo take less and git my people on?" No thanks!

 

[Flyer1015]

There is a 121 ATP written exam question, that goes something like:

The Pilot in Command may exclude anyone from the cockpit.

A. [wrong answer choice]
B. In the interest of safety
C. [wrong answer choice]


It's like drugs, or sex with a hooker who has the herpes.... just say NO!

 

[av8tor4239]

ALPA safety should jump on this one like white on rice, like a pig in $#!t, like a fly on poop....

How long till the FEDS find out about this crap

 

[AMANSWORLD]

As a former Ramper and current pilot, I can say for 100% certainty that there is absolutly no reason in HELL that a ramp supervisor or any ground personel needs be taught as the memo suggest we do:
*RNAV procedure
*parallel departure
*CAS alerts
*FMS
*radar
*synoptic pages
*Arrival procedures
*Approach Procedures

If Mr H wants these people to know how all this "MAGIC" stuff happens, they can sit in on a systems class and then sit in the SIMULATOR with ASA Instructors that are Paid to teach....

IF ASA WANTS TO GIVE ME CURRENT INSTRUCTOR PAY WHICH IS: A 95 HOUR GUARANTEE PLUS PREMIUM AT 70 RATE, THEN AND ONLY THEN WOULD I CONSIDER THIS HORIBLE PROPOSAL.

You have to be kidding me.. our VP of flight ops has written a memo that TELLS me to "be prepared for airsickness and have a bag handy" in case the rameper pukes on you while you are flying a Transport catagory aircraft for a part 121 carrier during a revenue leg with passengers in possible $#!tty weather with god know what else that could happen mechanicaly.... HOLY $#!T Now our VP of flight ops is telling me that I have to be prepared to be puked on by a ramper.......

OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHH

ASA management wants us to start recruiting new pilots from the ramp. F!@king priceless. This program is ridiculous as our lack of management. Cannot believe the FAA would actually agree to this.

 

[Fly4hire]

What Airline?

 

[AMANSWORLD]

What Airline?

ASA just plays an airline on TV. We are a joke of a company due to piss poor management from Skywest and previous Delta employees.

 

[av8tor4239]

Senerio:

Thunderstom, night, moderate turbulence, full load of PAX, 13th hour of being on duty, last turn of a 4 day trip, approach to CAT 1 minimums, you are about 50 miles out and the engine catches fire. You run your checklist and are setting up for the approach.. Over the marker you are being pelted by HEAVY rain.... you drop the gear and the Ramper in the Jumpseat SCREAMS what was that and begins to cry out of fear for his/her life...... Then just as you are getting ready to kick of the auto-pilot, the ramper VOMITS all over the controls, all over you, and all over instruments... PROJECTILE VOMIT.... you execute missed approach because the distraction from the chunks of the Quiznos sub on your PFD caused you to go full deflection off the localizer... Now you are flying right into a blotch of red orange crap on the radar screen.. but you second guess yourself becasuse that red orange blotch might actually be part of the half digested tomato from the rampers puke stuck to your MFD....

Did I mention you are on your 13th hour.. Last day of a 4 day... oh and you have a sinus infection and were afraid to call in becasue you are on your 3rd occurance for being sick in 12 months, and you dont want to get called into the chief pilots office and get a letter in your company file and possibly fired for being sick more than 4 times in a year...

Get the picture?

 

["GO AROUND"]

So who is able to do this? Just supervisors and up? Or can any schmo from the ramp or gate ride? Are they getting any formal training from the company/training dept?

All I know is they will not ride in my JS if they don't know the do's and dont's backwards and frontwards. The company better be teaching them how to do all these things that are required of a JS'er. It's one thing to brief a qualified pilot on our JS but to teach a non pilot all the things about riding the JS is Bull********************. Our dispatchers are barely qualified to ride the JS in my opinion and now this. I doubt these operations leaders are qualified.

The safety issues are endless in these situations so I don't see it happening on my JS. If they come to my plane without a briefing first then there are too many things to talk about and not enough time. We would have to be at the plane over an hour early to get all this done and we all know that is not going to happen.

Good intentions, BAD implimentation.

 

[atlcrjdriver]

AV8, as has been said many times in the other post, RELAX. As stated in the first paragraph, these are ramp and gate managers. They will not be your average gate/ramp agents out for a joy ride. The letter is simply to advise you of who will be in the js and what to expect.

Just extend them your a professional courtesy, fly the contract and move on.

 

[av8tor4239]

Good intentions?.. .there are a million ways to play warm and fuzzy between the rampers and the pilots.. THIS IS NOT THE RIGHT INTENTION OR IMPLIMENTATION.

Even worse is that our VP of flight ops told us in a memo to be ready to get puked on, and to have a puke bag ready...

 

[av8tor4239]

atlcrjdriver...

I am just floored that this has been suggested by our management team... the cons totally out weigh the pros..

And a ramp supervisor is a ramper that is paid an extra $1.00 per hour... Thats all