Anybody have briefers giving wrong info?

[Metro752]

bk hq BY MIA, mmmmmmmm I am MAN!

 

[kf4amu]

You obviously have internet access, because you can cruise sites like these, so do you get the daily aviation news briefs from sites like www.aero-news.net, or www.avflash.com? Have you ever used www.airnav.com? Lots of valuable information there. As the PIC, you are responsible to have all available information to your route of flight and destination. Ignorance is not an excuse.

Your profile says that you have a commercial licence. Your comments and demeanor indicate otherwise. Do me a favor, and don't do turns about a point using a cooling tower at a nuclear power plant as your reference point.

If you are not a member of AOPA, I strongly encourage you to invest the $39/year to join. If you don't learn anything, maybe the staff of lawyers can keep you out of jail with airspace violations.

If your instructor told you that all you need to do is contact FSS for pre-flight briefings, he's deficient in his teaching methods and needs to refund your ground school money.

1. No I dont get daily aviation news briefs, I dont fly enough to care enough to remember what I would read anyway.

2. Ignorance is no excuse, but inability to get the information is a great one. I'd say that querying the briefer about the exact status of an TFR affected airport is the best and safest way to get the CORRECT information. I appreciate the links and I'll check them out. But you may rely on private websites like that but how much sense does it make for the govt to require pilots to get TFR information from unofficial sources? Keep relying on those unofficial sources if you want. I'm looking for the single official place that knows what they're talking about. Up to now, I thought that was the FSS briefers and NOTAMS.

3. Nice jab with the nuclear reference. Moron. Next time someone asks for advice keep your mouth shut lest you discourage them from asking questions in the future. People like you indirectly encourage others not to ask questions. You act exactly like the pilots at Riddle everyone hates, with the "I'm better than you" attitude.

4. I dont get your point, should my instructor have told me to go to Airnav.com or the other sites you listed to get accurate TFR info? If you rely on unofficial "for-profit" websites that have no legal requirement to provide correct, updated information, then you are more of a danger for airspace violations than myself. I was told, and have been told, that the controlling agency and FSS would know of any airspace activations and TFR's.

Of all the sites you listed, I'm surprised you didnt say AOPA...that would be more reliable since they are such advocates of avoiding restricted airspace. I could have checked the AOPA website, but the FBO did not have internet, and I didnt have my AOPA card with me to log in anyway.

I just don't get it, in the past and still today, the legal precedent for proper briefings is from a FSS briefer and more and more today, DUATS...NOT websites plastered with advertisements that have no legal obligation to anyone.

 

[kf4amu]

FSS is just a supplement to flight planning, no?

OK so where do you get your initial information from that you use FSS to supplement?

 

[desertdog71]

I have had breifers not enter my flight plans. I call for clearance, and nothing on file. That gets aggravating. Its happened twice this week.

 

[Metro752]

1. No I dont get daily aviation news briefs, I dont fly enough to care enough to remember what I would read anyway.

OK so where do you get your initial information from that you use FSS to supplement?

Doc,

faa.gov (TFR Link on right side, graphics too!!!), duats, aviationweather.gov, fltplan.com, charts n such

aopa.org has a lot of resources as well

 

[kf4amu]

Doc,

faa.gov (TFR Link on right side, graphics too!!!), duats, aviationweather.gov, fltplan.com, charts n such

aopa.org has a lot of resources as well

I think FAA.gov is about as official as you can get for TFRs, if you cant rely on the FSS. Awesome link, thanks.


As far as the initial information, I understand the whole "charts and duats" suggestion...this was about TFR's specifically.

 

[VNugget]

Doc,

faa.gov (TFR Link on right side, graphics too!!!)

Did you ever read the text at the bottom in big fat red highlight?

Depicted TFR data may not be a complete listing. Pilots should not use the information on this website for flight planning purposes. For the latest information, call your local Flight Service Station at 1-800-WX-BRIEF.

 

[kf4amu]

Did you ever read the text at the bottom in big fat red highlight?

Depicted TFR data may not be a complete listing. Pilots should not use the information on this website for flight planning purposes. For the latest information, call your local Flight Service Station at 1-800-WX-BRIEF.

Thats a standard disclaimer on pretty much everything I've read except Duats. Thats why the legal precedent supports FSS briefings and Duats, but we've established they dont work all the time. I was trying to see how big of a problem it was.

 

[pilotguy143]

In todays society of legal disclamers we pilots are liable to get absolutly screwed. We should be checking a variety of sources anyway.

It is especially important that we hold the FSS briefers accountable for their actions. Since they are no longer goverment employees, they simply must be held accountable for their actions and the actions (or inactions) of the company that they represent.

I really don't agree with the litigousness (sp?) of the society we live in, however with a private company runing the entire FSS it may end up saving pilots lives or saving several violations at least if we are firm with how we react to recieving a less than satisfactory briefing... especially when the briefing does not contain all availible information about TFR's. Putting pressure on the company will make them change the way they operate and hopefully make the quality of the briefings better

 

[getonit]

I haven't read all of the back and forth of who said what and who didn't do what, but what I think the general summary is you are going to get screwed no matter what.

For example, was going to PHL about 2 weeks ago and the VP was supposedly in town, I checked the TFR's on the FAA www site and they weren't supposed to affect me, but if I left early they would so I called the FSS anyway because some of the detail said if you were operating on an ATC clearance you would be OK, they also made reference to "DNS" (I might have the initials wrong). 20 minutes on hold, while the briefer checked with his supervisor, called the "DNS" and they said I would be OK. Go to get my clearance with the local ATC and they said no GA ops were being allowed. Ended up taking a delay. Government morons.

 

[erj-145mech]

kf4amu, I did mention AOPA back in post #9. You probably paid as much attention to that post as you did the briefing. You sound like you're blaming the FSS because you failed to use the available information to plan and fly your route.

The moral of the story, don't go bashing unless you are willing to be bashed.

 

[Diesel]

Thats what happens when Lockheed farms out the work to india.

 

[kf4amu]

kf4amu, I did mention AOPA back in post #9. You probably paid as much attention to that post as you did the briefing. You sound like you're blaming the FSS because you failed to use the available information to plan and fly your route.

The moral of the story, don't go bashing unless you are willing to be bashed.

I think the moral of the story (as evidenced by the plethura of testimonials from other members of this board) is that the FSS makes crucial mistakes in regards to TFR's on a consistent basis, especially this time.

I cant believe your telling others to use for-profit mickeymouse websites (AOPA excluded) to plan a flight around TFR's. If thats what you use, you would bust airspace long before me, and have 0 legal defense to help your case. Even the FAA's website says don't use it for flight planning, call FSS to get a briefing, I cant understand how you think you are smarter than them, but to each his own. Good luck with that attitude, I hope you never fly a plane I'm on.

 

[Metro752]

Did you ever read the text at the bottom in big fat red highlight?

Depicted TFR data may not be a complete listing. Pilots should not use the information on this website for flight planning purposes. For the latest information, call your local Flight Service Station at 1-800-WX-BRIEF.

I think we've already established that the FSS is not accurate either.

 

[mnixon]

kf4amu, I did mention AOPA back in post #9. You probably paid as much attention to that post as you did the briefing. You sound like you're blaming the FSS because you failed to use the available information to plan and fly your route.

The moral of the story, don't go bashing unless you are willing to be bashed.

Talk about going off the deep end.

One of the first things that everyone is taught in PVT GS is to get a briefing before every flight. Should we complement this info with info of our own? Absolutely, but if not given the resources, how is this suppose to happen. I check all info before each flight w/ fltplan.com, but you know what, I back it up with a call to the ole wx brief. Which should I trust, fltplan (not a government source) telling me theres a notam, or FSS ( a government source) telling me there is not? Lay off the guy. At least he is asking for help, rather than being ignorant about and hoping for the best.