Anybody have briefers giving wrong info?

[kf4amu]

Doc,

faa.gov (TFR Link on right side, graphics too!!!), duats, aviationweather.gov, fltplan.com, charts n such

aopa.org has a lot of resources as well

I think FAA.gov is about as official as you can get for TFRs, if you cant rely on the FSS. Awesome link, thanks.


As far as the initial information, I understand the whole "charts and duats" suggestion...this was about TFR's specifically.

 

[VNugget]

Doc,

faa.gov (TFR Link on right side, graphics too!!!)

Did you ever read the text at the bottom in big fat red highlight?

Depicted TFR data may not be a complete listing. Pilots should not use the information on this website for flight planning purposes. For the latest information, call your local Flight Service Station at 1-800-WX-BRIEF.

 

[kf4amu]

Did you ever read the text at the bottom in big fat red highlight?

Depicted TFR data may not be a complete listing. Pilots should not use the information on this website for flight planning purposes. For the latest information, call your local Flight Service Station at 1-800-WX-BRIEF.

Thats a standard disclaimer on pretty much everything I've read except Duats. Thats why the legal precedent supports FSS briefings and Duats, but we've established they dont work all the time. I was trying to see how big of a problem it was.

 

[pilotguy143]

In todays society of legal disclamers we pilots are liable to get absolutly screwed. We should be checking a variety of sources anyway.

It is especially important that we hold the FSS briefers accountable for their actions. Since they are no longer goverment employees, they simply must be held accountable for their actions and the actions (or inactions) of the company that they represent.

I really don't agree with the litigousness (sp?) of the society we live in, however with a private company runing the entire FSS it may end up saving pilots lives or saving several violations at least if we are firm with how we react to recieving a less than satisfactory briefing... especially when the briefing does not contain all availible information about TFR's. Putting pressure on the company will make them change the way they operate and hopefully make the quality of the briefings better

 

[getonit]

I haven't read all of the back and forth of who said what and who didn't do what, but what I think the general summary is you are going to get screwed no matter what.

For example, was going to PHL about 2 weeks ago and the VP was supposedly in town, I checked the TFR's on the FAA www site and they weren't supposed to affect me, but if I left early they would so I called the FSS anyway because some of the detail said if you were operating on an ATC clearance you would be OK, they also made reference to "DNS" (I might have the initials wrong). 20 minutes on hold, while the briefer checked with his supervisor, called the "DNS" and they said I would be OK. Go to get my clearance with the local ATC and they said no GA ops were being allowed. Ended up taking a delay. Government morons.

 

[erj-145mech]

kf4amu, I did mention AOPA back in post #9. You probably paid as much attention to that post as you did the briefing. You sound like you're blaming the FSS because you failed to use the available information to plan and fly your route.

The moral of the story, don't go bashing unless you are willing to be bashed.

 

[Diesel]

Thats what happens when Lockheed farms out the work to india.

 

[kf4amu]

kf4amu, I did mention AOPA back in post #9. You probably paid as much attention to that post as you did the briefing. You sound like you're blaming the FSS because you failed to use the available information to plan and fly your route.

The moral of the story, don't go bashing unless you are willing to be bashed.

I think the moral of the story (as evidenced by the plethura of testimonials from other members of this board) is that the FSS makes crucial mistakes in regards to TFR's on a consistent basis, especially this time.

I cant believe your telling others to use for-profit mickeymouse websites (AOPA excluded) to plan a flight around TFR's. If thats what you use, you would bust airspace long before me, and have 0 legal defense to help your case. Even the FAA's website says don't use it for flight planning, call FSS to get a briefing, I cant understand how you think you are smarter than them, but to each his own. Good luck with that attitude, I hope you never fly a plane I'm on.

 

[Metro752]

Did you ever read the text at the bottom in big fat red highlight?

Depicted TFR data may not be a complete listing. Pilots should not use the information on this website for flight planning purposes. For the latest information, call your local Flight Service Station at 1-800-WX-BRIEF.

I think we've already established that the FSS is not accurate either.

 

[mnixon]

kf4amu, I did mention AOPA back in post #9. You probably paid as much attention to that post as you did the briefing. You sound like you're blaming the FSS because you failed to use the available information to plan and fly your route.

The moral of the story, don't go bashing unless you are willing to be bashed.

Talk about going off the deep end.

One of the first things that everyone is taught in PVT GS is to get a briefing before every flight. Should we complement this info with info of our own? Absolutely, but if not given the resources, how is this suppose to happen. I check all info before each flight w/ fltplan.com, but you know what, I back it up with a call to the ole wx brief. Which should I trust, fltplan (not a government source) telling me theres a notam, or FSS ( a government source) telling me there is not? Lay off the guy. At least he is asking for help, rather than being ignorant about and hoping for the best.

 

[BrownStreak]

Ok guys...lay off. Let me tell you what was really going on today. If this guy was flying anywhere near MCO then he most likely got screwed. First off, the TFR's were not NOTAM'ed as they actually were. They times were not acurate and were ever-changing. The President moved multiple times in the past 36 hours thoughout Central and South Florida.

I landed in MCO early in the morning and asked the controller when Air Force One would be leaving and if there would be any delays resulting from it's movement. He responded with "what are you talking about" responses, and I recieved no answers. He would not even admit to me that Air Force One was there. He could not tell me that there was a TFR or a "airport closure".

On the flight out, I heard a GA aircraft check on with center going past Orlando. The man in the plane stated he checked all the Notams for MCO on WSI and saw nothing except the Disney TFR. The controller REFUSED to give him a time range, area covered, or reason for the TFR. Not one controler that day would admit the presence of Air Force One or the President. The even did their best to avoid the questions. Kinda like it was super secret.

All that said, you guys should give him a break. It was a confusing couple days down here in FL.

It is always a confusing day for you retarded Gulfstream pilots. Of course if I had bought my job I guess it wouldn't matter if I knew what the hell was going on, either. You are a monday morning quaterback, and the real aviation professionals on this board don't need you on here pissing in our ears with your nonsense. Why don't you go grab yourself some more money and get another type rating so you can take away more of the jobs those of us who did time will lose to you high school drop outs with big trust funds. You make me sick, Russian. A Whore to the aviation industry if I've ever seen one.

 

[38tango]

It is always a confusing day for you retarded Gulfstream pilots. Of course if I had bought my job I guess it wouldn't matter if I knew what the hell was going on, either. You are a monday morning quaterback, and the real aviation professionals on this board don't need you on here pissing in our ears with your nonsense. Why don't you go grab yourself some more money and get another type rating so you can take away more of the jobs those of us who did time will lose to you high school drop outs with big trust funds. You make me sick, Russian. A Whore to the aviation industry if I've ever seen one.

You are an ignorant jack@ss, BrownStreak. Why don't you p!ss up a flagpole and quit giving this guy a bunch of crap for taking the time to explain what was going on. People like you are the second guessing, disagreeable, know it all, insufferable pains in the @ss that everyone else wishes would curl up and die. I'll bet flying with you and your king of the world attitude is a real pleasure. I am tired of everyone else's morale being lowered by your type's immature crybaby crap. If you're that bitter than why don't you go cry on your momma's tit instead of flaming people on this message board you whiny little piss ant. Russian, you are still a whore.

 

[BrownStreak]

You are an ignorant jack@ss, BrownStreak. Why don't you p!ss up a flagpole and quit giving this guy a bunch of crap for taking the time to explain what was going on. People like you are the second guessing, disagreeable, know it all, insufferable pains in the @ss that everyone else wishes would curl up and die. I'll bet flying with you and your king of the world attitude is a real pleasure. I am tired of everyone else's morale being lowered by your type's immature crybaby crap. If you're that bitter than why don't you go cry on your momma's tit instead of flaming people on this message board you whiny little piss ant. Russian, you are still a whore.

suck my b a l l s you pft @sswipe. I know you came from Gulfstream and I don't care what you say you've sold your soul.

 

[38tango]

suck my b a l l s you pft @sswipe.

Present them......and.....you can't have your mom's tit back 'til I get done makin you a baby brother tonight

 

[erj-145mech]

Talk about going off the deep end.

One of the first things that everyone is taught in PVT GS is to get a briefing before every flight. Should we complement this info with info of our own? Absolutely, but if not given the resources, how is this suppose to happen. I check all info before each flight w/ fltplan.com, but you know what, I back it up with a call to the ole wx brief. Which should I trust, fltplan (not a government source) telling me theres a notam, or FSS ( a government source) telling me there is not? Lay off the guy. At least he is asking for help, rather than being ignorant about and hoping for the best.

I'll lay off the guy when he admits that he screwed up and is trying to pass the blame off to some one else. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that a 30nm Presidential TFR will encompass another airport 7.1nm away. The cat is supposed to hold a commercial pilots certificate. Where is his responsibility? I should be glad that he didn't live in New Orleans an be demanding that the government owes him a new house and a new car too. After all, its the governments fault, right? The government didn't specifically tell him where to fly and where not to fly, after he got a briefing, so its the governments fault. He was planning a flight into an airport that didn't accept general avition aircraft, and its the governments fault because he didn't do his research?

 

[kf4amu]

I'll lay off the guy when he admits that he screwed up and is trying to pass the blame off to some one else. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that a 30nm Presidential TFR will encompass another airport 7.1nm away.

Your so stupid it hurts my eyes to read what you write.

ORL was open after a 1 hour delay. MCO was closed all day. The briefer specifically said MCO would be open. He was wrong. Should I have gotten into an argument with him because flyingwebsitewithadseverywhere.com said it would be closed? Ahh yes, the classic "I read it on the internet" defense...

Bro lemme tell you something, I'm the most personally responsible person I know, I don't expect anything from the govt. But when their own rules and regs state a FSS briefing is required, not to rely on other information from other sources, I get a briefing to cover my ass. When that briefing is wrong, there is no other place to turn to. Thats the purpose of this thread, to see what others have done. We all get it, you check private for-profit sites that the FAA does not endorse as a official place to get briefings.

Lets hear what others do.

 

[timeoff]

Your so stupid it hurts my eyes to read what you write.

Mind if I use this in my sig

It is hilarious.

 

[erj-145mech]

Take credit for your actions, tool. You screwed the pootch, and admitted it. Now you want to blame a government bureaucrat because you don't have the basic special airspace knowledge. Presidential TFR's have been around how long? Get used to it because its not going to get any better.

Call your therapist, and cry a river of tears that you're so mistreated and abused. If your skin isn't as thick as a rhino's, you're considered a bleeder.

 

[Kream926]

guys what is this? i fly outta ISM everyday and we knew about the pres. TFR a day in advance

 

[kf4amu]

Take credit for your actions, tool. You screwed the pootch, and admitted it. Now you want to blame a government bureaucrat because you don't have the basic special airspace knowledge. Presidential TFR's have been around how long? Get used to it because its not going to get any better.

Call your therapist, and cry a river of tears that you're so mistreated and abused. If your skin isn't as thick as a rhino's, you're considered a bleeder.

And the collective IQ of this board drops another 20 points...