AirTran MEC Chair message.

[waveflyer]

QF speaks for very few of us- and definitely not me. The words and tone of that post is absurd

 

[SWA Bubba]

Yes, that's right. We should have let that garbage that Qweef posted go completely unchallenged.

How about, instead, if a few of his coworkers put him in his place, so we wouldn't have to?

Unless, of course, you agree with Qweef.

You are 100% correct, Ty, in that what he posted is garbage. He doesn't speak for me, or for more than one or two other disgruntled dumbasses, if that. He's an sad and angry man whose post was designed to do one thing, and one thing alone: stir up the pot. It bothered ME reading it, especially knowing how hurtful it would be to all of you.

I'd say ignore him, because after all, it is nothing but BS vitriol desiigned to piss you off, but I know ignoring it is not really possible. However, please remember that the overwhelming majority of real Southwest pilots do not agree with him. We understand that we're in this together, and are trying our best to make this work.

Bubba

PS- I was actually originally going to wait a little while to respond, just to see how many more good insulting allusions to QF's screen name you all could make ("Queef" is my favorite), but I didn't want you to think that there weren't guys on this side of the partition defending your anger.

 

[SWA Bubba]

Sorry Bubba I forgot.......Little quiteflight must have that warrior spirit thing going, you can even see it in his avatar!

Dan-- I think it's obvious that one angry poster does not an entire pilot group's attitude make. And you know that, but you did manage to use the opportunity to make another cheap attack at the group as a whole. Careful--your obvious lack of impartiality is showing again.

However, that was actually a very good use of your running "warrior spirit" thing, tying it to his avatar. That was your best one yet. Now if only you used your powers for good, instead of just to join the pack of pot stirrers....

Bubba

 

[PCL_128]

I believe the language is there, its just a matter of pushing the issue. Gary may resist initially, but if he sees angry pilot who truly want to leave SWA, he might feel inclined to assist them in that endeavour.

Oh, I don't think Gary would be the problem. Gary's a smart guy, so I'm sure he'd jump at the opportunity to let a bunch of guys leave who would rather be somewhere else. The real problem would be with Delta and DALPA.

 

[Lear70]

Because people like yourself respond to things like that. Your mistake.

Oh yes, this thread is CLEARLY all my fault, and I am a very, very bad man...

Whatever. *snicker*

 

[Scoot 11]

From AT MEC Chair...

Fellow Southwest Pilots (Uh, what?!),

Yes, I just did that, and for good reason. We are all Southwest pilots. (No WE are not.)

I know what you’re thinking, so before you start sending me nasty e-mails threatening my dog, let me explain.

Think back to the SWAPA Round-ups and the presentations made during the road shows for the seniority integration agreement. The overriding theme was that when we had an SIA, and after the Date of Corporate Closing (DOCC) and after the Single Operating Certificate (SOC) was granted, that we would be Southwest pilots and treated as such. However, the reality doesn’t look like what we expected. (Things change.)

We don’t feel like Southwest pilots. (You shouldn't because you're not. Comprende?) Or at least we don’t feel like we think Southwest pilots should feel (I'm sorry Oprah, what was that?), and that’s not good. It’s not good for us; it’s not good for the Company.

We are all too familiar with the history of the seniority integration process, and the contentiousness that it brought. There were many arguments, even among close friends, and many scars from that engagement. At times it felt like civil war.

Eventually, with a transition plan in place, things began to settle down. Despite our future loss of seniority (here we go...), I think we began to move on. There were a few small improvements to our quality of life: reduced insurance costs, a kinder-gentler scheduling department, new leadership in the training department, and Rob Amsler in the Chief Pilot’s Office. It was just a morsel of the Southwest culture.(You were lucky to get those considering you're not Southwest pilots.)

But then, as it often seems to do, the other shoe dropped. Southwest announced the B-717 sublease tentative agreement with Delta. (If this came as a surprise to any of you, you deserve to feel like a moron.)

In an instant, all of the goodwill and trust that management had worked to cultivate with our pilots vanished. Gone. Kaput. (Guess it wasn't true "trust" in the first place.) On top of that, some of the messaging from SWAPA on the day the B-717 deal was announced was read by many of our pilots as gloating. (You guys appear more and more sensitive with each passing day.)

Can these problems be fixed? I hope so — and believe so — not for only for our sakes, but for the sake of our Company. (At the rate the Tranny's are screwing up in transition training and failing IOE, it's doubtful there will be enough of you left to do any noticeable harm.)

First of all, we are all Southwest pilots. (Hasn't this been covered already?) It is time that we are recognized as such. (Why? You work for Critter therefore you are not SWA pilots.) There is only one master seniority list, and our names are on it, intertwined with our friends and colleagues across the partition. We are not in a “pool” waiting for a seniority number — we already have one; we fly Southwest owned and leased airplanes with a different paint scheme; and, our corporate address is no longer Orlando, Florida — it is Love Field, in Dallas, Texas, the home of our (Not yours) company, Southwest Airlines.

The MEC has tasked our Negotiating Committee with engaging the company (read: begin whining more loudly NC!) to ease the burden of this transition on our pilots — the Southwest pilots represented by ALPA. (For the record, there are currently NO SWA pilots represented by ALPA. There never have been.) Yesterday, the NC started that process by meeting with management in Dallas. The conversation was wide-ranging and overall could be described as fairly productive. To continue our talks, we are making arrangements to schedule a follow-up meeting in the coming weeks.

On Monday, Captain Jim Gallagher and I will join ALPA executive administrator Capt. Tim Canoll and ALPA Directors Bruce York and Jon Cohen in Dallas for a meeting with SWAPA to move forward the process of transferring representation. While I believe the events of the past few weeks demonstrate the benefit of ALPA to our pilots, it is in the long-term interest of all Southwest pilots to have a single voice (This is actually a valid point. So you're up to 1 now.), regardless of the color of the airplane they are flying. It is also important that SWAPA recognize that former AirTran pilots will soon comprise almost a quarter of their membership, and it is to their benefit to consider the impact of their actions and statements on the future of the organization in a post-SOC world. (Was that a threat?)

I spent most of this week meeting with the MEC, discussing these issues. For a while, we were joined by Southwest Executive Vice President & Chief Operating Officer Mike Van de Ven as well as Southwest Executive Vice President & Chief Commercial Officer Bob Jordan. We shared with them all of the feedback that you have given us over the past few weeks, both good and bad. We were brutally honest and I think they appreciated it. I also think they now understand that there is a unique opportunity for the Company to demonstrate the values for which it is famous, not the least of which is its commitment to its employees. (Good thing you cleared that up for them. Amazing they were able to do it for 40+ years without you Jim.)

Having spent four years in Missouri, the “Show Me State,” I learned a good deal about Midwestern values and skepticism. True character is displayed through action, not words. (If this is true, could you ask your pilots to shut up and color? Come to work as a SWA pilot AFTER completing transition training and IOE with hat in hand like the rest of us did. Be quiet, play nice, fly, get paid and go home.) This is the time for Southwest management to show me, and you, that we are all an integral part of the team. I trust that they will. (Don't count on it.)

I’ll see you at the airport.

Capt. Jim Morris, Chairman
Your ATN Master Executive Council (ATN? Thought you said you were SWA ALPA...)

I would refer to you as Sir, but that is a title reserved for Gentlemen!
You are nothing but an internet troll hiding behind a keyboard. Kharma is a bitch!

 

[jonjuan]

Oh, I don't think Gary would be the problem. Gary's a smart guy, so I'm sure he'd jump at the opportunity to let a bunch of guys leave who would rather be somewhere else. The real problem would be with Delta and DALPA.

Delta and i believe their svp of operations has stated emphatically that no pilots will come to delta with the 717s, something like "let me assure you...". I would guess Richard Anderson would stop it from happening as Gary would.

 

[fam62c]

I wish the Airtran guys good luck on the pay parity thing, but I don't think there's a chance in hell of this going anywhere. I don't mean to bust any bubbles but the money was in the first agreement that was voted down by the MEC, and now its long gone. I always thought it best for the AAI guys to get over here ASAP on that open bid. Some decided they wanted better quality of life on the 717. Even before all of this, I thought that was a mistake. We've all made our votes. I don't see Gary changing anything. Maybe announcing ATL as a base. Thats about it.

I don't know what will change but something will have to because the majority of the AT pilots were awarded transition bid vacancies on the AT side that will never exist. The 717 retirement has opened up a can of worms and transition/vacancy language will have to be reworked or there will be a huge pile of grievances. At a minimum I think they will end up pay protecting all AT pilots who bid SW 737 FO if they attempt to move anybody over to SW with a 717 CA or FO bid first.

The only alternative I see is throwing out the transition bid entirely and bidding each SW transition class by AT seniority with no base and/or aircraft type exceptions and doing a million "backfill" training events between aircraft types. One way or another the company is going to have to come to AT ALPA for contract relief and this time it will have to be in a LOA that WILL have to be ratified by the membership. There's no more free lunch here, there will need to be a fair trade this time. I don't think that the SW CEO can be as heavy-handed this time because the AT guys are already on the list (that threat is removed) and the whole (and growing) SW international operation is on the AT side and may be for many, many years. This time he will be better off with the carrot than the stick. It's time to buy Manhattan with beads instead of threatening to shoot the Indians

 

[fam62c]

QF speaks for very few of us- and definitely not me. The words and tone of that post is absurd

I think there's a good chance that QF isn't a SW pilot, just a bored person who likes to stir things up.

 

[RIDETHELIGHTING]

I've been off here for awhile.

Couple things.

First, Karma, I like your avatar! Where's the Ride the Lightning bro, like his too!

Second, to the OP, chill the flock out. Gotta let it go man, just let it go. We are all pawns in this game.

-C

Still here, just lurking. Rock on!!!!!