Airlines where Pilots Clean the Cabin

[FlyBoeingJets]

And NOW I SAW IT FOR THE FIRST TIME WITH MY OWN EYES.
"CA1900" you are an xxxxxxxxx. You would probably enjoy cleaning the cabin like a little xxxxxx

Very Nice. You want a job without a team spirit attitude? Go back to school and become a lawyer, MBA, civil servant or some other paper pushing, meeting intensive job. You may get the job but your advancement will cease when you get found out.

Oh wait, you have to pass an interview where you can't swear yourself out of a situation and must exhibit some intelligence. Guys like you get screened out during an effective interview process.

The good news is you can change your attitude now, I suggest you try.

 

[fletch717]

Air Biscuit, Yes the industry has changed. I don't want to clean the cabin, but I will if I don't think it is clean enough. Like I said before my airplane is a reflection of me and my company. I have had the President on my flight before, and I have seen him help clean the airplane after the flight. It's a team effort, I try to lead the team by example. If thats lowering the bar then don't apply for a job here, and you won't have to spend 10 minutes a day doing manual labor for $123.00 an hour.

 

[Nigel Tufnel]

PastFast, Excellent post. The industry has changed because pilots have allowed it to. "Yeah I'll do my job for less than that guy" and another comes along and says "I'll do it for even less than him plus I'll clean the cabin." How much more are you guys willing to do to keep your companies in business? Volunteer to come in on your days off and work for free? I'm afraid we aren't going to hit bottom until the pay equals that of a minumum wage job.

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Last edited by Air Biscuit : Today at 10:42.


Air Biscuit,

Remind the class that you PFT'd to the tune of about $10,000 for a below minimum wage job some years ago. I'm not the type to jump into these type of frays, but these holier than thou types start to piss me off after a while. You can learn alot about one through their post history.

Those who cast stones should not live in glass houses!!

 

[Realistic]

I think first and foremost, it's nobody's business what we do at jetBlue. When the idea that we should all conform to some code of pay/benefits/output/conduct carrys over to merger's/acquisitions/national seniority/scope then it may actually be reasonable to take a look at what your "brother" is doing. I say that with tons and tons of sarcasm.

That said, I will say that even though I am eager to help when I've done my job up front, it really pisses me off when I get a flight attendant in the door who's tapping her foot and asking us why we're not in the back cleaning yet - as well - when two pilots are zipping about making the cabin beautiful while I wait for them to clear their stuff out of the cockpit. Then when they do, the cockpit is a filthy mess. Part of the quick turn is giving the oncoming crew easy access to a clean cockpit.

The most disturbing thing however, is when a pilot chooses not to clean. I've seen Captains and Flight Attendants give FO's the third degree just because he's made the decision not to clean. In my opinion, this only adds to the sometimes Orwellian atmosphere we have at jetBlue. If an FO doesn't want to clean, that's his business. Maybe he has a bad back. I leave him alone and respect his decision. This "how blue are you?" atmosphere will hurt us in the end.

Realistic

 

[hellas]

Realistic: Im curious, what do you mean by Orwellian atmosphere at JB, Im not a JB employee, just thinking about different careers and I like to here honesty and different perspectives on different companies.

 

[semperfido]

why stop in the cabin?..what's next the "blue room"?

 

[Air Biscuit]

Air Biscuit,

Remind the class that you PFT'd to the tune of about $10,000 for a below minimum wage job some years ago. I'm not the type to jump into these type of frays, but these holier than thou types start to piss me off after a while. You can learn alot about one through their post history.

Those who cast stones should not live in glass houses!!

Good one Nigel. You got me there. You are comparing apples and oranges also by the way. I fought the notion of paying for 3 years before I decided to do it. Big mistake on my part for waiting. Even though I eventually broke down, at the time things were much different then they are today and it wasn't a min wage job, since I was in the left seat of a 120 after 4 1/2 months on the line. So add it up and tell me what the cost difference for me would have been vs. someone who didn't pay for training, decided to make poverty level wages longer and now has to sit in the right seat of an rj. for the next 5 years to forever and doesn't get a job at a major airline. It was purely a business decision, just like going to college is. Last time I checked that was still PFT also. It sucked having to pay but I don't regret it. It's just the way it was everywhere. Cleaning an airplane is not, so go blow it out your @ss!

 

[SWAInflt]

That said, I will say that even though I am eager to help when I've done my job up front, it really pisses me off when I get a flight attendant in the door who's tapping her foot and asking us why we're not in the back cleaning yet...


...The most disturbing thing however, is when a pilot chooses not to clean. I've seen Captains and Flight Attendants give FO's the third degree just because he's made the decision not to clean.

Interesting. The concept of pilots helping tidy the cabin goes back decades at SWA and yet, it would never even occur to me or anyone I've ever flown with to question let alone chastise a flight deck crewmember over the issue. It doesn't happen that often but when one of "the guys" picks up newspaper or two or helps fold blankets...the effort is appreciated but never, ever expected.

 

[skykid]

why stop in the cabin?..what's next the "head"?

Yeah. Everytime I use the head, even as a nonrev, I take a wad of paper towels and wipe the piss off the floor left from the idiots who can't make the hole. Takes about 5 seconds. Then I wash my hands. I don't want a customer to decide not to buy another ticket because the head is filthy.

 

[ChinaClipper]

Being a cabin beeyatch?? Doesn't bother me a bit.....

F9 is pretty much oriented towards pitching in, and a WHOLE lot less "the pilot aristicrat" bull$it. I dig that. Since I started in this business I have been looked down upon by more than a few sanctimonious wankers who think that they are above ANYTHING, let alone stooping to a cabin cleaners "level"..... Blame it on my blue collar roots.....When I was a ramper @ UAL, I would always deliver a note to a pax, via the purser, about having their dog safely on board and, yes, I often stank from spending most of the day in the pit of a 757 on a 95 degree day. I once had a new FO gave a snide comment along the lines of "...those types should stay under the wing...".... I hate to say it, being X military myself, but he was an F-15 guy and got similar attitudes while spinning wrenches in Uncle Sams Flying Circus....(shiny Low Quarters and the flight bag stickers beared that out). As a UAL fueler, I had even more frequent interaction with a few more of the exhaulted ones. I was, for all practical reasons, invisable common trash, to more than just a few. Later, as a mechanic, I got a bit more respect, but the intearactions, though less frequent, often became a bit worse, mainly on judgement calls concerning the MX status. I was VERY FREQUENTLEY questioned in a "I am the master, you are an ingnorant peon" manner...nice payoff for being a fanatic about EVERY airplane that showed up on my gate. So, the long and the short of it is this; I have NEVER had the illusion that pilots are any better than the guy who dumps the $hitter, (yes, I have done that too!) So if anyone feels I am "degrading" the once exualted position...well.......they can nibble my sweaty sack.......Fly safe, be humble....BTW this is not a direct shot @UAL, or x military, but I think we all know who were're talking about, every operation has these guys, dinosuars, I hope... but that was my experience.

 

[Realistic]

hellas,

We have a company with a culture that stresses values (we seem to get tangled up with the integrity value though), a FEW sometimes overly eager crewmembers, a whole lot of internal communication, very little communication externally, and this bizarre interpretation of seniority that says because I got here three years before you did I'm an old timer. These combine SOMETIMES to create situations in which people can be made to feel excluded, or not clued in, or worried that they may have violated some code. Especially when you hear the familiar refrain, "how did they make it onto this property?" Like there was a failure in the machine that molds jetBlue employees.

People are told to speak up and yet when I ask someone whether they have spoken to the leadership about a specific problem they look at me like, "are you crazy? I'm not jumping into that." I know countless pilots, including myself, who've spoken up very patiently and very cogently only to encounter impatience, irritation, or worse, befuddlement. The befuddlement is where you begin to lose a little confidence. Eventually, if you haven't been assigned to yet another committee or another off-site, you get one line answers and you obtain a label for yourself.

We have an administration that bends over backwards to get out and talk and conduct meetings but a pilot group that has learned that even though they ask for "hard balls", it really just pisses them off. So we have a lot of one way communication. Don't get me wrong, there are many pilots involved in the running of this company (I think sometimes too many) but I've found that we also have a lot of group speak. Disagreement is viewed by SOME as subversion. I know this is very much the same at other airlines but I've never seen it to such a degree within the pilot group itself. Some would say this is a good thing and I would agree. It just needs to be balanced with reality. There is nothing wrong with being pro-company and being eager to help. There is something wrong with looking around and making mental lists and labels and I have big problems with just laying our careers at the feet of the bean counters with undying faith that we will be compensated. Shareholders and finance majors do not necessarily subscribe to values at the same level of faith that we do.

This part is comedy so please take it as such: we joke that when someone comes back from an off-site or gets a committee assignment that they've been subjected to the JetBlue mind trick. This is where the concepts of RASM over CASM become the gospel and where pilots are made to feel greedy about their desires for insurance or cost of living increases. JOKE !!

Friends at JetBlue: We can handle this kind of critisism. If we can't look at ourselves and be real then we are in for a rude awakening.

All of this said hellas,
I wouldn't choose to work anywhere else. Figure that one out.

Realistic

 

[Obi-Wan]

Most people help out when they can. I think the issue is that its company policy for the pilots to help clean the AC and its not by choice. I help out when I can but it does not state in my contract that I have to clean the AC.

 

[Realistic]

Obi-Wan

Can you use your powers to make these pilots clean the cabin?

JOKE !!!!!

 

[flyifrvfr]

I am not an airline pilot, but I can actually see the poster's point. Why stop with demanding the pilots clean the cabin? The pilots can also do the lav service, ticket sales, refuel. I mean you are getting paid the big bucks ( sarcasm intended) to just fly the plane, and the pay is getting higher and higher, so why not help out the other workers do thier jobs.

What would a F/A say if you asked a F/A for help doing your job. " Hey Trish, if your done with the coffee and soda, come up here and enter the new route clearance in the FMS. Or " Hey Trish, I have to clean the cabin, get the flight release and weather at our destination.

 

[starshipdrvr]

And since when is bring coffee to the flight deck part of the flight attendant duties? It isn't at our airline, it's a courtesy that they offer to the flight crew so why can't I offer them the same courtesy and help them out? Am I so high and mighty because I'm wearing a prissy-looking white shirt with stripes on it that I can't help out? Give me a fricking break, why are we making such a big deal about this? We are part of a crew, lets fricking act like it.

 

[CLCAP]

How about working more days a month? Or maybe more hours a day? (oops...I think you guys allready tried that one) in order to support "your" company? Maybe a paycut? Or a shorter vacation? Anything to beat the competition and keep the customer happy.......with an attitude like that, airline captains will be working 25 days a year, clean cabins, drive the honey cart, load bags AND check in passengers 25 years from now.

 

[SUNDOWN]

I am not an airline pilot, but I can actually see the poster's point. Why stop with demanding the pilots clean the cabin?

No offense dude....but I don't think you have a dog in this fight.

 

[sleepy]

Looking at this from a customer standpoint, it is easy to see why some airlines (SWA, AirTran, and JB) are successful and some are falling by the wayside (DAL, AA, USAir, and Untied). The successful airlines have employees with a much better attitude toward customer service.

In corporate flying I load bags, if we don't have an FA on the flight I will clean the cabin, make coffee, stock the catering, etc.... I want my customers (the company executives) to have a great experience on my flights. It all affects my performance review; which has a direct impact on my raise, bonus, promotion, and stock options.

 

[Le Pilote]

I think it is absolutely hilarious that some posters here find it above them to take two seatbelt straps and make an X out of them. Or how they are afraid to pull a newspaper from a seatback and put it in a bag. You are bigger queens than some of your cabin crew.

If you are worried about a workers compensation issue for lifting a 30 pound carry-on bag and tossing it down the jetway (or lifting a newspaper, my gosh), then it might be time to get set up with a fitness program. Do you need a caddy to carry your rollaboard for you on your trips?

 

[Alchemy]

caddy to carry your rollaboard for you on your trips?

That would be nice