Albie, I was hoping you'd chime in. It is well documented how much I respect your opinion and definitely respect emerald coast.
After helping over 4000 pilots I hoped someone would notice?.
Here though, you argue the merits of a military career, and it sounds pretty amazing. Definitely a worthwhile human experience and career. And service.
I have not said you're "a lesser airline guy"- I said your experience is less qualified than civilians who have actually been doing the job for many years.
It is a NOBLE job, it is a FUN job, and it is LUCRATIVE job. It has some challenges. It demand attention to detail. But it is not so challenging a well motivated and capable pilot cannot assimilate it quickly. Ab Initio programs at KLM and Luftansa has proven you can raise a pilot from the ground up. If Pinnacle and ASA could put a 300 hour guy in the right seat of an RJ, I think a 3000 hour P-3 guy can figure out how to the do the SEAVU 2 into LAX in a 757. The MD11 is not a forgiving airliner. Yet, somehow, I enjoy it immensely. With its light touch in pitch, I could make the case that perhaps guys who had not flown a similarly pitch sensitive plane like a T-45 or T-38 might not be suited for the job. Yet--amazingly--I have a friend from Auburn days who was never military yet flew one safely all over the globe for Gemini. So I think we are all trainable.
The last part makes you sound like general lee, mixed in with the exact weird superiority that we've been talking about- feel good about what you did- it's great- , but you come into the civilian world to make money and maybe it ought to be normal to have done that job before getting the top end job??
Where were you when I was teaching spins in Tomahawks at an FBO in Georgia, or working at a University flight school teaching commercial students for 4.85 an hour? I don't remember seeing you in the DZ in central Florida when I was flying load after load of skydivers in central Florida. You weren't the tow pilot when I was flying gliders on my weekends off, spending every dollar I made as a CFI to learn more about flying something new. Was that you at my annual a couple years ago, helping me repack wheel bearings or rebuild a hydraulic gear actuator on my 1962 Navion? Maybe I could write the ultimate "perfect pilot" syllabus, and have you drop out of SWA for a couple yard so you could pay the "proper" dues before you get to go back to your six figure job?.
How can that even be argued against?
You paid many many dues doing other things than the job you're trying to get.
With all that you've done in your career, why is it offensive to spend a year or two in the right seat somewhere- getting those 121 rules down BEFORE getting the six figure job.
Besides we all know how fedex is about hiring retired military pilots. Had many friends go through your purple nugget hazing- literally having your probation pilots make you coffee- reprimanding pilots in training for not using exact verbiage per manual, then proceeding to use military jargon with no clue how dumb it looks to the civilian who was just reprimanded.
Funny. As an uptight Air Force/F-15 guy, I actually winced the first time I was in training and a guy repeated memory items in a non-verbatim manner during my first 727 recurrent. As I waited for the guy to get whacked, the instructor said "good" even though he DID NOT SAY IT VERBATIM. But since he more or less said the same thing, he got a pass. I later learned this was "normal". So--I cannot say what you friend did or didn't do, but my impression is memory items and perfect verbiage are NOT required at FedEx. Point of fact: At takeoff when the capt gives the FO the plane, the correct verbiage is "you have the airPLANE". I don't' say anything, but when a captain says "you have the airCRAFT a little pucker starts in my anus and runs up to my throat. I stop it before it leaps out of my mouth. I don't correct anyone, but I repeat "I have the airPLANE" because that is what 20 years of programming does to you. That is just a difference in culture. when you have 16 guys in an LFE on the radio, in a comm jam environment, you are taught comm is to be clear, concise, and correct. Maybe it doesn't make a ******************** now (probably doesn't) but it does not wash off just because I am flying boxes instead of missiles through the sky. And coffee--I poured the captain a cup yesterday on my trip, even though I am a 12 year FO. He was the PF, and I was glad to do it. Pouring coffee is the tax FedEx pilots pay to avoid having 5 am van conversations with Aisle Donkeys in the crew van, and IMHO it is a tax worth paying. In a 2 man cockpit, there is no "coffee bitch" anymore. Its just a couple pilots helping each other out as we do our job. We also get to go pee without asking anyone in the back. In short--its the job. If folks want their coffee poured I guess they can fly for a pax carrier.
There's a lot of groupthink over there Albie
You've got a foothold, but that doesn't make for a good safe pilot group. To dans thinking, I'd imagine fedex could use some more civilian backgrounds
What percentage would deem acceptable? I can tell you that since 2002, I have helped about 665 people get hired at FedEx, or about 15% of the crew force. 42%, almost 300, have been from other airlines, corporate, or internal candidates. I do not know what the hiring totals are, but I know my client base at most airlines is pretty darn close to 50/50.
IMHO, the best pilot out there is the one who keeps learning, enjoys the craft and is an ambassador to the profession. My suggestion is that telling anyone--military or civilian, Navy or Air Force, fixed wing or rotary wing--that somehow they aren't "ready" for the big leagues--is a real easy way to get labeled as a dick. Don't be a dick. My favorite MD11 instructor was hired by Flying Tigers at age 23. He is an awesome pilot and superior instructor. Another one of my favorite MD11 role models helped write the employment manual for the F-15 back in the 90s. (3-1 Chapter 4 for your AF types) was a Desert Storm vet, and was a standards LCA on the MD11. Guy is brilliant, and joy to fly with, and knows the MD11 inside/out. What you do next, not where you have been, defines who you are. I strive to always be moving forward. Suggest you do the same. You may admire me--nice. You may appreciate Emerald Coast--super. But I don't admire anyone who knows nothing about my experience, drive, motivation, or capability telling me what I should or should not be able to do based on my background.
What you don't like is arrogance. I get it. What you are missing is you come off just as condescending and arrogant in your own way, and it is no more attractive. The only difference in you and them is nobody makes movies about regional pilots. If the guys you fly with are so awful, you don't need more civilian pilots--you just need a better professional standards program. Be careful, however, when you cart your fellow crew members into a mediated debrief, however, because you might just found out the problem really isn't them.
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