Age 65

[Semore Butts]

Aarp

OK Jonjuan, we don't agree on this issue......

But that was funny as hell!!!!!!!!

 

[Hawkered]

Do you see 60 year olds pitching for the New York Yankees? Now come on, this is bull********************. If you're collecting Social Security and getting senior discounts at Wendy's, it's time to hang it up.

 

[pilotyip]

Do you see 60 year olds pitching for the New York Yankees? Now come on, this is bull********************. If you're collecting Social Security and getting senior discounts at Wendy's, it's time to hang it up.

right more of get the heck out of my seat, I am owed that seat that seat is my and I going to invent a reason to get you out of my seat.

 

[Fubijaakr]

right more of get the heck out of my seat, I am owed that seat that seat is my and I going to invent a reason to get you out of my seat.

Disgusting, but not unexpected.

 

[slickmagneto]

After reading through all the post I see no one hit on a major problem that will affect us baby boomers. I fell into the age 66 rule before I can draw full social security. I'll need to wait until then so I have enough money for smokes and beer.

 

[Helmsalee]

Someone mentioned the guy who was terrible at 65. What was he like at 55, or 50, or whatever? Did he suddenly get that way at 60 or 65? We all know people at all ages who are not exactly the "ace of the base" in skills and/or work ethic. If safety (or customer service) is the goal, we should be weeding these people out at any age instead of setting some arbitrary age to get rid of everyone. Won't happen. Nor will age 65 (or whatever) come to 135 or 91K, IMHO. This thread comes up about every 6 months. Nothing ever changes and no ones opinion is modified as a result.
Helm

 

[Grizz]

Background so that folks understand that this isn't about me. I'm almost 52. I am a relative junior Captain at NetJets because I was hired at the end of the 2001-2002 hiring spree. Any forced retirements at 65 are not really going to help me out one bit as a big portion of our seniority list is younger than I am and are already senior to me. Also, I hope that I never have to worry about any mandatory retirement age because I want to be retired from this gig before it ever becomes an issue.

I have mixed feelings about the validity of the age 65 rule. Some guys I know do well after 65. Some others should have retired at 60. I guess if you had to pick an arbitrary age, 65 is as good as any other and better than most.

The one issue I have concerns the differentiation between part 121, 135, 91(k) and 91. I've long felt that most, if not all, safety related regulations need to apply equally regardless of the type of operation. The recent NPRM on fatigue was a perfect example. What difference does it make if the B-777 crew is rested and covered under excellent fatigue rules when the metroliner single-pilot 135 freight guy plows into them because he can't keep his eyes open?

I think that all safety related regulations should apply equally to any pilot exercising the commercial portion of his certificate. That way - rest, duty, training, mandatory retirement will apply equally to anyone making a living at flying.

That being said, I think that since part 121 has a mandatory age 65 rule, it should apply to all commercial flying.

 

[Helmsalee]

Not going to happen Griz. At least not in the foreseeable future. Accept it. I wish I was not furloughed, but it is what it is. Wishing won't make it so.
Helm

 

[Grizz]

Acceptance is always going to be an issue for me on most things. But I'm working on it.

 

[fischman]

Hell, I'm 35 and people are asking me when I'm going to retire!

 

[gunfyter]

I am 53. I only look 35 cause I am dyslexic....

 

[Hawkered]

It's interesting to see the people who are drawing on Social Security who know full well that the baby boomer generation bankrupted the entire economy, stating that we are selfish!

It's time to look at yourselves long and hard in the mirror!

No generation has been so selfish, plundered the wealth of so many that came before it and so reluctant to take personal responsibility for any of it.

It is NOT our problem you have five marriages, three airline bankruptcies and a mountain of loans for houses and personal possessions you could never have afforded in the first place.

Stop hiding behind the cowardice of your own sheer stupidity expecting the rest of us to bankroll your own mistakes. If you can't carry your weight, load your own bags, make it through checkrides without "help". It's time TO GO!!!

Age 65= RETIREMENT!!!

It's a SAFETY issue! Nobody lives forever!!! GIVE IT UP!!!

 

[pilotyip]

It's a SAFETY issue! Nobody lives forever!!! GIVE IT UP!!!

When nothing else works you have to cry, motherhood, patriotism and safety, because no one can ever be against those. But that is not the case. This is about get out of my seat. Lets look at the age of pilot incapacitation’s, most are under 60.

 

[Grizz]

Hawkered -

A bit of clarification for you. The oldest of the baby boomers is just now turning 65. Most of the boomers haven't drawn one penny of social security yet and have funded it more than any other group.

Here's a bit of info for you on the baby boomers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baby_boomer

Proud member of the baby boomer generation, class of 1959.

 

[FrontierFan]

When nothing else works you have to cry, motherhood, patriotism and safety, because no one can ever be against those. But that is not the case. This is about get out of my seat. Lets look at the age of pilot incapacitation’s, most are under 60.

The fact that most incapacitation events occurred to pilots under 60 only strengthens the idea of an age limit no older than 60 or 65. Those guys had medicals and current checkrides too.

I think Grizz said it well. It is unfair to all those who can still perform beyond 65 but I believe there has to be a limit somewhere. Someone posted above that in my example of Captain Terrible that he may have been bad before he aged. That may be but most agree that after a certain age your skill reaches diminishing returns for all of us.

 

[pilotyip]

That may be but most agree that after a certain age your skill reaches diminishing returns for all of us.

But it is not uniform, as I have stated before, lets for the name of safety make the retirement age the age of the youngest pilot who experiences and inflight ncapacitation. That would be really safe,

 

[Helmsalee]

"most agree that after a certain age your skill reaches diminishing returns"

FF, in the first place, I don't think that "most agree". I agree that generally younger=quicker and that is important for a fighter pilot in combat. Flying a transport aircraft not so much. In many cases, just the opposite is true.
Helm

 

[FrontierFan]

By skillz, I'm not talking about top gun or steep turn stuff.. I'm talking about basic airman ship. I talking about things I have witnessed first hand.

I am talking about things like controlling the volume of your voice on an owner trip. Taxiing at half a normal speed at night because you need to get your bi-focal prescription changed. Screwing up the box on things most would consider normal ops (like a runway / approach change) and again putting the altitude where the heading belongs and the heading where the altitude belongs. One time I was in the back with the owner. When I came back I got strapped in and asked if there were any changes. Old guy replied "no". Seconds later we got yelled at my because my partner received a re-route and never hit the "execute" button on the FMS. I'm sorry but this kinda stuff sucks to work with. Then after you get done with the ASAP forms in your hotel you get to contemplate turning in Dad to the old people committee to see if the safety commentate comes up with the same conclusion everyone else on the line has. And rebutting that junior pilots make mistakes too is not apples to apples. Junior pilots get better, old pilots get worse.

I did not say everyone over "X" age is no good. As I stated many times previously, I have flown with some really really great people over 60 and 65, but I have also flown with some that really made me think about a standard age limit. It is my opinion from experience that if you are still cool after 65-ish than you are the exception and not the rule. Maybe as someone else posted, age is cool in an airline environment. Well age is not always cool with fractional flying.

 

[jonjuan]

pilotyip heading to work

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_dMnepaF4Pg&feature=fvwrel

 

[pilotyip]

pilotyip heading to work

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_dMnepaF4Pg&feature=fvwrel

funny but I don't live in Europe

 

[Hawkered]

Then watch it with your monitor reflecting in a mirror!

 

[BuckMurdock1]

When nothing else works you have to cry, motherhood, patriotism and safety, because no one can ever be against those. But that is not the case. This is about get out of my seat. Lets look at the age of pilot incapacitation’s, most are under 60.

Yip;
Since you seem to be stuck on "it's about get out of my seat" (I think you've repeated that like 15 times in this thread), ok; whatever works for you. Now get out of my seat! :laugh:

 

[pilotyip]

Yip;
Since you seem to be stuck on "it's about get out of my seat" (I think you've repeated that like 15 times in this thread), ok; whatever works for you. Now get out of my seat! :laugh:

funny, nobody wants my seat

 

[Semore Butts]

I never did get a dollar amount from you young guys

Where I must retire or be an "a$$hole"?

Oh, by the way, if you guys reach that amount, are you then in somebody else junior to yous seat? I'm assuming you will be retiring then?

Also, may I please have a list of things I am allowed to own without being an a$$hole and occupying the seat of someone junior to me?

Taking retirement advice from someone younger then me is like taking business advice from a president that was a lawyer and never ran a business.

No offense meant, but unless you are 54 years old, you just don't know. I have been every age you have and then some.

P.S. If I have my way about it I will be retired before 65.

Have a good one guys. Semore

 

[pilotyip]

Where I must retire or be an "a$$hole"?

Oh, by the way, if you guys reach that amount, are you then in somebody else junior to yous seat? I'm assuming you will be retiring then?

Also, may I please have a list of things I am allowed to own without being an a$$hole and occupying the seat of someone junior to me?

Taking retirement advice from someone younger then me is like taking business advice from a president that was a lawyer and never ran a business.

No offense meant, but unless you are 54 years old, you just don't know. I have been every age you have and then some.

P.S. If I have my way about it I will be retired before 65.

Have a good one guys. Semore

Thank you well said

 

[fischman]

Where I must retire or be an "a$$hole"?

Oh, by the way, if you guys reach that amount, are you then in somebody else junior to yous seat? I'm assuming you will be retiring then?

Also, may I please have a list of things I am allowed to own without being an a$$hole and occupying the seat of someone junior to me?

Taking retirement advice from someone younger then me is like taking business advice from a president that was a lawyer and never ran a business.

No offense meant, but unless you are 54 years old, you just don't know. I have been every age you have and then some.

P.S. If I have my way about it I will be retired before 65.

Have a good one guys. Semore

Thank you well said

...And double spaced.

 

[gret]

Where I must retire or be an "a$$hole"?

Oh, by the way, if you guys reach that amount, are you then in somebody else junior to yous seat? I'm assuming you will be retiring then?

Also, may I please have a list of things I am allowed to own without being an a$$hole and occupying the seat of someone junior to me?

Taking retirement advice from someone younger then me is like taking business advice from a president that was a lawyer and never ran a business.

No offense meant, but unless you are 54 years old, you just don't know. I have been every age you have and then some.

P.S. If I have my way about it I will be retired before 65.

Have a good one guys. Semore

Double ditto!

If you need somebody to retire to move up or get a job, you're a sorry excuse for a human, or an American. Make you own place in the world rather than being a lame butt parasite.

Nobody said it would be easy and you're not entitled to anything. Go earn it.

 

[flygirl556]

Double ditto!

If you need somebody to retire to move up or get a job, you're a sorry excuse for a human, or an American. Make you own place in the world rather than being a lame butt parasite.

Nobody said it would be easy and you're not entitled to anything. Go earn it.

Earn as much as you can and then please excuse yourself when your skills start to diminish. It's not fun to sit next too. I think that was my point on age limits, not how much you earn or "get out of my seat".

Oh...and I just noticed my post was under my Wife's username. This is Frontierfan and my opinion.

 

[pilotyip]

Earn as much as you can and then please excuse yourself when your skills start to diminish. It's not fun to sit next too. I think that was my point on age limits, not how much you earn or "get out of my seat".

Oh...and I just noticed my post was under my Wife's username. This is Frontierfan and my opinion.

Who will be the one to determine when one's skills diminish? This is not age dependent. We already give check rides, oral exams, line checks, what else?
Here is an idea, starting at age 40, every pilot must take the SAT, when the score drops below 1100, they can no longer exercise the privileges of their Comm certificate. Why not, it is a good test of mental ability? Obviously this is not practical, but what other set of tests could be used to determine when skills start to diminish?

 

[rettofly]

Earn as much as you can and then please excuse yourself when your skills start to diminish. It's not fun to sit next too. I think that was my point on age limits, not how much you earn or "get out of my seat".

Oh...and I just noticed my post was under my Wife's username. This is Frontierfan and my opinion.

The trick is to be aware of your skill level and get out before the inevitable deterioration becomes obvious. It is inevitable. I made my exit at age 68. Recurrent and check rides stopped being fun, so I worked out the calendar (including grace month ) and bailed out. I just couldn't see being told by a check airman at some point that it was time to go, but that's just me.