Tony:
Thanks for taking the bait and expending a little effort to educate me on the definition of productivity. However, you missed the point I was trying to make. That is while you may consider yourself as a commodity at your company (like the boxes you fly in your airplanes), it doesn't mean that it's universally applied like some law of physics everywhere else.
Since it's safe to say that you've never stepped a foot onto jetblue's property, it's easy to understand why you would think the way you do about how jetblue management may view their employees. Again, conventional "wisdom" gets turned on its head when casual observers make such generalizations with jetBlue's CURRENT operating philosophy. Taking a page from SWA, jetBlue's management views their employees collectively as assets, not a commodity, in how the airline executes it's business plan.
Why make this point on this thread? Because it serves as a basis for how jetBlue managers and pilots can come together to study methods for making the business run more effectively without suspecting that there are hidden agendas or ulterior motives lurking on either side. You know....it's that thing called trust. A very rare and precious "commodity" in this or any other business.
Unlike you (and others) who come from backgrounds where "trust" is only gained through contractual enforcements, and hardball tactics of negotiating, you are spring-loaded to hold a suspicious view as to the reasons for JB pilots' motives in this case. Meanwhile, I believe JB pilots are trying to find ways to make their system work better for reasons that are unique to their operations and concerns. They presently don't have to carry the same "baggage" around that you all seem to have about the true motives of management (good vs evil). Its not because they don't understand human relations or how airlines really work, but most likely because they find themselves in a remarkable situation that may only come around once in very few people's lifetimes. Don't label them as naive because they are trying something that is impossible for most of you to duplicate.
Yes, I agree the FARs have been written with the blood of others past errors, and good intentions, but as I stated before not all airlines operate the same way, with the same schedules, and the same efficiencies. Yet they must all work under a generic set of operating rules known as the FARs. I think that all JB pilots are doing at this point is studying the possibility of how specific exemptions to these generic rules can help their specific operations run more efficiently and safely.
PERHAPS you need to give them the benefit of doubt for a moment. Let them study this without your biased opinions being thrown at them in a way that reminds me of a schoolyard pushing match by a bunch of young males feeling the first pulses of testosterone course through their loins.
G4G5, you say that JB pilots have not answered your demand for how this improves safety. Yet just a few posts back DGS gave you his answer. Did you not read it? Or do you just refuse to accept that what he posted has any validity?
I for one think he gave a good consideration as to why this could help IMPROVE SAFETY for some JB pilots. You, and others, haven't answered the question as to how flying more hours during a specified amount of crew duty period (i.e. 14 hours) is more dangerous than flying fewer hours in the same period of duty.
GO ahead and take your poll if it makes you feel better. But I don't think it has any significance either way in this forum.
Everyone else can cry and scream and wrap themselves in the banner of safety, but its just a bunch of background noise by people who very likely have other interests at heart. You see I am inclined to suspect people's declared concerns as the reason for what really motivates them. It is much more plausible that you and others feel threathened by what could happen even if it's demonstrated that jetBlue's pilots can come up with a feasible exemption that works for them. Again they have no obligation to resist making improvements to their operations for the sole purpose that other airlines and pilot groups would be unable to participate equally under the same exemptions.
For the record, I am not a jetBlue pilot, but a former ALPA member and current furloughee.
Thanks for taking the bait and expending a little effort to educate me on the definition of productivity. However, you missed the point I was trying to make. That is while you may consider yourself as a commodity at your company (like the boxes you fly in your airplanes), it doesn't mean that it's universally applied like some law of physics everywhere else.
Since it's safe to say that you've never stepped a foot onto jetblue's property, it's easy to understand why you would think the way you do about how jetblue management may view their employees. Again, conventional "wisdom" gets turned on its head when casual observers make such generalizations with jetBlue's CURRENT operating philosophy. Taking a page from SWA, jetBlue's management views their employees collectively as assets, not a commodity, in how the airline executes it's business plan.
Why make this point on this thread? Because it serves as a basis for how jetBlue managers and pilots can come together to study methods for making the business run more effectively without suspecting that there are hidden agendas or ulterior motives lurking on either side. You know....it's that thing called trust. A very rare and precious "commodity" in this or any other business.
Unlike you (and others) who come from backgrounds where "trust" is only gained through contractual enforcements, and hardball tactics of negotiating, you are spring-loaded to hold a suspicious view as to the reasons for JB pilots' motives in this case. Meanwhile, I believe JB pilots are trying to find ways to make their system work better for reasons that are unique to their operations and concerns. They presently don't have to carry the same "baggage" around that you all seem to have about the true motives of management (good vs evil). Its not because they don't understand human relations or how airlines really work, but most likely because they find themselves in a remarkable situation that may only come around once in very few people's lifetimes. Don't label them as naive because they are trying something that is impossible for most of you to duplicate.
Yes, I agree the FARs have been written with the blood of others past errors, and good intentions, but as I stated before not all airlines operate the same way, with the same schedules, and the same efficiencies. Yet they must all work under a generic set of operating rules known as the FARs. I think that all JB pilots are doing at this point is studying the possibility of how specific exemptions to these generic rules can help their specific operations run more efficiently and safely.
PERHAPS you need to give them the benefit of doubt for a moment. Let them study this without your biased opinions being thrown at them in a way that reminds me of a schoolyard pushing match by a bunch of young males feeling the first pulses of testosterone course through their loins.
G4G5, you say that JB pilots have not answered your demand for how this improves safety. Yet just a few posts back DGS gave you his answer. Did you not read it? Or do you just refuse to accept that what he posted has any validity?
I for one think he gave a good consideration as to why this could help IMPROVE SAFETY for some JB pilots. You, and others, haven't answered the question as to how flying more hours during a specified amount of crew duty period (i.e. 14 hours) is more dangerous than flying fewer hours in the same period of duty.
GO ahead and take your poll if it makes you feel better. But I don't think it has any significance either way in this forum.
Everyone else can cry and scream and wrap themselves in the banner of safety, but its just a bunch of background noise by people who very likely have other interests at heart. You see I am inclined to suspect people's declared concerns as the reason for what really motivates them. It is much more plausible that you and others feel threathened by what could happen even if it's demonstrated that jetBlue's pilots can come up with a feasible exemption that works for them. Again they have no obligation to resist making improvements to their operations for the sole purpose that other airlines and pilot groups would be unable to participate equally under the same exemptions.
For the record, I am not a jetBlue pilot, but a former ALPA member and current furloughee.
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