2 -v- 1 (close call with a Viper)

[Mamma]

double post

 

[cjdriver]

Just read an FAA advisory that says charts will now contain numbers and frequencies for controlling facilities of MOA's so pilots can determine active floors and times. Should help reduce conflicts for those interested in doing so.

 

[PURPLEHAZE21]

As a former Military Pilot, there is no reason to jeopardize your career in an attempt to go "air to Air" with a single engine, civilian airplane which is flying straight and level, and does'nt know where you are...exactly. Forget MOA vs. Non-MOA areas, and airspace rules...it's all a mute point. This whole incident is equivalent to "shooting fish in a barrel"...what a waste of talent !!!

 

[Bjammin]

If firefighting or EMS work is going on I have absolutly no problem knocking it off and exiting the MOA or not even getting airborne. Training is nowhere near as impotant as those duties. Photo ops, call first and make sure no big excersize is going on and let us know what altitude you need and what specific area you will be in and we will work around you, i've done it before, no problem.

The only problem I have is with guys that have the attitude that they are pressing through an active MOA because it is their right to do so, damn all military operations. This is not a safe practice and will lead to a death some day. I say make them all resrticted areas or make it mandatory to get a clearance PRIOR to entering from the controlling angency.

 

[Luke's Dad]

The best solution to this whole mess is to give the Philadelphia Lawyer in the Pilatus an "incentive" ride in an F-16 ( preferrably defensive BFM). While he is puking his guts out, seeing black and gray, and doing the funky chicken, send a 172 tooling through the fight to give a little perspective.

 

[McNugget]

10 feet...nice form!

http://www.aopa.org/flightplanning/articles/2008/080707f-16.html

That was awesome...what a bunch of cry-babies! Waaah, the mean F-16 is targeting me!

 

[taz1518]

Moa

Last week I had to hold above 20K in a MOA while a twin decided to tour the airspace which resulted in a planned 1 v 1 mission above 20K when we had an original planned floor of 9K..ie..loss of training!

This is applies to most of the CIV guys throwing out spears on the MILITARY SECTION...SUCK IT! Ohhh yes I know what the next word coming out of your sucks will be..arrogance..ego...yes I do. Bottom line is, all of the fighter guys on the MILITARY POST are better than you. When I land at an FBO, I don't come up to your CIV plane jizzing all over it. Ohh yes, you're the guys that tell me you would've been a fighter pilot but....yeah, yeah..blahh.blahh.

Next time you are out flying and multiple SA-6's get shot at you, then you have to make a decision to drop weapons in close proximity of our brothers on the ground, I 'll have a beer with ya. Don't bore me with the shots you are taking at the good dudes on this post whom have worn the uniform. Some of you are such pricks that you keep throwing out "Top Gun" quotes..get over it!

After reading the last 10 pages I wasn't going to post but do you want to know something? I hate all of you!

Love, Angry Taz

 

[erj-145mech]

Last week I had to hold above 20K in a MOA while a twin decided to tour the airspace which resulted in a planned 1 v 1 mission above 20K when we had an original planned floor of 9K..ie..loss of training!
Love, Angry Taz

Whaaa....whaaa..sob, sob..that civillian made me fly at 20k...sob...sob...instead of my planned 9k...sob...sob...I hate them all...sob...sob...

Are all of the officers in your unit such crybabies?

 

[AdlerDriver]

ooookayyyyy......
That should help.

I'm getting deja vu when I visit this thread about once a week. How about we stop the madness.
Or not. I doubt this last entry is going to be left untouched. Okay, now the last two entries.

I guess it's "fights on" - again. Oh well. See you in a week.

 

[cjdriver]

Keep it coming, this is funny as he!!.

 

[CrewDawg]

This thread just keeps getting better!!!!

Back on topic, doing some low levels this week, planning my RTB from one particular route, and had to add a few hundred extra pounds of gas to my bingo. Why? Gasp, because even the military forces you to avoid MOA's and Restricted areas when they are active. What an idea, and I'm in a fairly high performance aircraft.

I'm with Luke on this one, put that guy in the pit on a defensive ride and let him see just what goes on in those MOA's.

Again, you have all the right in the world to fly through a MOA. If it's cold fly to your hearts desire, if it's hot please just talk to someone! Don't forget if he hit each other, I have a parachute to get me down, how about you?

 

[JungleJett]

Wow..this thing has grown some legs! While I am not proud to have opened this can of worms, maybe some will use some judgment when operating in an active MOA...that goes for both sides of the house.

If you do NOT exercise that judgment, some paint may get traded or worse...and the guy/gal in the chute will be able to tell his side of the story...maybe to a board looking for his wings. The civilian guy may not have the luxury of his story being told...just a bunch of posters asking why in the world someone would blast through an MOA that was active.

By the way...after having flown with TCAS for the past 9 years, I find my head in the cockpit more than it should be. Nothing takes the place of a good scan.

 

[Deuce130]

Last week I had to hold above 20K in a MOA while a twin decided to tour the airspace which resulted in a planned 1 v 1 mission above 20K when we had an original planned floor of 9K..ie..loss of training!

This is applies to most of the CIV guys throwing out spears on the MILITARY SECTION...SUCK IT! Ohhh yes I know what the next word coming out of your sucks will be..arrogance..ego...yes I do. Bottom line is, all of the fighter guys on the MILITARY POST are better than you. When I land at an FBO, I don't come up to your CIV plane jizzing all over it. Ohh yes, you're the guys that tell me you would've been a fighter pilot but....yeah, yeah..blahh.blahh.

Next time you are out flying and multiple SA-6's get shot at you, then you have to make a decision to drop weapons in close proximity of our brothers on the ground, I 'll have a beer with ya. Don't bore me with the shots you are taking at the good dudes on this post whom have worn the uniform. Some of you are such pricks that you keep throwing out "Top Gun" quotes..get over it!

After reading the last 10 pages I wasn't going to post but do you want to know something? I hate all of you!

Love, Angry Taz

This is why many civilian pilots don't like us and could not give one rat's a** for what we think.

 

[imacdog]

Taz is my hero.

 

[SIG600]

Whaaa....whaaa..sob, sob..that civillian made me fly at 20k...sob...sob...instead of my planned 9k...sob...sob...I hate them all...sob...sob...

Are all of the officers in your unit such crybabies?

Why are you still here? A 400 hour Nugget Hornet pilot has more clout in this discussion than you and your PPL.

Did you seriously list every variant of single engine Cessna you've flown in your profile? What's the difference in gross weight, like 600 lbs? (That's rhetorical... I've got more time in all of those than you.)

 

[Occam's Razor]

Flying through an active MOA is like buying your kid Superman pajamas and a bunk bed. It's perfectly legal...and doesn't actually cause your kid's broken arm...but please don't act surprised if it happens.

 

[Mamma]

This is why many civilian pilots don't like us and could not give one rat's a** for what we think.

Why do you care? If a civilian pilot wants to dislike an entire group of military pilots based on the actions of a very few then why do you care if they like you or any of us for that matter? I could care less what a person like that thinks. Anyway, I think you are wrong in regards to many civilian pilots disliking us as a whole.

 

[NuGuy]

Why do you care? If a civilian pilot wants to dislike an entire group of military pilots based on the actions of a very few then why do you care if they like you or any of us for that matter? I could care less what a person like that thinks. Anyway, I think you are wrong in regards to many civilian pilots disliking us as a whole.

Heyas,

No, but arrogant twerps just add another data point to the stereotype.

You never know when that civie person is the guy across the desk interviewing you. Today's Pilatus driver could be tomorrow's chief pilot.

Nu

 

[Mamma]

Point is, there are arrogant twerps on both sides. No reason to castigate an entire group based on the actions of a few.

 

[Bjammin]

Why do you care? If a civilian pilot wants to dislike an entire group of military pilots based on the actions of a very few then why do you care if they like you or any of us for that matter? I could care less what a person like that thinks. Anyway, I think you are wrong in regards to many civilian pilots disliking us as a whole.

Some stupid, arrogant words by one can affect the opinion of many and I care for a number of reasons:

1. I want civilian pilots to listlen when we have something important to say and respect our opinion when it comes to some points of aircraft operation.

2. I don't want new guys to get sh!t on for the actions of those that came before.

3. I want military members that come back embraced by flags and carried by six to be respected and mourned properly.

4. I don't want someone civilian with Cesena and a beef to do something stupid around a MOA or my wingman.

5. I want folks to attend airshows and buy squadron gidunk so we can get better booze for the grog.:beer:

We work for all civilians on this board and thus need to take the higher ground. We have very valid points on many flying issues, but if we don't have the respect of the folks that pay our fuel bill then we will never be heard, just shunned.