No growth at SW until 2016 now

[waveflyer]

Having worked for a legacy and southwest- I don't share that opinion.

And I also don't use legacy as a curse word. A lot of great careers and history have been made at legacies. Still available as well.
As a company we are like a legacy in the 60's-80's, just heading into our period of international expansion and still young enough to be highly influenced by the leaders who built the place.

And I 110% will take Gary over any other airline exec in this industry. Say what you will, but GK has presided over and protected our wages as te HIGHEST PAID 73 drivers, while Herb had our originals as some of the lowest with good stock options.
Different eras, but GK could've pushed and gotten something out of our contract in '09. He chose not to, and has made the hard choices to get SWA into 2014 and take us in a historic direction while taking huge criticism over a stagnate 5 year plan.

If I get frustrated with accountant leadership, that's fine- I respect him doing what he has to for all of us.
And it's a far cry from Smiskek and Parker's airlines

 

[freightdogfred]

Having worked for a legacy and southwest- I don't share that opinion.

And I also don't use legacy as a curse word. A lot of great careers and history have been made at legacies. Still available as well.
As a company we are like a legacy in the 60's-80's, just heading into our period of international expansion and still young enough to be highly influenced by the leaders who built the place.

And I 110% will take Gary over any other airline exec in this industry. Say what you will, but GK has presided over and protected our wages as te HIGHEST PAID 73 drivers, while Herb had our originals as some of the lowest with good stock options.
Different eras, but GK could've pushed and gotten something out of our contract in '09. He chose not to, and has made the hard choices to get SWA into 2014 and take us in a historic direction while taking huge criticism over a stagnate 5 year plan.

If I get frustrated with accountant leadership, that's fine- I respect him doing what he has to for all of us.
And it's a far cry from Smiskek and Parker's airlines

I agree. I've been buying a LOT of LUV stock and it's been doing quite nicely GK is making all the right moves like getting rid of that pesky 717. I'm seeing the "Game changer" showing up on more an more ramps. Even the usual suspects that post here have confirmed that SWAPA will fold like a cheap suit when the time comes so labor will not be an issue for GK. All things considered, substantial growth is inevitable.

 

[Crash Pad]

Clearly you don't fly on the Airtran side of the fence. It is common knowledge over here that SWA will be bankrupt in the coming years. Here is a short list of the reasons:
1. Single Engine Taxi: sure you do it now but not enough.
2. International: SWA can't and never will be able to fly international
3. 717s: clearly the most profitable aircraft in the history of aviation and GK just gave them away
4. Cowboy attitude: as seen in the deviation data, clearly subpar pilots and an accident waiting to happen when SWA attempts to fly international.
5. Business class: despite what you might read in the WSJ, SWA will never carry a business traveler without business class. It has never been done in the history of aviation. When a business traveler books a ticket they only look for business seats, it's science.
6. XM Radio: Without it you might as well drive.
7. Bag Fees: Without bag fees it is impossible to be a profitable airline.
8. ETOPS: SWA isn't and will never be an ETOPS carrier. It will be impossible to unlock the billions in Hawaii without ETOPS.

I could go on and on but after flying a four day it is clear that the only smart investment is shorting LUV.

Look at flagship legacies like United. SE taxi, ETOPS, Europe, Hawaii, Asia, inflight movies, arbitrated SLI, Business class, bag fees.... Clearly a better airline for your investment dollar.

 

[freightdogfred]

Clearly you don't fly on the Airtran side of the fence. It is common knowledge over here that SWA will be bankrupt in the coming years. Here is a short list of the reasons:
1. Single Engine Taxi: sure you do it now but not enough.
2. International: SWA can't and never will be able to fly international
3. 717s: clearly the most profitable aircraft in the history of aviation and GK just gave them away
4. Cowboy attitude: as seen in the deviation data, clearly subpar pilots and an accident waiting to happen when SWA attempts to fly international.
5. Business class: despite what you might read in the WSJ, SWA will never carry a business traveler without business class. It has never been done in the history of aviation. When a business traveler books a ticket they only look for business seats, it's science.
6. XM Radio: Without it you might as well drive.
7. Bag Fees: Without bag fees it is impossible to be a profitable airline.
8. ETOPS: SWA isn't and will never be an ETOPS carrier. It will be impossible to unlock the billions in Hawaii without ETOPS.

I could go on and on but after flying a four day it is clear that the only smart investment is shorting LUV.

Look at flagship legacies like United. SE taxi, ETOPS, Europe, Hawaii, Asia, inflight movies, arbitrated SLI, Business class, bag fees.... Clearly a better airline for your investment dollar.

Valid points all, but the proof is in the pudding. As long as Wall Street likes GK, Peachtree Street likes him too.

 

[madjack]

The rumors of the death of SWA have been greatly exaggerated...OBTW UAL does all these things and is LOSING money....

 

[redflyer65]

I've been buying a LOT of LUV stock and it's been doing quite nicely

I'm up 150%. How are you doing?

 

[CA1900]

I could go on and on but after flying a four day it is clear that the only smart investment is shorting LUV.

Look at flagship legacies like United. SE taxi, ETOPS, Europe, Hawaii, Asia, inflight movies, arbitrated SLI, Business class, bag fees.... Clearly a better airline for your investment dollar.

:laugh:

Well done.

 

[freightdogfred]

I'm up 150%. How are you doing?

It's doubled. I wish I'd sunk everything I had into it.

 

[jonjuan]

It's doubled. I wish I'd sunk everything I had into it.

I wish I bought more apple in 2008.

 

[FlyinGuy]

I wish I put everything in Enron like unkle Kenny was telling his employees!!

Who cares if you made a few bucks on LUV. Play the market and sometimes you win and sometimes...you know...

 

[livin'thesim]

The term "legacy" might be better used to define an airline's cost structure and it's sclerotic management practices than the length of time it existed, I mean - if we wanted to be honest with ourselves...

 

[livin'thesim]

It's doubled. I wish I'd sunk everything I had into it.

That's a dangerous mindset.

All-in has ruined more than one person. Be glad you did it the smart way. Don't regret not taking unnecessary risks.

 

[PCL_128]

Putting money in airline stock, any airline stock, is suicide.

 

[madjack]

Not in the last two years

 

[waveflyer]

Hasn't been suicide for me bc like livinthesim said, you never go all-in-

Our stock purchase plan is a pretty solid deal and worth putting some % in

 

[PCL_128]

Not in the last two years

An Enron employee would have said the same thing about his shares in his company on September 1, 2000, also. And then all hell broke loose.

Airlines are just bad businesses. And I don't just mean SWA. I think Richard Anderson is a brilliant businessman and he's done amazing work at Delta. But I wouldn't give him a dime of my money for a Delta share, because the airline business is just an awful business that will never make money over time. Never has, never will.

"The worst sort of business is one that grows rapidly, requires significant capital to engender the growth, and then earns little or no money. Think airlines. Here a durable competitive advantage has proven elusive ever since the days of the Wright Brothers. Indeed, if a farsighted capitalist had been present at Kitty Hawk, he would have done his successors a huge favor by shooting Orville down." - Warren Buffett