AAI to SWA Training Schedule

[Ty Webb]

Alright, Guys, is it just me, or are these numbers starting to look rather . . . . optimistic?

• 1200 Pilots remain on AAI side
• Training Schedule calls for 312 Pilots to be trained through Aug 27 class
• 900 Pilots to be trained from 9/1 - 12/31/2014?
• 225 a month, including 700 B717 Pilots that will need to be typed?
  

Unless the next merger is with FlightSafety, I don't see this happening.

So, this prompts the question . . . . In January 2015, there are at least 3 outcomes that could happen:

A) Park Airplanes= Forgo revenue, and Pay Pilots to sit home for months?

B) Keep 'em flying - Appease SWAPA with pay protection/seat protection for OSW CA's

C) Park the Planes and Furlough Pilots from a profitable Company?

D) Door #4 . . . . Something not yet revealed?

This could get interesting . . . . When will the Jan 2015 SWA System Schedule come out (ie flights open for booking)?

 

[GoodTimes]

I'll take option A for one thousand please, Ty.

 

[Saluki Dawg]

The Company has already stated to SWAPA that Option A is what is going to happen. SWA has no plans to operate the 717's or the AirTran brand beyond December 31, 2014.

 

[T45Flyer]

According to my union rep. the company has asked to fly the 717 past Jan 1, 2015. SWAPA said "sure, lets talk about it in the Section 6!"

Company did not like that. SWAPA knows there is no chance of a Side Letter passing no matter how good it could be due to the stalled contract negotiations.

 

[redflyer65]

Heard the company was only looking for about six more days to get thru the holiday schedule and the union wasn't interested in this flattish environment.

 

[freightdogfred]

According to my union rep. the company has asked to fly the 717 past Jan 1, 2015. SWAPA said "sure, lets talk about it in the Section 6!"

Company did not like that. SWAPA knows there is no chance of a Side Letter passing no matter how good it could be due to the stalled contract negotiations.

Cmon now. SWAPA will do as they're told, let's be realistic. For me personally, it's a win-win. Either I get the increased CA pay rate, or get paid to sit on the beach. What ever they want to do is fine with me.

Course, if they furlough me, that would really suck.

 

[redflyer65]

Cmon now. SWAPA will do as they're told, let's be realistic. For me personally, it's a win-win. Either I get the increased CA pay rate, or get paid to sit on the beach. What ever they want to do is fine with me.

Course, if they furlough me, that would really suck.

Haha. Not lately they haven't been. You'll be sitting home getting paid SW rates. I don't see any furlough on the horizon.

 

[scoreboardII]

28 per class, 112 per month, looks like 400ish get trained, leaving about 500 Jan 1, 2015. At 112 a month, it will take them through May 2015 to get everyone trained.

But they didn't see this coming, right.......

Enjoy your company paid vacation guys. SWAPA is not signing anything outside section six, the company brought this on themselves, they can dig themselves out, they want flattish, we can give them flattish.

 

[Ty Webb]

Thanks for the input . . . Kind of what I figured, unless they really. really need those planes flying.

Regds,
Ty

 

[400ADude]

I'll go with option C so the company can save some money and give I a bit more profit sharing.:bomb:

 

[Ty Webb]

Never pass up an opportunity to be an @sshole, do ya?

Must suck to be you all the time.

 

[4day]

And they are hiring!

 

[ASADFW7]

25 planes 300 still on AAI side Jan 1, 2015, to be trained after the New Year. Cheers ya'all. Just what I heard from the MCO Rep.

 

[scoreboardII]

That's one messed up plan to overnight lose 5% of your jets because you refuse to negotiate in good faith with your pilots.

I don't think furlough is in the works, to many bad iterations if it happens, but I can damn be sure we all see 5% reduced lines come May 2015. And it takes about 2 years of retirements to start upgrades again.

 

[scarlet]

They can fly them after Jan1st. Just have to paint Southwest name on the plane correct? We were awarded TBA 717. With Jan 1st pay rates B717/B737 Cpt rates and Fo rates? NO?

 

[roughneck]

They can fly them after Jan1st. Just have to paint Southwest name on the plane correct? We were awarded TBA 717. With Jan 1st pay rates B717/B737 Cpt rates and Fo rates? NO?

Does not have to be a SWA plane it just has to be flown by SWAPA pilots on the SWAPA contract.

 

[Saluki Dawg]

They can't be flown past Dec. 31, 2014 because SWA doesn't have an approved training curriculum on file with the FAA to continue operating the 717 beyond that date. So, that is why they will be parked and the Pilots sent home until Delta can take delivery of the remaining 717's.

 

[scarlet]

All the manuals say Airtran/Southwest I believe? 2 day training event in Dallas and ID# and I believe you can go right back to flying 717 with SWA 717 Cpt and 717 FO. NO?

 

[scarlet]

But bigger fish to fry...All pilots to SWAPA, Contract, 401k back to 11%, Profit sharing in a check or 401k(like United/Delta), and fix reserve, bidding and ability to drop trips, non rev system to show where we are on the list by name...

just my 2 cents...

 

[FlyinGuy]

What a genius plan. I mean thest guys are brilliant!! Over pay for an airline, piss everyone off during the SLI process, let the wheels fall off your product while you chase a imagined 15% ROIC, pay your competitor to take 2/3rds of your assets that you over paid for, delay getting your assets combined where you have to pay 300-500 employees to sit at home....whew....there is a bunch of dudes that know how to manage people, money, and run an airline!!!

 

[HowardBorden]

All the manuals say Airtran/Southwest I believe? 2 day training event in Dallas and ID# and I believe you can go right back to flying 717 with SWA 717 Cpt and 717 FO. NO?

I don't think that is a correct interpretation.

"The transition of these aircraft to Delta started in July 2013, and will continue through January 2015. At which time, any remaining aircraft are planned to be removed from revenue service until they are transitioned to Delta. Therefore, the B-717s will never be used in Southwest Airlines operations outside of the AirTran partition."

"Since the B717 will never be reconfigured, repainted, and eligible to be moved from the AirTran partition, we request this exemption be extended until February 1, 2015 when all of the B717 will have transitioned over to Delta Airlines."


http://www.regulations.gov/contentS...3e2c28&disposition=attachment&contentType=pdf

 

[scoreboardII]

All the manuals say Airtran/Southwest I believe? 2 day training event in Dallas and ID# and I believe you can go right back to flying 717 with SWA 717 Cpt and 717 FO. NO?

While your premise is correct, the FAA requires a training and safety plan. Lots of documentation and manpower overhead to staff a training and safety center for how many months, three, four? Since the company opted to NOT gain those through the FAA, the certificate for the 717's drops dead 1 Jan 2015.

 

[scoreboardII]

What a genius plan. I mean thest guys are brilliant!! Over pay for an airline, piss everyone off during the SLI process, let the wheels fall off your product while you chase a imagined 15% ROIC, pay your competitor to take 2/3rds of your assets that you over paid for, delay getting your assets combined where you have to pay 300-500 employees to sit at home....whew....there is a bunch of dudes that know how to manage people, money, and run an airline!!!

Yet through all this manage to pull a 13% ROIC and double it's stock price.

Hard to argue with success. And no, I do not consider being last place a success, that will come back to bite the ROIC.

 

[Daddy]

There will be a deal. Anyone SWA pilot here knows that the company always gets what they want. Most here will be amazed at what little SWAPA gets in exchange. Plan for small increases in retirement and pay as well as miniscule reserve improvements. There will not be "retro pay" but there will be a small "signing bonus". If you're a tranny 717 guy, I'd plan on some of you flying those planes into the spring. I don't see anyone getting paid to sit at home and do nothing. I see no furloughs. I see no senior SWA FO's getting bypass pay. This is how it goes down here....I REALLY don't see it changing much at all. Incremental changes and temporary allowances.

Don't worry about furlough. Ain't gonna happen. Don't worry about getting any huge pay/retirement increases either. Expect a deal...a somewhat disappointing one...but something everyone can live with.

 

[tankerhead]

What's the scope of the desired reserve improvements?

 

[slaquer5]

What's the scope of the desired reserve improvements?

For one , get paid per day . If you fly or to. Not over the whole month


Second. A better pass /. fly


Third. Be able to trade reserve days



There is more on the wish list.

 

[FlyinGuy]

There will be full retro and the 717 stops flying on Dec 31st.

 

[freightdogfred]

There will be full retro and the 717 stops flying on Dec 31st.

Sure there will. SWAPA will put GK in a full nelson and he will shout uncle.

not

 

[Tripower455]

There will be a deal. Anyone SWA pilot here knows that the company always gets what they want. Most here will be amazed at what little SWAPA gets in exchange. Plan for small increases in retirement and pay as well as miniscule reserve improvements. There will not be "retro pay" but there will be a small "signing bonus". If you're a tranny 717 guy, I'd plan on some of you flying those planes into the spring. I don't see anyone getting paid to sit at home and do nothing. I see no furloughs. I see no senior SWA FO's getting bypass pay. This is how it goes down here....I REALLY don't see it changing much at all. Incremental changes and temporary allowances.

Don't worry about furlough. Ain't gonna happen. Don't worry about getting any huge pay/retirement increases either. Expect a deal...a somewhat disappointing one...but something everyone can live with.

Hammer, meet nail.....

This is EXACTLY what's gonna happen.

 

[scoreboardII]

Disagree, unless you know the FAA is somehow secretly authorizing SWA to fly 717's with NO training plan.

No training plan, no training center for 717, no 717 flights, period.

717 is dead to SWA Dec 31, 2014.

Now, end game they may jump through hoops, but the expense outweighs the returns.