Unical SLI is out...

[eaglesview]

Hey TWA Dude

How can he get just a little blame???? He is/was the lead attorney...

"beyond May 2005" more speculation. How long was TWA, Mr TWA Dude, on it's last month?

 

[General Lee]

Word around the popcorn machine here at the FBO is that Citrus had Capt slots and walked from that deal.

Didn't your boss agree to arbitration in the Process Agreement if a SLI couldn't be agreed upon between unions? Do you always take the first deal offered to you? I guess everyone at AT learned that the hard way, and that doesn't promote loyalty.



Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[TWA Dude]

How can he get just a little blame???? He is/was the lead attorney...

Sorry, I didn't realize you had no understanding of what lawyers do. I'll try to keep it so simple even a USAPA apologist like you can understand. A client pays the lawyer for advice and representation. The client is free to accept or reject that advice and furthermore the lawyer is required to follow the client's legal strategy if so directed.

I don't know what went on between Katz and the CAL pilots. Maybe he told them to be more moderate and they chose not to. Even if he didn't, they should've known better.

"beyond May 2005" more speculation.

Perhaps, but extremely well-founded speculation. Speculation all analysts agreed on. Speculation just about every USAir pilot in 2005 knew but chooses to lie about now.

 

[General Lee]

Double post



Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[bluefin]

In the next 5 yrs if @#$% hits the fan and the company has to furlough, it will be all the UAL guys again before a single CAL pilot will be furloughed. So as the bottom guy being a CAL dude, he basically has over 1,000 people below him for job security!!! I think that is a serious windfall for the CAL guys. It's just a matter of time till furlough #3 happens for us twice furloughed, forever $%^&#@ pilots. It was even offered by ALPA!!!

 

[Turtle21]

Is this thread about UAL CAL? WTF are other airlines taking a dump in here?

 

[eaglesview]

Sorry, I didn't realize you had no understanding of what lawyers do. I'll try to keep it so simple even a USAPA apologist like you can understand. A client pays the lawyer for advice and representation. The client is free to accept or reject that advice and furthermore the lawyer is required to follow the client's legal strategy if so directed.

I don't know what went on between Katz and the CAL pilots. Maybe he told them to be more moderate and they chose not to. Even if he didn't, they should've known better.Perhaps, but extremely well-founded speculation. Speculation all analysts agreed on. Speculation just about every USAir pilot in 2005 knew but chooses to lie about now.

Whatever.....I don't agree but also don't care. Good luck over there. I am glad ours is finished so we can move on.

 

[SimHo]

Every CAL pilot who feels they got screwed (as most of us do) needs to file a dispute.

 

[eaglesview]

Good luck with that.

 

[redflyer65]

Funny isnt it - You sound exactly like the CAL and UAL pilots that spent a year arguing over the superiority of their respective airline. We can now see exactly what the result was. Even after this lesson you continue to do the same thing. The difference between you and them is this; neither you, nor your union had the integrity to use the arbitration process.

Even after this lesson in humility versus hubris, you continue to puff yourself up like a lizard and repeat the same tired hyperbole. Are you really that much of a fool, that even with this arbitration, you still can't see the forest ?

I sound like CAL and UAL pilots? I'm not knowledgeable enough about their situations. On the surface, I'd say they had similar career expectations like NW/DAL. That wasn't the case with AAI and SW. Sorry, but those are just the objective facts. It never was a merger of equals....from any metric.

Arbitration? I was ready for it. I voted No Dicko. Now it's over, except when d-bags like the General (who has some bizarre obsession with it) and PCL128 decide to pontificate on what SHOULD HAVE HAPPENED. The arby arguments would have been interesting. The only thing you guys had to give was seniority to a company that was five times larger. The career earnings/stability/expectations between the two companies was stark.

I will apologize for posting this on a UCAL thread. I've been trying to not post on here and this will be the last one.

Good luck UCAL guys.

 

[bladeusa]

"In our considered judgment, both the methodology of the CAL Committee and its
resultant proposed ISL are incompatible with the revised ALPA Merger Policy. Aside
from the windfall inequities generated by using an April 1, 2013 snapshot date, total
disregard of the longevity factor cannot possibly be justified in the factual circumstances
of this case. Not surprisingly, the ISL produced by the CAL Committee's fatally defective
methodology is neither fair nor equitable."

 

[bladeusa]

trying to use a 2013 date instead of the 2010 merger date gave the cal side unrealistic expectations. if another pilot group in future hires Katz id be dumbfounded.

 

[nimtz]

trying to use a 2013 date instead of the 2010 merger date gave the cal side unrealistic expectations. if another pilot group in future hires Katz id be dumbfounded.

I agree. He's a complete utter ROD.

 

[GoodTimes]

What other pilot groups has Katz worked with?

 

[bravodude]

Do they talk about the decade of being forced to the bottom of the Captain list, until every SWA F.O. that is below you upgrades to seniority ahead of you ? The decade of being the junior Captain at every base in the system ? The loss of 35% seniority in exchange for the privilege of keeping the same seat ?

Too complicated for popcorn machine talk perhaps.

whats complicated is the loss of all of your 717's and getting any SWA pilot to vote yes on an SLI had we known that those airframes were going bye bye!

 

[eaglesview]

What other pilot groups has Katz worked with?

USAir east.

 

[Flyer1015]

Nope, the General was right, as usual. A reasonable list was constructed using a combination of longevity and category and status, with an emphasis on category and status. You know, exactly the kind of award that scared you and the rest of SWAPA to death of arbitration.

Why didn't binding arbitration happen at Airtran? What magical powers did SWAPA have to force an agreement prior to binding arbitration?

 

[PCL_128]

This stuff really gives your self proclaimed expertise a hard on doesnt it? Must really piss you off to not be part of your beloved ALPA-

Miss it? Don't you always go around claiming that I'm some sort of ALPA national bigwig? Which is it, wavey? Can't be both.

I could say you've never argued longevity had a place in our SLI-

Actually, I argued that the list would probably come out somewhere between DOH and relative, with a bias towards relative, which is exactly what happened in the UAL/CAL case.

 

[canyonblue]

Actually, I argued that the list would probably come out somewhere between DOH and relative, with a bias towards relative, which is exactly what happened in the UAL/CAL case.

Yeah, right! :laugh:

 

[densoo]

In the next 5 yrs if @#$% hits the fan and the company has to furlough, it will be all the UAL guys again before a single CAL pilot will be furloughed. So as the bottom guy being a CAL dude, he basically has over 1,000 people below him for job security!!! I think that is a serious windfall for the CAL guys. It's just a matter of time till furlough #3 happens for us twice furloughed, forever $%^&#@ pilots. It was even offered by ALPA!!!

The @#$% doesn't even have to hit the fan. 250 70-seaters is a lot of seats 66% gave them to use. LCAL management doesn't grow an airline, it leans it down bit by bit. At least now it's called a holding company, not an airline. Look for less than 10,000 pilots in less than 5 years, down from the current 12,155.